A comment on webboards and why over-active moderation sucks

MfA

Legend
You cant fix the fundamental lack of threading on webboards by active moderation, how does locking threads which go "off topic" according to some personal view of topic of some arbitrary moderator help anyone? Basically it fucks everyone over.

All the console forum needs now is outlawing of curse words and it will be as bad as the nazi-like moderated Doom9 I also visit (fuck Godwin).

Overactive moderation helps noone, it just kills whatever last ability people on webboards have of ignoring stuff (ohh how difficult to just read over something). It makes people dependent on moderators, and gives them unrealistic expectations of said moderators. In the end this causes more pain than they take away.

Better moderation by less moderation ...
 
I agree with you to an extent.

I think that instead of LOCKING every topic the moderator should delete only the POSTS in a topic which are trolling/off-topic.
 
Those posts can be very interesting too, and the determination what is or isnt on topic (or trolling for that matter) is a very subjective one. To give a recent example ... I would be livid if the latter part of this thread was erased.

It is a compromise whatever you decide, as long as we are making compromises anyway I prefer the one which involves the least moderation ... because every moderation causes extra strife, it is only worth doing when it can bring about a significant improvement. Keeping a threads topic pure is has too many downsides for that to be the case IMO. Just ignore the stuff you arent interested in, much simpler ... maybe whine about it a bit, but dont call in the heavy artillery which will always causes collateral damage.

(Usenet is better in that respect, being able to personally ignore subthreads and people are like smart bombs to moderation's nukes ;)
 
The only moderation console talk needs is to remind posters not to flame each other. Whether it's on topic or not, well that is subjective and things can be left alone for the most part.
 
my personal beef is when threads are deleted. i hate that more than anything. instead of locking the thread and cleaning it up. Some mods *are* be too lazy and instead settle for just deleting the thread. I might be wrong, but deleting threads is really excessive either by the original author or a mod.

later,
epic
 
Right now I'm in singapore and only have a half an hour or so a day on the board. But the problem with the console forum is everyone wants something. You lock a thread you get 50 why did you lock my thread topics. You delete a post you just have them post more and ruin the thread due to the extra page allways coming up. I start to while i have time . Locking the threads and then going through each post and deleting all the curses and flames in the thread. But it can take up to an hour on the long threads and some of them like the offical ps3 thread is just to many pages of flames (at least 8.) to do anything but lock them . So sonic tends to lock the threads. I try to edit but ultimately lock the threads too. Just the best way to deal with it . If we had the power to ban the console forum wouldn't look as bad as it did .
 
I was going to make a similar topic myself. There have been 4 threads closed in two days and I don't agree with any of those decisions. What a very small amount of posters on that board (and I mean a few specific persons that will bitch anytime they feel something goes against them) call derailment is a standard progression of discussion. Conversations evolve - if you don't allow them to the board will become dull and lifeless. I also think the blame on chap is misplaced. While you can argue the quality of his posts he's not the one who kills those thread. The whiners/trolls are to blame for that.
 
cybamerc said:
I was going to make a similar topic myself. There have been 4 threads closed in two days and I don't agree with any of those decisions. What a very small amount of posters on that board (and I mean a few specific persons that will bitch anytime they feel something goes against them) call derailment as a standard progression of discussion. Conversations evolve - if you don't allow them to the board will become dull and lifeless. I also think the blame on chap is misplaced. While you can argue the quality of his posts he's not the one who kills those thread. The whiners/trolls are to blame for that.
Hey. I haven't locked a post since i left for singapore. The reasons for the lock aren't the subject discused its those that come in and complain about it being discused. There are a few that don't like sony being shown in a bad light and then start to complain in the posts. While we can have posts about gamecube stoping system making , devs leaving , disapointing profits first half and we can talk about xbox in as much bad light as we want. Once we get sony in a bad light all hell breaks loose. Its very annoying and short of banning them from the console forum all we can do is lock or delete posts. But we have only once deleted a thread and that was an accident. Other than that we are against deleteing full posts
 
jvd:

> Hey. I haven't locked a post since i left for singapore.

No it was Sonic this time.

> The reasons for the lock aren't the subject discused its those that come
> in and complain about it being discused.

