Do you play using W,A,S,D, or do you use the arrow keys Up, Down, Left and Right?

[milk]

I would never have imagined that many people have ergonomical issues with WASD. I used to play with the directional keys too, specially as I already had some mussle memory with them for other computer operations using them such as navigating menus or the typing cursor.

The first time I saw a game that had WASD as standard, I thought it was a weird choice, and the asymetrical position did bother my OCD at first. I also had to re-learn the natural agility of controling movement with the left hand.

But I also though, Huh, that way my hand is right next to numbers, shift, space, alt, Q, E, F.... I get it. Worthy tradoff. And eventually I was accutumed to it and it never bothered me again.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

WASD is the absolute worst way to control with a keyboard. OK, nm, cursor keys would be even worse.

I use RDFG but ESDF would work as well.

RDFG is more comfortable for me due to a pinkey finger that I broke 40 years ago that the doctors didn't set quite right. It also has the huge benefit of giving you far more keys to configure that are easily reachable.

ESDF is good also as it would allow your hand to sit on the home row if you are a touch typist. And it still allows for a decently expanded number of keys that you can configure in game.

WASD? Hate it, why oh why did Carmack and crew back at iD decide that WASD is what should be used, and then the rest of the industry just followed along like sheep. Grrrrr.

Regards,
SB

 

[digitalwanderer]

I've tried using RDFG and ESDF, but my fingers "get lost" from their home position too much. WASD I can check my placement by my pinky on control and shift. Getting older I've lost a lot of sensitivity in my fingers so typing and gaming is slowly becoming awful for me, it's a wee bit sad.

 

[Cyan]

Btw how to use arrow keys while using mouse on right hand?

Keyboard moved to far left?

if your keyboard has a numpad, INS, DEL, Start, End, Prev Page, Next Page, etc, you don't have too, a good 40% of the keyboard is not far from the position you'd use when typing something.

I would never have imagined that many people have ergonomical issues with WASD. I used to play with the directional keys too, specially as I already had some mussle memory with them for other computer operations using them such as navigating menus or the typing cursor.

The first time I saw a game that had WASD as standard, I thought it was a weird choice, and the asymetrical position did bother my OCD at first. I also had to re-learn the natural agility of controling movement with the left hand.

But I also though, Huh, that way my hand is right next to numbers, shift, space, alt, Q, E, F.... I get it. Worthy tradoff. And eventually I was accutumed to it and it never bothered me again.

you people that can place your fingers, the same ones you use on WASD, to keys that are far from the WASD position don't realise how good you are at controlling where your fingers are. I studied typing just like any other subject for 5 years during my studies and I know how to place each finger to write as efficiently as possible (very rigid but super functional), yet if I move a finger from a WASD key to say a function key or a number, it's easy for me to get lost when trying to return the finger to the position where it should be.

I had no issue with that when playing Age of Empires 2 at a very competitive level, 'cos you don't need to use WASD and you move your fingers to arbitrary positions based on what you want to do. Maybe the rigidness of typing, where there are two keys -F an J- with a little mark telling where to place your index finger had something to do with it, but I got used to that and I am horrible once I get more than one finger out of position.

 

[Cyan]

WASD is the absolute worst way to control with a keyboard. OK, nm, cursor keys would be even worse.

I use RDFG but ESDF would work as well.

RDFG is more comfortable for me due to a pinkey finger that I broke 40 years ago that the doctors didn't set quite right. It also has the huge benefit of giving you far more keys to configure that are easily reachable.

ESDF is good also as it would allow your hand to sit on the home row if you are a touch typist. And it still allows for a decently expanded number of keys that you can configure in game.

WASD? Hate it, why oh why did Carmack and crew back at iD decide that WASD is what should be used, and then the rest of the industry just followed along like sheep. Grrrrr.

