Cell being shrunk to 22 nm? *spawn

Another interesting suggestion. I do feel there must be more than just PS3s. Although an STB with BRD is basically a PS3. ;) I suppose they could go Cell only running PS3 apps, incorporate PlayTV/whatever the Japanese TV tuner is called, and run it as a PVR, assuming these don't touch RSX.
 
Any Gaikai servers would still need Cell chips, no? That means they'd still want die shrinks in the future, right?
 
-tkf- said:
What about a PS3+PS4.. please please please
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Sony has already said no. Plus, people will be far angrier about an option removed (PS2 BC, Other OS) than one that never existed in the first place. It requires too much to be redesigned at this point.
 
dagamer said:
Sony has already said no. Plus, people will be far angrier about an option removed (PS2 BC, Other OS) than one that never existed in the first place. It requires too much to be redesigned at this point.
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Just give me a deluxe SKU
 
dagamer said:
It would be what, +150-200?
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If they can sell a PS3 for $200 retail, adding those gubbins to PS4 should be much less. BRD and PSU and RAM are already in PS4. Shrink the processors and it might add only $100, maybe even less if the target is a $120 PS3 standalone model.

I think it's highly improbably, but refactoring the Cell points to some other targets, so maybe its on the cards? Maybe it'll come with an 'overclock' mode option, a Turbo button on the front of the console, and run at 5 GHz for a better experience? :D
 
I had been entertaining the idea of a premium PS4 model with a cell chip(and whatever else to have native PS3 BC), if Sony can pull it off i would buy it over the base model(if it's +$100 of base price).

Also what are the chances Sony have fixed the problems that have prevented them from taking full advantage of die shrinks?
 
Wynix said:
I had been entertaining the idea of a premium PS4 model with a cell chip(and whatever else to have native PS3 BC), if Sony can pull it off i would buy it over the base model(if it's +$100 of base price).

Also what are the chances Sony have fixed the problems that have prevented them from taking full advantage of die shrinks?
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They just need to sell that deluxe sometime after the cheap sku. Noone remebers the 500$ ps3 because they announced the 600 without having the cheapest ready.
 
I found this interesting(from gaf):

22nm Cell with stacked XDR and 28nm RSX with stacked GDDR3 on a single package. That's where it's heading. Sony have been researching stacked RAM quite a lot and they used it for PSVita, the natural extension is that they will also use it for PS3, 2Gb XDR and 2Gb GDDR3 chips aren't going to be particularly expensive.

What's more is that getting Cell down to 22nm would require the removal of Flex IO to fully realise the cost savings, that means stacked XDR for the same or more bandwidth between Cell/XDR is the only real solution.
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One can only hope that they have been able to remove the Flex IO.
 
If they were going for a chip for backward compatibility only inside a ps4 or a server somewhere, couldn't they make a cell without the 2 spus that aren't used for actual game processing? Like one is innactive and the other is for the OS. That would mean yet even less silicon.
 
Arksine said:
Or perhaps they will need these for Gaikai, if they really plan on streaming PS3 games. Assuming the service takes off they will need a Cell/RSX cluster. The smaller and less power hungry the better.
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Shifty Geezer said:
Interesting idea.
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Sounds like a terrible idea to me. If you're going to do a Cloud service of any sort, seems to me you would want it built on an enterprise hypervisor that can run any virtualized workload, and not dedicated single use hardware. Single use hardware that could only run PS3 code, or require extensive coding to efficiently run other workloads. Which would be coding for an architecture that won't likely see any further commercial growth outside of the PS3. Why build a rack of Cell/RSX servers for PS3 use, when you could have a rack of Xeon/Tesla servers for general virtualization use? Initial BOM (hardware only) might look favorable initially to Cell/RSX, but I think all costs considered that would be the wrong mid and long term plan.There are scalable, fully supported, ready to integrate with SANs, hypervisors available for x86 hardware that you don't need to build from scratch or worry about future upgrades. The only thing missing is x86 PS3/PS2/PS1 emulation software. Emulation software that can then be seamlessly moved to newer hardware as you upgrade your infrastructure. Where as any Cell/RSX code isn't going anywhere.

Sorry for the mini-rant, I just don't see Cell being a very good use for Gaikai services given the current circumstances.
 
dagamer said:
Sony has already said no. Plus, people will be far angrier about an option removed (PS2 BC, Other OS) than one that never existed in the first place. It requires too much to be redesigned at this point.
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Not to mention that they had to remove that back then because the "gamers" were not buying PS3s as much as they should have been back then... those people who got angry at those features removed were not early adopters or where chosing to sit on a fence under the fear of the launch price while not realizing or not getting the proper marketing that they were getting a steal of a deal in a console back then so companies like Sony, who were selling hardware at a loss and were losing greatly had to make cuts...

Its almost like the "people" voted that they did not want additional features by not buying and waiting... then they removed features, dropped price and then those "people" got angry after buying when prices dropped and not getting what they initially did not respond to.

Other OS did not contribute to the game console idea... I'm glad its gone, in fact it never should have been part of the console to being with... the competition never offered such a feature either and just focused on games and online where consoles make profits.

Wynix said:
I found this interesting(from gaf):


One can only hope that they have been able to remove the Flex IO.
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Wow that really makes the imagination go wild... I started thinking about a portable, hand held PS3 for some reason... but that is a ridiculous idea?!

Whatever it is its probably not for initial consumer use
 
What's really most surprising about this generation is that even after 7 years, the cheapest "decent" models with a good sized hard drive are still well over $250 ($269 for the PS3, $299 for the 360). In fact, it's still a miracle the PS3 sold as well as it did considering the price it started at.

Both console still have plenty of life in them. If you want to see flogging sales, look at the Wii, especially considering the price. Value/price ratio is why someone buys a product, not just price alone.
 
Gradthrawn said:
Sorry for the mini-rant, I just don't see Cell being a very good use for Gaikai services given the current circumstances.
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Excepting Cell emulation is probably a no go for any existing server at the moment. If I'm wrong on that then sure, populate your servers with general purpose processors that can run code from any system via emulation. But if PS3 cannot be emulated, the only way to provide BC over Gaikai would be actual hardware. Of course, Sony could just not bother. ;)
 
Dagamer, the PS3 did not initially (at least from launch to 2008 imho) did not sell as many as expected by Sony or expected by analysts who theorized that most PS2 early adopters, along with new ones would turn up at stores to buy the consoles in droves to exceed shipped supply and incite demand like with PS2 (despite different hardware) considering the multiple features the hardware had it was somehow devalued and taken for granted by vocal fans/consumers who did not step up.


PS3 sales to date are not really much of a miracle since there were still going to be price cuts eventually as well as must have games that were gonna improve or help promote sales.

However there is a major factor with the current gen console prices that was not with previous consoles or the Wii. These current gen also have a hard drive that at least for PS3 has not really allowed the price to reach $99.95 price point. The Xbox 1 had a HDD standard but that was prematurely discontinued, they would have needed years too to get to 99.
 
Shifty Geezer said:
Excepting Cell emulation is probably a no go for any existing server at the moment. If I'm wrong on that then sure, populate your servers with general purpose processors that can run code from any system via emulation. But if PS3 cannot be emulated, the only way to provide BC over Gaikai would be actual hardware. Of course, Sony could just not bother. ;)
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it would prob be cheaper to just run the pc verisons of most of the games. The others could most likely be made to run on pc hardware quite cheaply. You'd be able to run them in higher res most likely too as a bonus
 
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