Naughty Dog interview - sharing code and best practice. *spawned
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upnorthsox
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I would too!
Here's the full article. Pretty good read (spoilers)
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/4191/reflecting_on_uncharted_2_how_.php
Also, nothing new but an interesting bit nonetheless:
"We re-wrote almost our entire graphics engine... the first game was entirely on the GPU, and in this one, we were able to spread it out,"
Here's the full article. Pretty good read (spoilers)
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/4191/reflecting_on_uncharted_2_how_.php
Also, nothing new but an interesting bit nonetheless:
"We re-wrote almost our entire graphics engine... the first game was entirely on the GPU, and in this one, we were able to spread it out,"
Of course, they won't be open world.
They make tools that other PS3 first-party devs use, just because Uncharted 2 isn't open-world doesn't mean other devs can't use the Edge Tools to build an open-world game, overall there has been a huge step-up when one compares earlier first-party PS3 games with the stuff coming out now, even Infamous looks fantastic for an open-world game. Both tech-wise and art-wise Naughty Dog is clearly leading the way on the PS3 platform, with arguably the best game this console generation.
They make tools that other PS3 first-party devs use, just because Uncharted 2 isn't open-world doesn't mean other devs can't use the Edge Tools to build an open-world game, overall there has been a huge step-up when one compares earlier first-party PS3 games with the stuff coming out now, even Infamous looks fantastic for an open-world game. Both tech-wise and art-wise Naughty Dog is clearly leading the way on the PS3 platform, with arguably the best game this console generation.
Your extrapolating a lot of conclusions from thin air.
Uncharted looks as good as it does, MAINLY because its linear and heavily scripted. They are in full control of everything, and can make sure that the load on the gpu\cpu is never gonna get to high.
Once you upen things up, and create a unlinear open world game, then all hell breaks lose. Its a completely different scheme. Just because their engine works well with heavily linearly scripting, doesn't mean it will work well in an open world setting. In fact, most likely it will not work well at all.
Further, i did not find U2 all that technically brilliant compared to say, KZ2. U2 looks so freaking incredible, mostly because of great art. Not because of super duper technical brilliance like KZ2.
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Or you could say that U2 looks so incredible because of the great art, but KZ2 looks dull, unispiring and blurry because of the focus on super duper technical brilliance over competent art.
Yes. But that still makes the case that U2 is not particularly amazing from a technical standpoint.
How much of both games have you actually played?
What isn't Uncharted 2 doing from a "technical standpoint" other than being an open-world game?
Highly detailed character models? Checked.
HDR lighting? Checked.
SSAO? Checked.
Self-shadowing? Checked.
Highly detailed textures? Checked.
Water that reflects/refracts/ripples? Checked.
Convincing weather effects? Checked.
Rain/Snow? Checked.
Animation blending? Checked.
Great enemy AI? Checked.
All of those ARE being done even on the larger MP maps. And even with the linear progression, the SP campaign has plenty of large, complex environments for the player to fight enemies and to explore, it's far from a God of War-style fixed camera corridor movie set.
Far geometry that are properly collision mapped? Checked. You shoot a missile pod off a helicopter, if it lands on the roof across the map, YOU CAN FIND IT, YOU CAN EVEN STAND ON TOP OF IT. The roof is completely and properly collision-mapped, so are the missile pods. There's a lot of real interactive geometry in Uncharted 2, it's not all smoke-and-mirrors as you're trying to imply.
Mod : Removed "open world" debate
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Then why don't more games look like Uncharted 2? If it isn't technically demanding, why is it all alone? I can think of a lot of 3rd person and 1st person games that are all similarly linear, but don't look as good. Are you going to say it's all art and they are all technically equal?
...please.
The U2 open world engine discussion is here for anyone wanting to revist that. The scalability of the U2 engine is an independent argument to this one of Ostepop's, that U2 isn't technically impressive...
Surely the only reason U2 looks as good as it does is because ND have used the hardware so effectively, running lots of graphical systems as listed by Kittonwy across SPUs and GPU. I'm surprised anyone can look at one of the best looking titles of this generation with it's effective consumption of SPU cycles and say it's not a technical accomplishment, as if the only thing any develop needs to top the visual league-table is a better artist! Artists create models, textures and overall visual style. Getting all that on screen being lit, shaded, shadowed, animated and post-processed requires an engine, and an engine that can manage all that to a high quality is a "technical achievement", no?
That's quite a statement! "U2 isn't doing anything special, just they have nice artists."
Surely the only reason U2 looks as good as it does is because ND have used the hardware so effectively, running lots of graphical systems as listed by Kittonwy across SPUs and GPU. I'm surprised anyone can look at one of the best looking titles of this generation with it's effective consumption of SPU cycles and say it's not a technical accomplishment, as if the only thing any develop needs to top the visual league-table is a better artist! Artists create models, textures and overall visual style. Getting all that on screen being lit, shaded, shadowed, animated and post-processed requires an engine, and an engine that can manage all that to a high quality is a "technical achievement", no?Thanks for taking my comments out of context shifty.
My whole point was that U2 is NOT PARTICULARLY AMAZING TECHNICALLY COMPARED TO SAY, KZ2.
Relativism.
My whole point was that U2 is NOT PARTICULARLY AMAZING TECHNICALLY COMPARED TO SAY, KZ2.
Relativism.
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If I've misinterpreted your intentions, I put that down to poor phrasing on your part.
Let's just review the topic that people have read...
You may not have meant that to read "U2 isn't doing much that's technically clever, instead just using standard techniques to good effect that everyone else uses," but that's how some people are reading it, because that's how it's worded.
If you didn't mean "U2 wasn't technically impressive" then you shouldn't have said as much, or at least, should have given recognition to what ND have accomplished as you present that case that U2 achieved a balance whereas Guerilla achieved impressiveness through sheer engine brilliance. Which is unquantifiable anyhow. How are you measuring technical brilliance, such that KZ2 is technically more impressive than U2 by a significant margin?
U2 only looks as good as it does because the technology driving the engine has enabled the artists to carefully craft a beautiful game. This is why precious few games this gen have comparable visuals, whether they are vast open world titless or carefully managed linear experiences. If they can share there code and methods with other developers, it should result in better technology all round, with better utilisation of the PS3 resulting in better looking games.
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This isn't a versus discussion. The topic is what ND's tech will bring to other developers and titles, and further Sony 1st party tech developments.
Thanks for taking my comments out of context shifty.
My whole point was that U2 is NOT PARTICULARLY AMAZING TECHNICALLY COMPARED TO SAY, KZ2.
Relativism.
It isn't really exact. The shaders in U2 are incredible and it isn't simple art design. The physics of the water and the transparancies reflex combined, really in U2 there is more tecnologies we can to perceive. And we don't mentioned the good use of streaming reading data in the br, kz2 is full of terrible lag at any checkpoint, u2 never.
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What water physics? You mean the dynamic ripples?
That is a shader effect present in several games some of those being Morrowind/Oblivion.
Yes , the same shaders effect I mean really we found the shaders waters effect of u2 so ordinay in the games? I have seen a lot of impressive games on both console, never seen something of similar. imho.
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