Regards,
SB

that's also pretty unique if you ask me. If I understood you correctly, your "run" key is the S key, for instance? One of the issues I have with WASD is that my pinky finger gets out of position so easily and that the Shift Lock key is big and I get it mixed up with the left Shift key, specially when usually the Right Shift key is larger than the left one, which makes you believe that the left shift is also large. Also the left Ctrl key is just way down for me to feel comfortable and usually unthinking response to that is that I move the ringing finger and the other finger -the middle one, dunno what it's called- out of position .

This just exacerbates the problem that I have with using WASD keys.

I've tried using RDFG and ESDF, but my fingers "get lost" from their home position too much. WASD I can check my placement by my pinky on control and shift. Getting older I've lost a lot of sensitivity in my fingers so typing and gaming is slowly becoming awful for me, it's a wee bit sad.

losing some sensibility in your fingers is a pita. Maybe arrow keys would work better for you, 'cos your fingers aren't surrounded by keys.

To give you an example, I have two mechanical keyboard, both with blue switches. I use the directional keys instead of WASD on each one.

One of them is my favourite mechanical keyboard, perhaps the best kb I've had to date. However it doesn't have a numpad to save some space. I don't use it for gaming, but it has an excellent feature, which is that it can turn the WASD keys into directional keys with a simple key press. That's an awesome feature 'cos you don't need to fiddle with remapping the WASD keys to arrows.

That keyboard is the Mars Gaming MKCLOUD -I have the black one-.

For you, perhaps, I think a similar keyboard to the other one I have, which I use for gaming most of the time, might be a better fit. It's also a mechanical keyboard -blue switches-, the Newskill Serike.

It's a very traditional QWERTY keyboard with all the keys and form factor from classic keyboards, if you place your left hand on the directional keys, imho, the fact that the keys are distributed in a way where not every single key is surrounded by many other keys, could be helpful to play in a comfortable way. Also a mouse with 10 or more buttons could help, 'cos it could complement the keyboard very well. Logited 604 Lightspeed and Sharkoon Drakonia are the ones I have and know the most but you could find something that feels better for you.

 

[digitalwanderer]

I'd unfortunately splurged on a Corsair K70 mk.2 low profile with cherry reds to use for speedy typing, sort of kicking myself because low profile makes it harder to tell key edges and the lack of tactile feedback for if the switch has been pressed far enough to register has sort of made things a bit more difficult.

 

[orangpelupa]

if your keyboard has a numpad, INS, DEL, Start, End, Prev Page, Next Page, etc, you don't have too, a good 40% of the keyboard is not far from the position you'd use when typing something.

So left hand is very close to right hand?

As nimpad kyes are even closer to mouse on right hand

 

[Silent_Buddha]

that's also pretty unique if you ask me. If I understood you correctly, your "run" key is the S key, for instance? One of the issues I have with WASD is that my pinky finger gets out of position so easily and that the Shift Lock key is big and I get it mixed up with the left Shift key, specially when usually the Right Shift key is larger than the left one, which makes you believe that the left shift is also large. Also the left Ctrl key is just way down for me to feel comfortable and usually unthinking response to that is that I move the ringing finger and the other finger -the middle one, dunno what it's called- out of position .

When using RDFG, the S key is usually for use/activate. I still use shift for the "run" key.

There's a whole grouping of keys I can easily press with my pinky finger without taking my other fingers off of RDFG while in combat.

Regards,
SB

 

[Davros]

I use WSQE it allows me to keep my fingers straight

 

[arandomguy]

I am not sure that device would work for me, maybe it would, I never tried tbh, but after spending money on mechanical keyboards and mouses for gaming, I don't feel like trying, just in case it's not my thing -happened to me with certain mouses-. The Logitech 604 Lightspeed is one hell of a mouse btw, quite valid for overall gaming and MOBAs alike. So is the Sharkoon Drakonia.

Besides that, the Logitech 604 got the advantage of having Logitech G HUB, where you can transform those 15 buttons into 28 buttons. I really like it tbh, my favourite mouse.

