Digital Foundry and console warriors alternate realities *spawn*

Discussion in 'Console Industry' started by Cyan, May 23, 2015.

  1. Cyan

    Cyan orange
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    Deep down you may be right, but the outcomes sometimes, just sometimes, aren't as squat as they appear to be, simply because there will be someone who will mock you or create threads to talk bad about your console or whatever. Beyond3D is a different place, but you might not want to see what's out there. Certain things that you mention will always exist, and have nothing to do with any kind of engagement
     
  2. Shifty Geezer

    Shifty Geezer uber-Troll!
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    The solution to that is to rise above it.
     
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  3. Cyan

    Cyan orange
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    Fair enough. I don't know Arwin, it's just that it wouldn't be the first time Digital Foundry has admitted to botching certain captures. I pointed out at one issue they didn't see -don't blame them in this case though, just sayin'- in the PC version of FC4, like the black crush. IT wasn't easy to spot because some captures were just perfect but others were wrong because of said black crush.

    The thing is that all eyes are on their articles, and their wording show bias at times, this quote:

    It wouldn't cost them much to add this line (although the game almost always runs over 30 fps on the X1 version during actual gameplay, cutscenes are more inconsistent), it seemed as if they wanted to paint the X1 version in a bad light and their line "the Xbox One suffers from running at 900p" is also a bit unfair, because like 99% of the people playing the game on the X1 are enjoying this fantastic game. I don't want to read much into their words --if not Shifty will blame that on strong emotional ties, his usual predicament. :)

    Anyways, kudos to you.
     
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  4. Shifty Geezer

    Shifty Geezer uber-Troll!
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    That's what the body of the article says. It describes the pros and cons of both platforms.

    Also, full analysis with the expected recommendation - buy PC! for me, DF head-to-heads always favoured PC and then, last gen, 360 by and large. Now it's Sony's console which surprise surprise has the meatier GPU. There's no partisanship at DF. It's highly obvious and predictable results only of interest because different platforms sometimes get different choices and even rendering techniques.

    Oh, and in the comments sections of DF articles there's always someone complaining of pro-MS attitudes at DF, and then others complaining of Sony favouritism, depending on the article. Pure console-warsery.
     
    #24 Shifty Geezer, May 26, 2015
    Last edited: May 26, 2015
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  5. goonergaz

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    Yeah, let's be honest - the PS4 has had some comfortable wins yet they have said at the end that the XBO version is perfectly playable and fine - so it's not like they are kicking MS/XB.

    @Cyan all things being equal the PS4 version will be the better version - this much must be true, the framerate 'win' for XBO is marginal but the pixel 'win' for PS4 is substantial, to put it into a football context XBO 1 PS4 2. Last gen (for me) free online play was an important factor and something DF didn't even consider in a face-off.

    Edit - also @Cyan NX gamer agrees the PS4 performs better due to the lock.
     
    #25 goonergaz, May 26, 2015
    Last edited: May 26, 2015
  6. Lalaland

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    Damn that was several pages of exactly this, I'm honestly starting to think the main graph in DF would better off being the frame time graph not the always misleading Avg.FPS. Been playing this on my now min. spec PC (2500k/7870/8GB) and the stutteriness is making me hanker after that DX12 goodness to at least try and edge my PC towards the smoother PS4 delivery :(
     
  7. pjbliverpool

    pjbliverpool B3D Scallywag
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    It wouldn't make any difference since the game isn't remotely CPU limited so the 2500k is more than enough for completely smooth frame rates (proven by DF's frame time graph running on an i3).

    If the game is stuttering on your PC it's more likely a GPU issue born out of running at too high settings. DF's article shows that a solid 30fps (as solid as the PS4 at least) is possible on a 750Ti at consoles settings and a 7870 is a fair bit faster in this game at similar settings:

    [​IMG]

    I'd recommend matching the consoles settings as below, then running the game with CCC vsync on rather than the in game setting in combination with a 30fps frame lock through RTSS. I think you'll be looking at a completely perfect 33.33ms frame time on every frame and may even be able to turn a few settings up and still hit that.

    V-Sync: On
    Resolution: 1920x1080
    Nvidia Hairworks: Off
    Number of Background Characters: Low (console actually seems lower than this)
    Shadow Quality: Medium
    Terrain Quality: Medium
    Water Quality: High
    Grass Density: Medium
    Texture Quality: Ultra
    Foliage Visibility Range: Medium
    Detail Level: Medium
    Ambient Occlusion: SSAO
    All post effects on except vignetting.
     
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  8. Cyan

    Cyan orange
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    Yes, PS4 did. XBO is improving every day, if you compare the first CoD at 720p and the second at something like 1080p..., now the XB1 version is the one with the better framerate. BF4 was great on the PS4 and bad on the XBO, but now Hardline performs better on the X1, and Unity too. Most games are catered to the PS4 architecture, simply because of raw power. If only DF gave more credit to more platforms...