Yes, and I disagree with that practice. While the board is for everyone you're doing a great disservice to the people who don't have a problem with how the discussion is evolving. I agree that if a thread turns into a flame fest it may be wise to lock but I don't agree with locking a thread because a few people don't like what is being said in it.

Oh and just to be clear, I'm not suggesting that the solution is to pull out the ban stick :p While there are a few who contribute absolutely nothing of value to the board the touchy Sony fans are some of the board's most active participants.
 
cybamerc said:
jvd:

> Hey. I haven't locked a post since i left for singapore.

No it was Sonic this time.

> The reasons for the lock aren't the subject discused its those that come
> in and complain about it being discused.

Yes, and I disagree with that practice. While the board is for everyone you're doing a great disservice to the people who don't have a problem with how the discussion is evolving. I agree that if a thread turns into a flame fest it may be wise to lock but I don't agree with locking a thread because a few people don't like what is being said in it.

Oh and just to be clear, I'm not suggesting that the solution is to pull out the ban stick :p While there are a few who contribute absolutely nothing of value to the board the touchy Sony fans are some of the board's most active participants.
We don't lock them because a few don't like whats being said in it , its what the few start to post in it.

Yes some of the touchy sony fans are the boards most active participants. But then again so are deadmeat and chap. Yet that doesn't seem to stop people from wanting them band. Just because they post alot does not mean the board should be pro sony and anti everything else. Which many (myself included) feel the board has been for the last year or so.
 
jvd said:
Yes some of the touchy sony fans are the boards most active participants. But then again so are deadmeat and chap. Yet that doesn't seem to stop people from wanting them band. Just because they post alot does not mean the board should be pro sony and anti everything else. Which many (myself included) feel the board has been for the last year or so.

If you look at the actual thread's intended topic, and who started them, I think you'll find that your so called "pro-Sony" members don't start inflamatory threads on the competition, nor do they even comment on it in many cases. I know that I won't even talk in a game-based thread untless it's a positive comment in nature. Yet, that doesn't stop Chap from entering every post on a PS2 game and deride it by some obtuse comment concerning "Shiney Shine" or other such illiterate mumbling. Nor does it stop DeadmeatGA from fighting virulently about negative aspects concerning Sony Group that can and have been proven false.

You'll be hard pressed not to see a thread on PS3/Cell especially in which the above named two don't interject comments that... don't fit... with the level of discussion. But, where is this in the XBox or Nintendo5 threads?

Again, why are there three threads on Sony Group's Quarterly loss? Who cares if they can't make a profit on CRTs and DVD players or Hollywood movies? Seriously....

You will never see me oppose a thread discussed in an intelligent manner between the financials of SCE, Nintendo and MS's Electronics Division, especially in the way I did this one. But, this was wrong and you should have stopped it earlier - not personally create these situations as you did by your post that dragged nVidia's preformance inferiority into a thread that had nothing to do with them... and then edit out Nondescript's post that questioned this (I think it was he).

Now, you may consider allowing this to exist as keeping things "non-biased," but I'm forced to ask why it's your responcibility to allow people to make sub-par posts in some futile attempt to stem the fact that people are intrigued by Sony's non-PC centric ambitions.

It's not Mr. Baumann's job to promote nVidia support and quota ATI comments in the 3D forum, nor would I imagine Dave doing so. It's also not your job to regulate what and how frequently people discuss on-topic items in the forum - but it is your job to prevent people from derailing the very flow of information this board is intended for.
 
IF you are talking about a post that quoted what I said in another post on the ati hardware. I responded with the reason why I believed it was fully done in hardware and gave an example. Then two threads came about which added nothing and claimed the thread was off topic. Those posts were deleted.

There are plenty of times where you will come in and just compalin about chap. There were 3 threads On nintendo loosing money , them stoping production which in the thread said they were loosing money and gonig to become a 3rd party publisher and then a post about how sales were increasing with the price drop also turned into nintendo loosing money and this was a sign they were the number 3 console. All negative. Each of the 3 sony posts were about the same. With people complaining it shouldn't be discussed when if there are the same amount of negative nintendo comments then it should be.
 
jvd:

> We don't lock them because a few don't like whats being said in it , its
> what the few start to post in it.

I personally don't mind a heated debate and I think most people feel the same way. The whining can be ignored or deleted.