As for QCF games, I could never play Street Fighter 2 with a gamepad and performing a ha-dou-ken, until my best childhood friend, who was always a console gamer -he purchased a gaming laptop a year ago though-, taught me how to "draw" a semi-moon with my thumb.

The guy of the photo.... has to be unique. I've never seen anything like that, to each its own.

The reason for the keyboard like that is that some competitive players (player pictured is a pro CSGO player) started to tilt their keyboards (keep in mind TKL and etc. boards were not really a thing in the market) to create more space for mouse movement, as competitively (especially in games like Counter-Strike) very low sens arm movement is the norm. Going completely vertical in the case with that pro player is the way extreme of that. But in all it was just a picture to illustrate how much of this has to do with ingrained muscle memory and being used to something. Notice how he's playing black bars at 4:3 as well.

Realistically I'm guessing if you were forced to play with WASD you'd be able to eventually do it, certainly at a level needed for SP gaming. Just like I "mastered" aiming with thumbsticks enough to get through some PS3 exclusives (eg. The Last of Us). Realistically it's going to be very rare that someone is actually unable to do so due to actual biomechanical limitations. The brain ultimately is rather malleable, but we by convivence just often like to stick with what we know. You'll also have to deal with getting a lot worse and frustrations for some time.

The Razer Orbweaver suggestion was that because the keys lineup straight, I believe that was one of your complaints about WASD. The trick is to just buy from somewhere like Amazon where you can return for "product is incompatible" if it doesn't work out.

 

[Cyan]

So left hand is very close to right hand?

As nimpad kyes are even closer to mouse on right hand

not at all, the left hand is on the keyboard while the right hand is on the mouse. If you have enough buttons on the mouse or something like Logitech G HUB that turn 15 buttons on your mouse, for instance, into 28, your left hand rests on the right side of the keyboard.

(this is how it works, the video starts playing at that exact moment)

I'd unfortunately splurged on a Corsair K70 mk.2 low profile with cherry reds to use for speedy typing, sort of kicking myself because low profile makes it harder to tell key edges and the lack of tactile feedback for if the switch has been pressed far enough to register has sort of made things a bit more difficult.

View attachment 7640

that keyboard must be a high quality device, judging by the looks of it and the price. Perhaps the same or a similar model but with the blue switch would do fine for you.

 

[Cyan]

I use WSQE it allows me to keep my fingers straight

one surprise after the other. I found this video, as to why most players use WASD. It was the person considered the first professional gamer ever, some guy called Dennis Fong.

It was due to the popularity of Quake, and ultimately Id defaulted it as @Silent_Buddha already mentioned. Still, I think some of the assumptions of the video as to why WASD is preferrable are wrong to me.

That being said they explain that RDFG or ESDF would be equally valid, which sound okay to me and it's something that @Silent_Buddha detailed in a previous post.

 

[Cyan]

The reason for the keyboard like that is that some competitive players (player pictured is a pro CSGO player) started to tilt their keyboards (keep in mind TKL and etc. boards were not really a thing in the market) to create more space for mouse movement, as competitively (especially in games like Counter-Strike) very low sens arm movement is the norm. Going completely vertical in the case with that pro player is the way extreme of that. But in all it was just a picture to illustrate how much of this has to do with ingrained muscle memory and being used to something. Notice how he's playing black bars at 4:3 as well.

Realistically I'm guessing if you were forced to play with WASD you'd be able to eventually do it, certainly at a level needed for SP gaming. Just like I "mastered" aiming with thumbsticks enough to get through some PS3 exclusives (eg. The Last of Us). Realistically it's going to be very rare that someone is actually unable to do so due to actual biomechanical limitations. The brain ultimately is rather malleable, but we by convivence just often like to stick with what we know. You'll also have to deal with getting a lot worse and frustrations for some time.

