PS3 GDC Demos were not shown in HD.

According to this source they were shown using the none HD black AV cable and NOT the HDMI cable. The excuses are quite funny though

tgdaily said:
San Jose (CA) - Last week, Sony announced to launch its Playstation 3 in November and blamed the delay on technical problems such as the ongoing work to finalize Blu-ray's copy protection technology AACS. At GDC we got a glimpse how far the PS3 may be still away from production, as Sony was not able to run the console through HDMI at 1080p resolution.

One of the reasons to buy an Xbox 360 or an upcoming Playstation 3 is the fact that Microsoft and Sony promise the beginning of a high definition gaming era - a new stage for gaming that will bringer higher-quality audio and video to the screen. On 15 March, Sony conceded that it was forced to delay the launch of its contender because a series of technology delays. The console has been touring the country for more than a year - without being actually demonstrated in detail - and it was our expectation that we will see at GDC a version that would come close to a production unit - as Sony will have to start mass-producing the console in late summer.

In fact, Sony had a few consoles on display at GDC, which were demonstrating video and audio demos. But surprisingly, these boxes were showing hardly any of the PS3's expected capability, including a screen feed that was not delivered through the HDMI interface, but through Sony's "AV MULTI OUT" connector,which has S-Video and component analog ports.

Two different PS3 prototypes were used in the demos; one was a slimmer box with dual HDMI outputs, while the other was a PC case with a video card in the back. Both devices were connected to identical Sony model television sets, which had HDMI ports.

sony_ps3_pic1.jpg


Sony Playstation 3 graphics demo unit

All graphics demos were played on the slim boxes, while the audio demos were played on the larger PC-sized boxes. The graphics demo units were connected to the televisions via Sony's AV Multi-Out connector (black cable in photo), which is an analog connector that can split into S-Video or RCA connectors. The two HDMI ports right below the AV Multi-Out port were unused.

Of course, we were interested in why Sony did not run the units with HDMI. There may be an obvious explanation, but we received some surprising answers from Sony's staff. First, we were told that it isn't easy to get a hold of HDMI-equipped TVs. We found this to be very strange, because after all we were at the Sony booth and all the television sets had HDMI inputs. On the second try, we were told that the reason for not using HDMI was that Sony did not have any HDMI cables and that "they are difficult to find". Matt Butrovich, a former intern with Tom's Hardware and who walked the show floor with us, offered the staff to use one of the HDMI cables he actually had in his car and connect the PS3 with the TVs. Sony officials turned down the offer and we were left without seeing the demos in HD.

Somehow we feel that there was another reason for not showing the PS3 with HDMI. In fact, the explanation could be as simple as the PS3's HDMI wasn't compatible with the HDMI spec integrated in the TVs. Recently it was announced that the PS3 will use HDMI 1.3, which will use an expansion of the audio channels and offer Dolby TrueHD as well as DTS-HD. Current TVs generally use HDMI 1.1, which do not support these extensions and create significant audio noise when connected to a HDMI 1.3 device.

sony_ps3_pic2.jpg


Audio demo unit (black cable to the bottom-right of the fan is USB)

In the end, we do not know the real reason of avoiding HDMI in the GDC demonstrations. But it certainly highlighted that Sony has still work to do - not only to finalize the AACS spec, but also to accelerate the availability to HDMI 1.3 and to educate customers that they only can run HD video and audio if they have a HDMI 1.3 capable TV.

Source : http://www.tgdaily.com/2006/03/24/gdc2006_ps3_no_hdmi/
 
!eVo!-X Ant UK said:
According to this source they were shown using the none HD black AV cable

Umm..since when could component not handle HD? I hear lots of people are playing games right now in HD using component cables :p Just look at the video of the demos from the booth, the stuff is clearly not running at 480i/p.

The guy sounds like he doesn't know what he's talking about with HDMI either. HDMI is fully backwards compatible.
 
Titanio said:
Umm..since when could component not handle HD? I hear lots of people are playing games right now in HD using component cables :p Just look at the video of the demos from the booth, the stuff is clearly not running at 480i/p.

