BMW 328i Sedan
- Thread starter digitalwanderer
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CosmoKramer
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Why not start showing some figures then in the name of the mighty Intaanet?!
Seriously, I'd trust the insight of _xxx_ with actual inside information (just as I would trust an actual mechanic in the know) over a bunch of consumers mispleased by some of the things that happened to them and letting it out in public satisfaction surveys that is still limited by what exactly happend, definition of quality and how many participated in the survey in the first place (not to mention how reputable it would be anyway) any day of the week.
I have already provided a link. The only problem with it is that you actually have to click on it (and understand Scandinavian). Other than that, google for JD Powers.
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Using your own "simple" logic I am failing to see what your problem was in the first place.
I said Japanese cars are more reliable and you are basically saying the same thing (considering it is your opinion that Japanese cars have older technology)
I know if I buy a car the fact it has the latest and greatest traction and stability control system in it won't make me any less pissed of when it breaks down.
No. As said, better is a relative term which has to be looked at in proper context, which is not the case here.
For example, the ESP in Merc and BMW is a gen ahead of anything Lexus has to offer. Or the new AWD from BMW (X-Drive), which kills every other system out there. Or things like nightview, or less visable stuff like reactive seats, adaptive air suspension, Flexray-based ECU network and on and on - the list is long.
Again, Japanese could do it just as well, they just choose to go minimum risk/max revenues way, while we usually choose to be on the forefront of the technology. Pure matter of politics.
Though it might be able to save your life in many situations where the less modern system fails.
WHat makes it better than the Subaru systems?
Totally variable power distribution on individual wheels in a lightning-fast manner. Dumbly said, it's much faster, more flexible and much more precise.
In what way? (Edit: Thanks. You answered this for Russ)
And how does that help when cars such as the X5 has abysmal reliability and customer satisfaction ratings (read: spectacular vehicle, if not for...)?
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Make your mind up, you just said older technology is more reliable, now you are trying to tell me it's not.
Aside from EBD and ABS I don't think my car has a single aid on it and thank goodness for that.
Here's some info on xDrive with some nice animations and narration:
http://www.bmw.co.za/Products/Automobiles/xdrive/index.html
http://www.bmw.co.za/Products/Automobiles/xdrive/index.html
He's saying the new stuff can do more, and might be able to compensate where the older system might not be (even assuming that both operate to their fullest capability and functionality).
One last try:
Say company X released a G80 card right after the official launch. Buggy drivers, HW bugs eventually etc. Then, half a year later, most of these bugs are fixed but the customers were unhappy about the problems, bad voices in the press and so on.
Then company Y releases the card right now. Same features and everything, but now we have much better drivers and pretty much all bugs fixed. Customers of brand Y are satisfied.
BMW/Merc would be X, Toyota etc. would be Y in this comparison, and the time between the two releases would be some 5-8 years instead.
So much for JD Powers and alike.
And company Y would have the most reliable card.
It's not rocket science.
I know what you are trying to say, it's you that has the problem understanding.
I couldn't give a crap if company Y is using technology company X first used a decade ago if the end result is company Y's "card" works all the time whereas company Xs "card" doesn't.
It's not rocket science.
I know what you are trying to say, it's you that has the problem understanding.
I couldn't give a crap if company Y is using technology company X first used a decade ago if the end result is company Y's "card" works all the time whereas company Xs "card" doesn't.
LOL, in some crazy way, yes. Everything is being thoroughly tested all around the planet in all possible conditions, but in most cases you won't be able to cover 100% of all possibilities - some stuff always slips through.
And also, the stupidity of some customers is just unbelivable, and they sometimes do stuff (I'd call it abuse, literally) the testers could never dream of.
Example: a customer complaining about his automatic gearshift with Tiptronic. He claimed that it shifts gears in wrong moments on its own sometimes. The engineers drove a few 1000 km and tried to make it happen without any success. So they went to the guy and asked him to demonstrate it, driving exactly as when that happens. So he and his wife entered the car, and she hanged her purse on the gear-shift lever (!) - so the first curve sufficed to give the purse enough acceleration to switch gears...
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I think the problem in here is that 'reliability' is being generalized - when DJ12 says:
...what does he mean? Reliable in the sense that on a BMW, electronics are bound to break? Engine failure? What?
Without the proper context, such a generalization is simply laughable. And no, consumer satisfactory surveys don't really add much weight to anything, it just shows which group is the most vocal about their product.
DJ12 said:
...what does he mean? Reliable in the sense that on a BMW, electronics are bound to break? Engine failure? What?
Without the proper context, such a generalization is simply laughable. And no, consumer satisfactory surveys don't really add much weight to anything, it just shows which group is the most vocal about their product.
So, basically, what you're basically saying is that a 2007 RAV4 is about as advanced the original 2000-2001 X5? Therefore the 2007 Toyota will be more reliable than the 2007 BMW because the former uses old tech. If BMW so desired, they could make a car just as reliable as the current RAV4, but they choose not to because it would be of inferior quality.
Makes me wonder why anyone in their right mind would buy that Toyota in the first place, much less be happy with it.
A bit of a stretch don't you think? Or, I guess, ignorance really is bliss.
But most customers of ours demand new features, because that want to have the "cool stuff" first and are ready to pay the premium for that. Just like people buying a G80 card on release because it offers beter AA/AF or HDR or whatever - that's the nature of the business. Those who don't care about that will not buy a premium car this way or the other, they'll buy a Corolla or in case of gfx they'll go for the GF7600 or such.
For goodness sake, if a car is reliable it doesn't break down, if a car is unreliable it does break down. What other context could it possibly be taken in.
To aviod further confusion when I say "car" I mean the chassis and everything attached to it and enclosed in other parts attached to the chassis.
Well it has to be said Mercedes ditched the braking system they had on the E class after it proved to be so unreliable so the new E class no longer uses it, that's not bug fixing that is getting rid of because it could not be made to work. I wonder if the new Lexus which is probably the most advanced car in the world at the moment will go the same way ?
The 1990's E and C class were very well made but then accountants started penny pinching to put up profit and margin at the same time as cramming in technology ..a recipe for disaster. If the German taxi drivers are complaining you know something is wrong, and that is what they did.
It's not just the components, it's how you put them together as well of course and fault checking at source. I'd bet the Lexus is better than BWM or Mercedes but would I want to drive one ? No chance. Buying a car to drive just because it is 3.78% more reliable than another is crazy. Would you buy a video card because it is the most reliable in a 3DPower Survey ?
The 1990's E and C class were very well made but then accountants started penny pinching to put up profit and margin at the same time as cramming in technology ..a recipe for disaster. If the German taxi drivers are complaining you know something is wrong, and that is what they did.
It's not just the components, it's how you put them together as well of course and fault checking at source. I'd bet the Lexus is better than BWM or Mercedes but would I want to drive one ? No chance. Buying a car to drive just because it is 3.78% more reliable than another is crazy. Would you buy a video card because it is the most reliable in a 3DPower Survey ?