Anyway, Sonic locked another thread with the reasoning that there was already another thread like it. Well that may be but that other thread had been locked for some time. If this is going to be the standard moderation policy from now on the board will be unbearable.

Perhaps it is time to find out what topics will be tolerated and what won't. Maybe Dave Baumann has an opinion about it, maybe we could make a poll or something. One thing is for sure, if talk about Sony's business isn't allowed then the same should apply to Nintendo and M$. Personally, I'm opposed to that but we need some kind of consistency.
 
jvd said:
There are plenty of times where you will come in and just compalin about chap. There were 3 threads On nintendo loosing money , them stoping production which in the thread said they were loosing money and gonig to become a 3rd party publisher and then a post about how sales were increasing with the price drop also turned into nintendo loosing money and this was a sign they were the number 3 console. All negative. Each of the 3 sony posts were about the same. With people complaining it shouldn't be discussed when if there are the same amount of negative nintendo comments then it should be.

Ok, your not getting this.

There is a fundimental difference between Sony Group and SCE when it comes to revenue and profit taking. Sony itself is enormous with set-piece infastructure all over the damn place for it's product manufacturing.

Nintendo is a game company, more more, no less to any extent as far as revenue goes. So, yes, when they stopped production of GameCube we talk about Nintendo's future as this is a core revenue stream. We question the companies future under increased competition because they are nothing but this, fundimantally nothing but a handheld and console company.

If Nintendo also owned a worldwide chain of butcher shops, would we discuss their future in the console realm based on lowered revenue from thier chain of butcher shops? Would we contimplate their abandonment of the console division which is the most profitable part of the company? Woudl we talk about the firing of the most influential and perhaps forward looking man in that company? Hell no.

And this is why these threads are nothing but flame bait. If you want to compare "Sony" to "Nintendo" or "Microsoft" then do it correctly and look at SCE against Nintendo proper, against Microsoft's Electronics Division.

Yet, as a moderator (and I personally think is embarrasing) you keep inflaming and allowing people like Chap and DeadmeatGA to post thread after thread, post after post about how Sony's going down because they're finally moving out of the CRT production buisness, finally cutting the massive fat off their redundant corperate structure and finally moving forward.

But, nobody seriously discusses this. Hey, why would you when you can post something like, "teh Sony is dyiing!! :oops: :LOL: They fired employees, KK will be next! Cell is d00m3d!" and you let it go...

And the grand irony is that dispite these "PS2 sales slippage" stories, nobody brought up before I did that even with the "2%" slip or whatever it is, they still outsold the first 18months of XBox sales in this one quarter. They're still making a profit, and they're still outselling the competition at a pricepoint that's outragous. You wanta talk about bias...
 
MfA said:
Aren't there any webboards with true threading and ignore options?
I believe dave has stated that phpbb 2.2 is where he is going with the forum. I havent looked into it too much but I do not believe that it has an ignore feature. Im not sure when the new forum will be installed, but hopefully it will have features that will better the board. :)

later,
epic
 
I also hope we can ban people from sub catagorys . As some don't belong in the console forum and they keep fighting over the same topics that keep getting locked. There is a reason why it was locked in the first place. Starting a new version of it wont change that reason it will only remind us of that reason
 
No offense, but I dont care if a new board gives you even more ways to moderate ... I want less moderation :)

By your standards you should lock this thread for not sticking to my topic ;)
 
MfA said:
No offense, but I dont care if a new board gives you even more ways to moderate ... I want less moderation :)

By your standards you should lock this thread for not sticking to my topic ;)
If you read the console forums you will see that sometimes I will go off topic. I have no problem with topics growing into something bigger than what it started out as. I have a problem with flames and fighting with no merit behind it. The console forum has alot of flames going on so there is more moding going on. If there was less flaming I would be very happy as I wouldn't have to lock as many topics as I am now. Most of which I enjoy reading till the flames come in. I could delete the flames that are a post or two long. But I have class and work and sometimes I can't catch a flame till its 2 or 3 pages long and that takes alot of time to mod. So its often better just to lock the thread. Not only that but then I would sometimes have to read through a post since some of the post can be a flame and the rest can have valid info.

So more modding tools hopefully leads to less modding .
 
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