The guy sounds like he doesn't know what he's talking about with HDMI either. HDMI is fully backwards compatible.

BC compatible?

an HDMI 1.3 TV can show both 1.1 and 1.3 output (video+audio), so it's bc compatible
but HDMI 1.1 TV can't use properly a 1.3 output, just because it's not designed for this
 
Griffith said:
BC compatible?

an HDMI 1.3 TV can show both 1.1 and 1.3 output (video+audio), so it's bc compatible
but HDMI 1.1 TV can't use properly a 1.3 output, just because it's not designed for this

A HDMI 1.1 TV or whatever will get as much as it can out of the 1.3 signal though, as much as its specification allows it - which means a HD signal, but for example, not the lossless audio codecs etc. Even a DVI TV or monitor can be connected for a HD picture.
 
You'll get as good as your equipment allows. You can feed audio out through the digital-audio-out also anyway, and whatever quality it supports.

You'll get the same out of it as if it were HDMI 1.1 or 1.2 or whatever. But by supporting HDMI 1.3, PS3 can support what HDMI 1.3 equipment offers also. HDMI equipment has to fully support HDMI equipment that came before it, that's why I term it 'BC'.
 
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All of your problems can go away if you just stop reading TG Daily. Seriously folks, this is TG Daily. Countless times they have evidenced themselves inept at reporting facts and this is another shining example.

There will be no 'audio noise' because the connection negotiation between devices will confirm that the TV cannot support HD Audio and not send it along the cable.
 
Oh, I guess 720p and 1080i are not HD anymore. :/


THe HDMI connection on my 1+ year old Samsung DLP better work with my PS3, for 720p and audio anyways. I can use optical thru my receiver though.

1080p is a moot point as my set is just 720p.
 
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Titanio said:
Umm..since when could component not handle HD? I hear lots of people are playing games right now in HD using component cables :p Just look at the video of the demos from the booth, the stuff is clearly not running at 480i/p.

The guy sounds like he doesn't know what he's talking about with HDMI either. HDMI is fully backwards compatible.

Drop the "fully" and I would agree with you...but agreeing as someone who has been bit in the ass numerous times with HDMI and DVI and them being "fully-backwards compatibile" then there's the whole HDCP issue (but thats another topic for another day). I don't believe for a moment that Sony didn't at least use component, I don't even know what the hell Ratchet and Clank are, but I know looking at those pics has me wanting to play it...
 
NucNavST3 said:
Drop the "fully" and I would agree with you...

Well it should be as backwardly compatible as earlier specs allow. Obviously HDMI 1.2 equipment can't do everything 1.3 can, but 1.3 equipment plugged into it should allow for anything 1.2 equipment would.
 
Titanio said:
Well it should be as backwardly compatible as earlier specs allow. Obviously HDMI 1.2 equipment can't do everything 1.3 can, but 1.3 equipment plugged into it should allow for anything 1.2 equipment would.

I don't disagree with that. But I think for those that don't have HDMI and DVI devices intermingling its hard to understand what a pain in the nalgas it can be to get them to work properly together. I should add that sometimes on more than a few occasions hdmi-->hdmi can be a pain also if the HDCP timings are off. I am hoping that somehow the 1.3 devices work better than previous devices.
I don't want to sound like some HDMI basher, I love it, when it works, its GREAT, when you figure out how to get it to work, its GREAT. But it is not always just plug in the cable and voila! That is why I have suggested in many a thread that Sony do testing on many different types and brands of TVs with many different configs. hdmi-->hdmi, hdmi-->dvi, etc. As Microsoft witnessed, the web is a VERY vocal place now...

OT: The more I see and read about the PS3 and the Rev the more I become a "NinSonySoft" fan-dude. /OT
 
I hope the BR copy protection doesn't limit the type of HD outputs. Still something doesn't smell right concerning the ps3 ouputting HD signal for games and movies via component or into a hdmi 1.1 TV.

