tongue_of_colicab
Veteran
Only if you are trying to claim a supercar has to be midengined (which I think it does, though I love the old long enginehood cars too. Modern ones too btw, the 599 is sexy).
Porsche calls Nissan cheaters!
- Thread starter Cheezdoodles
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Dude, any convertible will dopulling chicks is not useless
If the Esprit (the first one) is considered a supercar it just underlines the fact that supercar status has more to do with styling and presence than with performance.
Cheers
Usually scaling downwards should be relatively easy, as long as the basic construction of the car is similar and you have an AWD system to begin with. There are still relatively high costs involved, since you have to test and validate every single version/configuration, full qualification program with prototypes etc. But I was talking about the case where you'd develop one from scratch. For example, we at Mercedes would have to, since we have no AWD of the sort used in Lambos (with transaxle gearbox).
Dude, any convertible will do
If the Esprit (the first one) is considered a supercar it just underlines the fact that supercar status has more to do with styling and presence than with performance.
Depends, which Esprit you're refering to. It's essentially an old car that first appeared in the seventies. If it could be called a supercar is up for debate (probably more down to what one defines to be a supercar), but it certainly was no slouch performance wise. Even the later models, such as the V8, are very quick cars, even by todays standards. It certainly gave much more expensive Ferrari models a good run performance wise.
I probably would call it as much a supercar as I would a Ferrari 360 CS. Now the Zonda-F on the other hand....
That's the thing, I don't consider the Esprit, 360 or the 360 CS supercars, they are sportscars (and very good ones). The Zonda on the other hand: Styling, over-the-top BHP and pricetag is what makes this a supercar.
All IMO.
Cheers
I agree Gubbi - I'm huge fan of the Esprit, but a supercar, I wouldn't consider it as being one.
I also see Lamborghini's less and less being supercar title worthy. IMO, Zonda-F meet these requirements, as well as probably the Porsche Carrera GT, the Ferrari Enzo and of course the McLaren F1. I guess one would also have to call the Veyron a supercar just for the price tag alone, even if doesn't have very exciting over-the-top styling...
I also see Lamborghini's less and less being supercar title worthy. IMO, Zonda-F meet these requirements, as well as probably the Porsche Carrera GT, the Ferrari Enzo and of course the McLaren F1. I guess one would also have to call the Veyron a supercar just for the price tag alone, even if doesn't have very exciting over-the-top styling...
tongue_of_colicab
Veteran
The veyron is a very expensive beetle, not a supercar. Better yet, give me the beetle, atleast that looks kinda cool.
I'm afraid I dont want to know what kind of girls you hook up with then
Dude, any convertible will do
I'm afraid I dont want to know what kind of girls you hook up with then
Ignorant and elitist all in one! What a dissonant post.The veyron is a very expensive beetle, not a supercar. Better yet, give me the beetle, atleast that looks kinda cool.
I'm afraid I dont want to know what kind of girls you hook up with then
tongue_of_colicab
Veteran
Sorry I dont like the Veyron.
Betanumerical
Veteran
Why not? fastest comfortable car on the planet.
I dont either but to call it a very expensive beetle is ignorant and foolish.
Meh imo over the top styling is not a requirement, BHP, rareness and pricetag are the factors. It doesnt have to look crazy to be a supercar, just have to be expensive ,rare and FAAAAST. A Veyron is a supercar in my book, even thought im not particularly found of it, but its fast as hell, expensive as hell and rare.
With fast and rarity mean in the Carrera GT\Koeningsegg\Enzo's etc. territory.
Cheap ferrari's and porsche's, merc AMG and BMW M series, Nissans GTR's etc, doesn't make the cut, they are imo just good sportscars.
Second fastest. And all but comfortable I'd assume (never drove it though).
Surely Lambo is a supercar, or how do you call a car which can run 350 kmh and is in the top ten fastest cars on this planet? IMO anything running over 300 is a supercar. Rare or not is kinda not relevant in my eyes, just the power and the feeling.
As much as I am underwhelmed, unmoved in what the Veyron is, it doesn't fail to impress from a technological point of view. I'd like to see a beetle that can retain those speeds and feel relatively relaxed, controlled and safe. The most underwhelming aspect of this car, is arguably its strongest most impressive point. I think it deserves some credit
I think Lamborghini lost a lot of its supercar status when they got taken over by Audi. They have the looks, but something is just missing. Perhaps the Reventon could be the super car of the marque, but I'm not so sure the others do, at least per my definition. Maybe the problem isn't with what Lamborghini is, but how much more special the competition has become. There's a huge difference between a Zonda-F, McLaren F1 and what is a Lamborghini. I don't think the Lamborghini's of today have moved on much from what they have been 10 years ago. They got more civilized, that's it.
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Betanumerical
Veteran
The ultimate Aero SSC or whatever its called is far from what I would call comfortable.
tongue_of_colicab
Veteran
And why would that matter? If you want to go really fast and be comfortable buy a airplane. Thats why I dont like the veyron. Sure it can do 400kmph (if you can find a place to drive that fast, which the average veyron owner wont so the topspeed already is useless), with its 1800+kg I doubt it will be that much good on a track and if you want real comfort buy a RR or something like that. Its just a kinda comfortable supercar, with a high topspeed you cant use and its not even that exclusive. Funny enough they even have trouble selling all the cars, thats why there are like a dozen of ''special editions'' already. Now I dont recall that being a problem for the real supercars like the Enzo.
Betanumerical
Veteran
Because I said its the fastest comfortable car, which it is, whether its usable or not doesn't matter.
I have respect for the real supercas (Enzo's, f40's, zonda's, Koenigsegg's, gumpert, etc) but its not the same, or even meant to be the same as the Veyron, the Veyron is meant to be fast and comfortable, the rest are meant to be very fast and perform well. I would suspect they have trouble selling them because of the crazy amount of money they cost.