    In their most recent article they wrote that now Borderlands runs at an almost perfect 1080p and 60 fps on the "PS4 and Xbox One", literally. The "and" was highlighted in italics, as if saying, "the game can run at 1080p 60 fps on the X1 too, can you believe it?". They are doubting the graphical capabilities of the consoles.

    Still to me their most controversial article to date was the one they wrote about Mario Kart 8 for the WiiU, where they pinned down the framerate of the console. I mean the now legendary to me, the 59 fps thing. :huh:

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-vs-mario-kart-8

    For your money that issue is an irrelevance, and irrational.

    Plus, there are other flaws in their articles. They talk about budget PCs trying to compare them with consoles, performance wise. Okay, that's neat, but the problem is that those PCs don't run games like consoles and are like 300€ more expensive.

    They have a PC with a Intel i3 processor as the CPU for their *budget* PC, and those PCs usually cost around 600€. Why is the i3 PC a budget PC when an Intel G3220 CPU would be a much fairer comparison and a PC with that CPU could realistically cost what new gen consoles cost now?
     
  9. temesgen

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    Were you concerned in the previous generation when the 360 was getting the nod?

    As was already pointed out, DF has always been accused of bias its just that now Xbox is the platform receiving greater scrutiny.
     
  10. pjbliverpool

    pjbliverpool B3D Scallywag
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    Except DF post comparison video's complete with frame rate and frame time graphs showing that they do.

    They never tried to claim that the budget PC was as cheap as console and €600 is "budget" by PC standards.
     
  11. Cyan

    Cyan orange
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    :smile2::D Let me tell you temesgen that the pc is getting the nod in their articles now. Still, the console version, like most console versions, is like the pc version, but seven times better in every conceivable way #consolegamingmasterrace
     
  12. pjbliverpool

    pjbliverpool B3D Scallywag
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    I think you'll find it's 7.23x to be exact. You should be more accurate next time!
     
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  13. HTupolev

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    Why wouldn't they? The paper specs suggest that the PS4 has greater graphical capability, developers have suggested that the PS4 is more capable, and comparisons between games tend to indicate that it has greater GPU throughput. So if the XB1 manages to keep up, it's an interesting result and emphasis is appropriate.

    It's a patterned stutter on even interval. Many won't be bothered, but it'll grind some people's gears. It's not like they were overly harsh on it; they flat-out said that it wouldn't impact playability and that a majority of players wouldn't even notice it. They gave it a lengthy discussion because it was an interesting quirk.
     
  14. temesgen

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    Some might point to the call for the PC as evidence of PlayStation hate, there were a decent number of gamers who gleefully awaited DF face offs who now say if power matters buy a PC.

    Personally I don't care, last generation 360 was arguably better about half the time, equal about 25% and the PS3 for the remainder.

    Unless you owned both the differences however were small and didn't impact gameplay.

    Things might play out similarly this time and again I'm not sure it matters that much.
     
  15. Cyan

    Cyan orange
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    Well, I just hope they use dynamic resolution more, it's a fun tech f you use to preserve the framerate at all costs.
    If they make comparisons, you must keep things objective.

    They wrote an article, whose link I don't have, time ago on how to build a budget PC with the performance of consoles (is it said pc the one they are using for their comparisons? it isn't...), at a similar price and in this era of austerity I haven't seen in any of their articles a truly budget pc that can come close to consoles performance
     
  16. forumaccount

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    The only reason you'd unlock the framerate is because it misses vsync more often than you want and it's the only way to have a decent average framerate. Unsure why anyone would praise them for an unlocked game, last gen people would cry murder if they ever saw tearing.

    These last pages read like total fanboy desperation to latch on to something/anything indicating that Xbox One is "better". It's not, the GPU is straight up inferior. Doesn't make Xbone a bad purchase or anything like that, but it's going to have inferior version after inferior version for the entire console generation so maybe get used to DF pointing out reality.
     
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  17. chris1515

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    It is not a bad console. Only hardware where you can play Halo 5 and Forza 6 end of 2015 ans Quantum Break first semester 2016...
     
  18. MrFox

    MrFox Deludedly Fantastic
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    Finally I feel like E3 is just around the corner... such passion !!
     
  19. Rangers

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  20. Cyan

    Cyan orange
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    They can. But they'd like to be objective. I mean objectivity towards XB1 instalment, abiding by the facts rather than hinting at a surprise tone because a game can run 1080p 60fps.
    You're trying to be kind to them, okay, but their article says "Mario Kart 8 effectively operates at 59fps with a subtle but continuous stutter visible on-screen." In huge letters. That's very controversial.

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-vs-mario-kart-8

    Their new Mario Kart Animal Crossing DLC video doesn't clarify matters much.



    Before the 59fps thing was an oddity that happened in one of each 64 frames. Now look at the video above....

    Something doesn't square with their initial Mario Kart 8 WiiU analysis. I have a feeling that the numbers aren't rounded up, and Mario Kart 8 runs at 59.6-59.7 fps, but the graph only says 59 fps.
     
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