But could also mean the ps3 tv output tech hasn't been finalized.
 
Pozer said:
I hope the BR copy protection doesn't limit the type of HD outputs.

Any limits would only be for movies, and would be entirely down to the movie studios on a title-per-title basis, as defined in the AACS spec, not any specific BD copy protection. For example, Sony pictures has said it will not limit HD output to HDMI or DVI only, for its movies, so you'll be able to use component to watch them in HD.
 
one said:
I doubt the demo monitor had HDMI inputs though probably you could connect it via DVI-HDCP if you want to with a converter.

http://reviews-zdnet.com.com/Sony_FWD_40LX1_S_LCD_monitor_40/4507-6482_16-31608889.html?tag=sub

Now thats just crazy, why demo on a model with no hdmi, I thought the majority of their sets had hdmi now;how old is that set?

As an aside, you can buy an HDMI-->DVI cable from monoprice for about $10 (give or take) for 10ft (I think I paid $30 with overnight shipping). I paid more than that for my hdmi/dvi adapter on sale. I advise everyone to buy the cable instead, hdmi doesn't "lock" into its slot (at least on my equipment), so putting the adapter in the hdmi slot and then having a heavy DVI cable always puts too much tension on the port, many times causing the adapter to fall out of the slot. Even with just a cable I recommend buying the length you actually need, because I have still had the cable dislodge while moving my dvd player. /OT again...sorry
 
since they used 720p videos, they could do it using component cables. 360 uses component for producing 720p game visuals.
 
But it certainly highlighted that Sony has still work to do - not only to finalize the AACS spec, but also to accelerate the availability to HDMI 1.3 and to educate customers that they only can run HD video and audio if they have a HDMI 1.3 capable TV.

If they knew so much they'd also know that AACS isn't down to Sony but down to a consortium. I do wonder about HDMI 1.3 and putting audio out as noise, don't HDMI devices auto-negotiate connection details?

BTW, AACS relates to movies and it is the Image Constraint token in particular which was the long-standing battle of the AACS specification. Though part of the specification it is down to individual studios to decide if they will activate it and prevent true 1080p output over non-HDCP links (I think it's downsampled to something slightly lower than 720p?)
 
It may just be down to the equipment that was available in the venue - I would assume they just had to hook up to whatever was there, rather than ship in and set up their own kit. Most venues probably don't have projectors capable of 1080p over a digital connection... chances are, the best available option was 720p component.

Certainly we use the multi-AV connector on the back of the devkit with a standard PS2 component lead to hook up some of our HDTVs here.
 
Also, on this whole HDMI issue - just because a given source-device supports HDMI 1.3, it doesn't mean it won't also support a lesser specification of display if that's what's plugged in - AFAIK it's perfectly possible to detect the capabilities of the display and adjust the output appropriately.
 
MrWibble said:
Also, on this whole HDMI issue - just because a given source-device supports HDMI 1.3, it doesn't mean it won't also support a lesser specification of display if that's what's plugged in - AFAIK it's perfectly possible to detect the capabilities of the display and adjust the output appropriately.

this is a you speculation
have you connected a hdmi 1.3 device to a hdmi 1.1 tv?
I don't think so

I just think that sony says that "It's very difficult to find an hdmi tv" saying that this is the cause that they can't use hdmi connection
I really don't think that sony can't find an hdmi 1.1 tv, I believe that they have difficult finding hdmi 1.3 tv
this could explain all the story
 
Griffith said:
this is a you speculation
have you connected a hdmi 1.3 device to a hdmi 1.1 tv?
I don't think so

Your also speculating so i'll give you the right answer....

HDMI 1.1 CAN carry a 1080p Signal but it CANNOT carry HD Audio (DTS Lossless etc)

HDMI 1.3 CAN carry a 1080p Signal and CAN carry HD Audio (DTS Lossless etc)

HDMI 1.3 CAN be connected to an HDMI 1.1 device, you just WON'T be able to resolve any HD Audio. End of story
 
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