Fullscreen-SG/RGSSAA with Fermi via TRSSAA (OGL, D3D10/11)?

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boxleitnerb

Regular
In the German forum 3DCenter, the user Blaire found out that FS-SSAA possibly works via transparency antialiasing.
Restrictions suspected/known so far:

- OpenGL, DX10 and DX11
- 2x, 4x and 8x (TR)SG-SSAA/(TR)RG-SSAA - not sure yet what grid is used
- the number of SSAA samples must not be greater than the number of MSAA samples
i.e. 4xMSAA+4xTRSSAA=yay!, 4xMSAA+8xTRSSAA=nay!
- as of now works only on GF 400 (Fermi)
- in one case (Just Cause 2), the number of SSAA samples and color Samples have to be the same
- so far, it is not possible to adjust the LOD accordingly in DX10+. The image gets a bit blurry. This can be alleviated by choosing only 2xTRSSAA

The whole thing seems to be a bug. The magazine PC Games Hardware (PCGH) has contacted Nvidia about this and is awaiting a response. Possibly, Nvidia is experimenting with SSAA in their drivers and it got messed up somehow.

Although the article below is in German, you may enjoy the screenshots it contains which prove SSAA actually works:

http://www.pcgameshardware.de/aid,7...alitaet-in-modernen-Spielen/Grafikkarte/Test/

Personally, I think this is great as you cannot force or enhance AA in DX10+. Flickering/shimmering shaders cannot be countered in DX10+ apps, unless SSAA is explicitly built into the game (Arma 2 for example).
 
Nice :) While I generally don't like overriding AA in games that natively support it, I still think this is a good idea and a good use of all the 'excess' power available in these sorts of cards.

I surely wouldn't mind having that option in my ATI 5850...
 
Well, I guess in most modern titles even Fermi lacks the performance. But still, nice development to combat shader aliasing. Just played Just Cause 2 - the image is so..."unstill", basically every texture flickers, even with HQ-AF. Just horrible.
 
You need a GTX 470/480 and I guess the newest Forceware should suffice. Select any MSAA from the game menu and choose the TRSSAA mode that you want from the NV control panel:

xp4ft3.jpg
 
boxleitnerb said:
Which game? Driver? Note the limitations from the first post. Which AA settings did you use exactly?
Click to expand...

It's under the global settings so "which game" is irrelevant. There's only one driver available for gt300 users to download so "which driver" is irrelevant.

I tried all the aa modes/settings (even the one shown in the screen-shot), no dice.
 
Did not know that with the driver. But note the exception with Just Cause 2. All this is still experimental, but PCGH got it to work.
Maybe you need a restart after changing a setting - this can happen sometimes. Anyway, I'm sorry I cannot help you out more, I just relayed the info and don't have a Fermi card myself yet.
Maybe you could try the following:

For AA use "application controls AA"
Set it to 4x MSAA in the game...lets say Dirt 2
For transparency-AA select "off"
Run a benchmark and save the results
For transparency-AA select "4x (supersample)"
Run a benchmark and save the results

With TRSSAA you should get significantly lower fps and of course, image quality would be quite perfect.
 
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willardjuice said:
It's under the global settings so "which game" is irrelevant. There's only one driver available for gt300 users to download so "which driver" is irrelevant.

I tried all the aa modes/settings (even the one shown in the screen-shot), no dice.
Click to expand...

The game is relevant though, because it doesn't work in DX9 games.
 
ShaidarHaran said:
The game is relevant though, because it doesn't work in DX9 games.
Click to expand...

Completely irrelevant as we are talking about whether the option even appears in the control panel (it doesn't).

Do the old ordered grid SSAA modes still work?
Click to expand...

nhancer still works (that's how I force SSAA right now). I would rather not use nhancer though.
 
willardjuice said:
Completely irrelevant as we are talking about whether the option even appears in the control panel (it doesn't).
Click to expand...

The "2x/4x/8x (supersample)" option in the transparency antialiasing setting?


nhancer still works (that's how I force SSAA right now). I would rather not use nhancer though.
Click to expand...

OGSSAA works, sure. But only in DX9 and below. That is why this new thing is so interesting. Normally, the anti-aliasing setting demanded by the game cannot be changed in DX10 and above applications.
 
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trinibwoy said:
Do the old ordered grid SSAA modes still work?
Click to expand...

IMO the hybrid RGMS/OGSS modes are far more useful than those (unless someone wants to experiment with 4*4 OGSS or else "how do I get the available fill-rate to a rock bottom for a more negative LOD"), but I suspect that those are limited too to DX9 applications.

The question now is what exactly is going on under =/>DX10 when someone enables transparency supersampling. If it truly expands to non alpha test textures then it's definitely interesting. However indications so far make me think that in this stage it might be some unfinished experiment.

Add to that TMAA isn't still working in current drivers and it sounds more and more like it. That said when finally enabled I'm curious to see how 32xCSAA with 32xTMAA looks like in real time.
 
Yeah the hybrid modes fall under the same umbrella for me as they presumably use the same mechanism as the pure supersampled modes. I still don't get why oversampling the frame is limited to DX9 only though.
 
trinibwoy said:
Yeah the hybrid modes fall under the same umbrella for me as they presumably use the same mechanism as the pure supersampled modes. I still don't get why oversampling the frame is limited to DX9 only though.
Click to expand...

I've read about the reason somewhere but I can't remember what it was that you're practically limited to multisampling only under DX10/11 for the moment. Technically it should close the door under relative terms also to any other possible "exotic" hw AA algorithm research outside of multisampling. I don't know what's the reasoning behind such a decision, but it sounds pretty absurd to me.
 
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