The Razer Orbweaver suggestion was that because the keys lineup straight, I believe that was one of your complaints about WASD. The trick is to just buy from somewhere like Amazon where you can return for "product is incompatible" if it doesn't work out.

ingrained muscle memory can be a punishment rather than a blessing. I got used to arrow keys from a very young age, and trust me that I am open to try different mice -the Logitech 604 Lightspeed and the Sharkonia Drakoon are totally different yet I use both but I tend to stick to the Logitech 604-, different keyboards (I have a Logitech one with a touchpad, the aforementioned MKCLOUD and Newskill Serike ones, and a few others that I don't use nowadays), etc etc.

But in the end you tend to stick to your comfort zone. When I purchased my first console in early 2005, the original Xbox, it came bundled with Halo 2 and for the life of me I couldn't get used to what I considered clumsy and imprecise controls. In the end I was forced to learn how to use it, and it is like second nature for me, although if I could I'd never use a gamepad to play games.

This happens on reverse. I still remember my best childhood friend's expression when he was watching me playing FPS games without a gamepad but kb/m instead... He had this unforgettable wide-eyed look in his face as if he was saying "this guy is nuts, playing games with a kb/m, that's impossible to achieve". I think I will never forget that look in his face, it was almost comical.

He asked me "And how do you move?". The Up arrow key and turning around with the mouse is one of the greatest inventions.

In the end, the guy in this video could be me, I use arrow keys for the same reason than him, it's how he used to play at a very young age.

 

[digitalwanderer]

not at all, the left hand is on the keyboard while the right hand is on the mouse. If you have enough buttons on the mouse or something like Logitech G HUB that turn 15 buttons on your mouse, for instance, into 28, your left hand rests on the right side of the keyboard.

(this is how it works, the video starts playing at that exact moment)

that keyboard must be a high quality device, judging by the looks of it and the price. Perhaps the same or a similar model but with the blue switch would do fine for you.

It's very, very nice but don't be fooled. I picked it up on sale for $59us.

 

[milk]

I had to retrain my use of the analogue stick for gamepads too.

The first 3D game that I played was Super Mario 64, and then other N64 games. There, the standard (and non configurable) mode of vertical camera look is what we now call "inverted". That became ingrained in me as the most natural way of using the controler.

Then, when twin-stick controls popularized, un-inverted also became the standard, and after getting tired of always having to switch those control settings, I forced myself to get used to un-inverted vertical look. I think it took half of a playthrough of the campaign of whatever game it was that I made the switch with for me to adapt, but surely, it happened, and now my life is easier that way.

 

[MistaPi]

I remember Terminator Future Shock used A, Z, left shift and x as default and I kinda got stuck with that.

 

[Cyan]

I remember Terminator Future Shock used A, Z, left shift and x as default and I kinda got stuck with that.

what about the < key? It's placed in between the Z and left shift on my keyboard.

You probably played that game for thousands of hours, to make that the default for you over time.

Had never heard of that game til now, but kudos to the developers that broke the mold.

 

[MistaPi]

what about the < key? It's placed in between the Z and left shift on my keyboard.

You probably played that game for thousands of hours, to make that the default for you over time.

Had never heard of that game til now, but kudos to the developers that broke the mold.

I never use the < key. S for jump, D duck, Alt key for run, space key for "use/open". Q and W for lean left and right.

I really liked the game and the sequel Terminator Skynet, it had fun MP too, but it wasn't thousands of hours. I just got used to it enough that WASD didn't feel right to me I guess.

 

[Davros]

IIRC you could run Future Shock through Terminator Skynet

Controls


I used to use one of these a Zboard Merc

 

[hoom]

,aoe (or is it <AOE ?)
I use Dvorak so thats the WASD position.

I can see how RDFG or ESDF are arguably better but I have used the WASD position since forever.
I played with arrows for Wolfenstein & DukeNukem3D but was definitely on to WASD with Unreal.