AMD Vega 10, Vega 11, Vega 12 and Vega 20 Rumors and Discussion

[Anarchist4000]

Probably when they say a cut down Vega core it refers to the full vega 10 the 4096 part, not that there is a cut down vega 11 i believe

Cut normally means a few cores disabled resulting in maybe a 10-15% performance difference.

Nope, Polaris isn't going to get that type of performance upgrade, even if it was refreshed, just doesn't have the legs to go that far. With a 40% increase in bandwidth it would also need 40% increase in computational power, you think they can do that? That's an increase of 500 mhz? Not going to happen. Or an increase of 40% units, that too not going to happen if they want to keep power consumption in a range where they are competitive. Its already sucking as much juice as a 1070, either of these changes will put it it well above that.

Polaris is held back by bandwidth and gets almost linear scaling. I doubt they'll get 40% from just the memory if using 11-12Gbps GDDR5X, but the memory alone is probably enough to make it competitive. That doesn't even account for the core clocks. 500MHz with the bandwidth and it would probably be going head to head with a 1080 if not beating it outright. Might even be able to manage that with less power if they drop the core clocks, offsetting gains from memory.

It's about 15 % above RX 480. That's quite in line with Polaris 10 XT2 expectations. 10 % higher core clock, GDDR5X (25 % higher bandwidth) - it should result in ~15 % higher performance.

There's potentially much faster memory than just 10Gbps they could be using as well. I wouldn't rule out some refinements to the core either.

 

[Razor1]

Polaris is held back by bandwidth and gets almost linear scaling. I doubt they'll get 40% from just the memory if using 11-12Gbps GDDR5X, but the memory alone is probably enough to make it competitive. That doesn't even account for the core clocks. 500MHz with the bandwidth and it would probably be going head to head with a 1080 if not beating it outright. Might even be able to manage that with less power if they drop the core clocks, offsetting gains from memory.

Its power limited, we saw Polaris with overclocking a 10% overclock pushed up the power envelope like 30%. Now they need to fix the underlying architecture to fix that, and don't expect that at all.

Not sure of the bandwidth limit you speak of, cause I haven't seen any reviews or benchmarks that show that, links please?

And yeah lets not even talk about Polaris getting up to the 1080 that is crazy talk, even with what we talked about was even possible. It just won't get there.

Tweaks don't do crazy things.

Look at the Fermi, did it do crazy things for it, yeah but power also went up about the same amount lol, crazy stuff don't come out of tweaks and same nodes. How about Fx series, nope didn't happen there either right? Specifically picked problematic chips with power usage issues..... Things like that aren't solved by tweaks.....

 

[gamervivek]

I think it's unlikely that AMD would put a cut down core as a 580 card, unless they are going back to the X and non-X classification.

If it's a new chip then it's close to Polaris in size because it should clock much higher considering AMD"s given numbers of their upcoming Vega based professional line. Or it's 300-350mm2 in size but the drivers are not there yet and/or AMD are not clocking it as high as the bigger Vega.

It's around 20-30% faster than the 480 here, maybe a new revision could get AMD there? If AMD are releasing it around 480's price it will be pretty potent in the market.

 

[iMacmatician]

I think it's unlikely that AMD would put a cut down core as a 580 card, unless they are going back to the X and non-X classification.

That reminds me of this slide from AMD:

Unless the numbering system has been changed since then, the 580 number implies a 256-bit bus. That narrows down the possibilities somewhat, since if the 580 uses Vega 11 then Vega 11 being HBM2-only is out of the question, but not much for this discussion because I think it was rumored that Vega supports both HBM2 and GDDR5(X).

 

[Alexko]

Honestly, I wouldn't bet anything on naming scheme stability across generations.

 

[pTmdfx]

[...] because I think it was rumored that Vega supports both HBM2 and GDDR5(X).

It would be fun to see Vega 11 ships with 256-bit GDDR5X, since it would be interesting to compare it against Polaris 10 on a similar ground.

 

[CarstenS]

What if…

Vega would get a nice moniker of it's own, much like Fiji. And RX 580 would be... another round of re-spun mid-range chips?

 

[AlNom]

Magnum? Orion?

 

[CarstenS]

Aurora? (not saying it's gonna be a dual gpu card though)

 

[Anarchist4000]

Reaper

 

[CSI PC]

4K AMD setup with hexacore Ryzen and dual RX 580s benchmarked in AotS

http://wccftech.com/amd-rx-580-crossfire-ryzen-4k-aots-benchmarks/

I do not know if someone is having a bit of fun out there (in a joke kind of way) but when I look at the Metaverse Benchmark table.
It shows me dual Titan X with Intel 6850K and everything is identical to the 580 Crossfire 4K article, exact same batch scores as well.
http://ashesofthesingularity.com/me...-details/c46cf7e0-a318-4597-811f-f0b6f25033a4
I do not trust this Titan X score as well.

To me, do not touch AoTS even with a 10ft barge pole when it comes to the public scores
Really is only applicable for reviews IMO where everything is controlled (well as controlled as it can be with AoTS) and treated in an isolated fashion - not necessarily correlates between different review sites.

Cheers

 

[ImSpartacus]

What if…

Vega would get a nice moniker of it's own, much like Fiji. And RX 580 would be... another round of re-spun mid-range chips?

