Predict: Next gen console tech (9th iteration and 10th iteration edition) [2014 - 2017]

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IMO, with HBCC being transparent to the software developer, there's really no need to go with UMA anymore. If devs don't have to manually manage RAM allocation, the consoles can have again a small+fast memory for high-bandwidth/low-latency and a large+slow pool of memory. Just have the cake and eat it too.

So instead of breaking the bank with 32GB of GDDR6, I expect consoles to have 6-8GB of HBM at 500-600GB/s and 24-32GB of DDR4 or LPDDR4 at ~50GB/s (128bit 3200MT/s). Fabs are closing down GDDR production lines to make way for more DDR and LPDDR lines, so lots of GDDR6 might turn out substantially more expensive than previously thought.

I'm not expecting memory bandwidth requirements to balloon as much as some may think. If XBoneX's 320GB/s seems balanced for a pre-DSBR GPU, 500-600GB/s could be more than sufficient for a "high-bandwidth cache" that targets 4K in a post-Vega architecture. If Samsung's roadmap is anything to go by, this could be done with 3 stacks of 2-Hi HBM Low-Cost (6GB) or a single stack of 4-Hi HBM3, whichever ends up the cheaper option.
At the same time, I also expect them to do away with L3 cache for the CPU cores, as coherency could all be done through HBM/HBC.

Perhaps the after-the-next generation can come back to UMA again with tiny PCB footprints using HBM only, but in 2020 it should still be too costly to go with HBM alone.


Same thing with hard drive. Unfortunately (and perhaps artificially), solid state memory has halted its path to lower price-per-GB, so I also expect a 2-tier solution here. I think the consoles will have ~64GB of NVMe storage (M.2 or even soldered) and a 2TB+ SATA3 HDD. The PCI-Express storage would be non-user accessible but the OS would try to detect which game or games are being accessed more frequently and automatically transfer those to the NVMe drive.
I hope I'm wrong and 2020 will have super-cheap 2TB NVMe SSDs, though..




How many console games even use MSAA now? To me it's a PC thing, mostly when people want to increase image quality on older games.
MSAA is also a VR thing..
How much weight next-gen consoles will be putting into VR is up to debate, but MSAA is important for VR. At least it is for Valve if they're taking a break from making hats and are actually making those "3 full VR games" that Gabe Newell said they were.





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Oh and USB-C everywhere, at least 2 ports on the front and another 2 on the back of each console. The ones on the front can be 3.1 Gen1 for gamepads and the ones on the back should be 3.1 Gen3 to use with external storage devices.
 
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The new consoles should have 16GB+ of NAND flash for the OS and small apps to get that phone-like responsiveness. I still expect HDD for games, because the size of games is only going to increase and SSD prices still won't be feasible. Maybe a hybrid as some are suggesting. Storage for game screenshots and game clips is a tough call. I'm assuming they'll record clips in 4k, so you'd probably fill up flash pretty quick. Probably have to store them on the HDD.
 
Why? Two drives is more flexible, faster, and likely cheaper, or certainly no more expensive, as you'd need to pay someone to make the custom SSHD. Just stick HDD and flash off the Southbridge and accessible as two drives, and you have the throughput of both together without bottlenecking the flash performance when writing to HDD. Put the flash into an external unit (thumbstick) and you have more upgradability to your console alongside replaceable HDD. The only clear advantage to a custom SSHD that I can see is the opportunity to charge a premium for proprietary replacements.

Because two drives is better than one. ;) If you are using 128 GBs flash, buy a 128 GB SSD and run it alongside your HDD. SSHD's have a small amount of cache because it's the optimal balance between cost and performance benefit for caching the HDD. Bare in mind everything written to cache has to be written to HDD to, so you're limiting performance. It's only there for faster reads. There's no cross-over in components so you don't save anything fusing the two discrete devices into one package.

I guess this explains why my hybrid firecuda wrote painfully slow compared to my regular HDD :p

So then the dual storage would be a great solution. Flash sticks would make replacement easier for sure, if it's internal it might not even be an SSD drive but rather on board flash and there's no replacing that. Ideally i'd choose an internal SSD though. Assuming games ship on 100GB Blu ray discs, 128gb would be more than enough cache.
 
How many console games even use MSAA now? To me it's a PC thing, mostly when people want to increase image quality on older games.

IIRC Nier uses 4x MSAA on Ps4 pro.

I wish more devs would use it since I hate the blurring and ghosting Temporal AA causes. Some games have some pretty damn decent TAA though like Ratchet and Clank.

Good ol' regular SMAA gets no love :(
 
They won't do that. They don't need it. They'll have plenty of compelling games to show on their boxes. It'll be enough like it's enough now for them.

Great games > flashy logos.

Anyways "4K", "True 4K", "Dynamic 4K", "Native 4K", "Checkerboarded 4K", "True native 4K"...Most customers don't know the difference. Even the XB1s is labelled as a "4K" machine nowadays.
I do agree, I really hope that's the case anyway. After all without a great roster of games to showcase the power, even a 20 tf machine is useless.
 
https://www.globalfoundries.com/sites/default/files/product-briefs/7lp-product-brief.pdf

  • >40% performance improvement at iso power (vs. 14nm)
  • >60% power reduction at iso frequency (vs. 14nm)
  • Up to 30% lower die cost (vs. 14nm)

..................................................well then.

/deletes everything

But when?

If an improved Zen can hit 5 gHz stock at 95W then consider my underpants well and truly sweated into.

And if there are similar gains over TSMC 16nm, then standby for a shrunk X1X with a half width GDDR6 bus to effectively replace the entire Xbox line.

And just imagine a 3.2 gHz Jaguar derivative powering the next few years of consoles. Then sacrifice yourself to the chorus of wails sweeping the internetwebs.
 
Someone at AMD said that the first version of zen was so radical that they tried to stay "conservative", and that zen2 will see "double digits increments" in both single thread and multi thread just from architectural changes
 
The new consoles should have 16GB+ of NAND flash for the OS and small apps to get that phone-like responsiveness. I still expect HDD for games, because the size of games is only going to increase and SSD prices still won't be feasible. Maybe a hybrid as some are suggesting. Storage for game screenshots and game clips is a tough call. I'm assuming they'll record clips in 4k, so you'd probably fill up flash pretty quick. Probably have to store them on the HDD.

Like Xbox One's 8GB eMMC NAND ?
 
But when?

If an improved Zen can hit 5 gHz stock at 95W then consider my underpants well and truly sweated into.

And if there are similar gains over TSMC 16nm, then standby for a shrunk X1X with a half width GDDR6 bus to effectively replace the entire Xbox line.

And just imagine a 3.2 gHz Jaguar derivative powering the next few years of consoles. Then sacrifice yourself to the chorus of wails sweeping the internetwebs.
assuming this scenario came true. Would it be cheaper because the licensing fees were paid back in 2013? Then I'm not sure if people would yell so much if the price was right.
 
I think Xbox One uses the NAND for backing up game data out of RAM for the suspend/resume feature. I'd like to see NAND used to for storing the OS and apps like on a phone, so you get that really snappy feel when you're loading new apps or switching between apps.

I think it does a bit of both, the issue I think is the older interface so not as much bandwidth and performance as could be achieved.

It's one area not mentioned with the One X that I wonder if they have altered or improved on for just the sort of experience your specify.

From then DF interview

Digital Foundry: Another thing that came up from the Hot Chips presentation that was new information was the eMMC NAND which I hadn't seen any mention of. I'm told it's not available for titles. So what does it do?

Andrew Goossen: Sure. We use it as a cache system-side to improve system response and again not disturb system performance on the titles running underneath. So what it does is that it makes our boot times faster when you're not coming out of the sleep mode - if you're doing the cold boot. It caches the operating system on there. It also caches system data on there while you're actually running the titles and when you have the snap applications running concurrently. It's so that we're not going and hitting the hard disk at the same time that the title is. All the game data is on the HDD. We wanted to be moving that head around and not worrying about the system coming in and monkeying with the head at an inopportune time.
 
Ryzen 5 low power APU [14nm Zen] vs Bristol Ridge [28nm Excavator], both running at around 15W
http://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-mobile-apu-benchmarks-leaked-90-faster-bristol-ridge/

AMD-Ryzen-5-2500U-Raven-Ridge-mobile-APU-Geekbench-4-performance-benchmark-.png


There will also be Ryzen 7 APUs with more cores.
 
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