From a marketing perspective, the whole point of having this kind of brand is for the stable identity that it maintains.

"Fury" was clearly a response to "Titan" because of the mindshare that Titan brings to the table. People know that "Titan" means the best. Nvidia has built a strong relationship in that respect. I've heard people use "Titan" that know almost nothing about PC gaming. It's been a ridiculously successful brand name for Nvidia.

AMD is in a pickle because on one side, the whole fucking point of having this kind of brand is that you don't change it. It's supposed to embody stability:

• There's always a Fury.
• Fury is always the best.

But it didn't work that way because the Fiji-powered Fury was kind of a disappointment:

• It only had 4GB of VRAM, which was a definite marketing turnoff to the general public and has turned out to carry some notable performance penalties as well.
• The top Fury was beaten to market by the 980 Ti and then lived in its shadow for most of its meaningful lifespan, both in price & performance.

So what do you do if you're AMD? Keep chugging with a weak brand or ignore the whole point of starting that kind of brand and attempt a fresh start? It's a shitty position and I don't know the right answer.

I think it's unlikely that AMD would put a cut down core as a 580 card, unless they are going back to the X and non-X classification.

If it's a new chip then it's close to Polaris in size because it should clock much higher considering AMD"s given numbers of their upcoming Vega based professional line. Or it's 300-350mm2 in size but the drivers are not there yet and/or AMD are not clocking it as high as the bigger Vega.

It's around 20-30% faster than the 480 here, maybe a new revision could get AMD there? If AMD are releasing it around 480's price it will be pretty potent in the market.

That's an interesting thought.

One thing I'm confident of is that the 570 is Polaris 10-based (either Polaris 10 XT or Polaris 10 Pro).

• That's because there was a Samsung laptop with an RX 570 at CES.
• The only RX-branded GPU to ever make it into a laptop was the RX 470 (remember the mobile R5/7/9 400 rebrands don't use "RX") and it actually arrived with a moderate amount of fanfare because it was literally a carbon copy of its desktop ilk, 120W TDP and all.

Therefore there's a strong possibility that a mobile RX 570 is a copy of the desktop RX 570. And considering time to market limitations, Sammy couldn't get a Vega 11 into a laptop in time for CES, so this has to be Polaris 10 of some kind.

But the RX 580? Maybe that's a new beast entirely.

 

[gamervivek]

The CF score looks faked but that's wccftech.

Videocardz who posted the single card score said that the user had signed up with real name and they could find his facebook, while Hocp even linked to his linkedin page. I doubt someone went to that length to fake an AoTS score.

A 250$ 980Ti would make a great card.

 

[ImSpartacus]

The CF score looks faked but that's wccftech.

Videocardz who posted the single card score said that the user had signed up with real name and they could find his facebook, while Hocp even linked to his linkedin page. I doubt someone went to that length to fake an AoTS score.

A 250$ 980Ti would make a great card.

Newegg had a particular variety of overclocked Sapphire Fury that was going for $220-240 on & off from Black Friday until like January-ish.

https://slickdeals.net/f/9525200-sapphire-nitro-radeon-r9-fury-219-ar-vco-newegg-12-12-only

Pretty outstanding deal if your case can hold that monster and you only needed to game at 1440p or 1080p.

And apparently, based on recent games, fiji has been aging better than gm200 (as long as you're not running into any vram issues), so a Fury with a ~5% overclock is probably consistently better than a stock 980 Ti.

 

[Malo]

Hot off the press, Vega is going to be called RX Vega

 

[Ike Turner]

 

[Anarchist4000]

Hot off the press, Vega is going to be called RX Vega

I guess that means the rumors were accurate.

 

[Alexko]

Damn, we had a discussion the other day (can't remember which thread) about branding for Vega, and the issues associated with keeping the Fury brand (tainted as it is by the 4GB issue and by the lack of update that now associates it with mediocre performance) and I didn't bother sharing my thoughts at the time, which were:

"AMD could pull an NVIDIA, and use Vega as a brand name, just as the green team did with Tesla. It sounds great and you can keep it for the next generation, no one will care that it used to be an architecture code name."

(That said, I would not have kept the RX part.)


Edit: Plus, as derFunkenstein pointed out in a Tech Report comment, AMD fans can now be called Vegans.

 

[Ike Turner]

Damn, we had a discussion the other day (can't remember which thread) about branding for Vega, and the issues associated with keeping the Fury brand (tainted as it is by the 4GB issue and by the lack of update that now associates it with mediocre performance) and I didn't bother sharing my thoughts at the time, which were:

"AMD could pull an NVIDIA, and use Vega as a brand name, just as the green team did with Tesla. It sounds great and you can keep it for the next generation, no one will care that it used to be an architecture code name."

(That said, I would not have kept the RX part.)

RX for GPUs , R5,6,7,whatever for CPUs apparently

 

[Kaotik]

RX for GPUs , R5,6,7,whatever for CPUs apparently

Nope, the CPUs are just 3, 5 and 7, not R-anything.
RX just for GPUs, APUs might still go with R3/5/7 or whatever (meaning Raven Ridges obviously)

edit:
Oh, also, here's the logo: