GDC session - bigwigs talk

[Shifty Geezer]

Nextgen.biz has highlights from a talk :

Gathered in the room were six industry luminaries, all of whom carry enough reputational and intellectual gravity to land a heavyweight keynote. They sat together for just under two hours to debate the most crucial, stimulating and controversial issues facing our industry. In attendance, and surely rapt, were a handful of games journalists.

Though none require it, for the sake of form we’ll identify the bigwigs. They were Phil Harrison (Sony); Raph Koster (independent game designer), Neil Young (EA); Peter Molyneux (Lionhead); Chris Taylor (Gas Powered Games) and David Perry (Acclaim et al). Game Theory podcast co-host Gary Whitta moderated.

A full transcript will supposedly appear on the weekend, but you may want to see what these people had to say (and this is where Phil Harrison is being reported as saying Sony missed the social-gaming trick that he was trying to get them into). Sounds like they were being frank.

http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=9261&Itemid=2

 

[Arwin]

Yeah, I noticed that comment from Phil from Eurogamer. It suddenly falls into place - SCEE was really strong in Europe with Buzz, Singstar and EyeToy. I've always wondered why they weren't big things in the other countries, and now we know - SCEA and SCEJ just didn't get it.

 

[slider]

Some surprisingly frank answers in there.

BTW Shifty, the thread title has no typo what-so-ever.

 

[Entropy]

It's a bit embarrassing how Phil Harrison goes on about non-tangibles and servers and connectivity, while then having to admit that it doesn't seem to interest the consumers much. Goes on to try to put down the Wii and finishes up by showing that he doesn't understand the social networking scene. Sad.

 

[slider]

*Dum de doo de dum. Nothing to see here. La-de-daa-de-daa...*

It's a bit embarrassing how Phil Harrison goes on about non-tangibles and servers and connectivity, while then having to admit that it doesn't seem to interest the consumers much. Goes on to try to put down the Wii and finishes up by showing that he doesn't understand the social networking scene. Sad.

Anything specific in mind? I had just had a quick re-read and apart from making the point about Nintendo first party games being very succesful nothing really struck me in that way.

 

[-tkf-]

It's a bit embarrassing how Phil Harrison goes on about non-tangibles and servers and connectivity, while then having to admit that it doesn't seem to interest the consumers much. Goes on to try to put down the Wii and finishes up by showing that he doesn't understand the social networking scene. Sad.

Uhh? not sure i was wearing the same glasses as you when i read the piece.

Nice piece btw thanks for link.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

It's a bit embarrassing how Phil Harrison goes on about non-tangibles and servers and connectivity, while then having to admit that it doesn't seem to interest the consumers much. Goes on to try to put down the Wii and finishes up by showing that he doesn't understand the social networking scene. Sad.

Like others I'm not seeing that, but I'll remind you these are sound-bites out of content. Better wait for the full transcript to really see people's positions. Clearly there was a consensus though that things were changing!

 

[slider]

Well played Shifty. That's why you're a mod.

 

[pipo]

Yeah, I noticed that comment from Phil from Eurogamer. It suddenly falls into place - SCEE was really strong in Europe with Buzz, Singstar and EyeToy. I've always wondered why they weren't big things in the other countries, and now we know - SCEA and SCEJ just didn't get it.

Still strange. He's President of the world wide studios for crying out loud. He's gotta have some power.

Anyway, Phil's ok. He looks like a highly intelligent person too.

It's a shame we can't discuss all those interviews anymore, because I would have loved to start a decent conversation about that Steinberg interview on GamesIndustry.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Still strange. He's President of the world wide studios for crying out loud. He's gotta have some power.

He can only arrange for games to be made. He isn't in charge of advertising or hardware product positioning, and he can't start an advertising campaign the splashes PlayStation's social gaming everywhere.

 

[Entropy]

Like others I'm not seeing that, but I'll remind you these are sound-bites out of content. Better wait for the full transcript to really see people's positions. Clearly there was a consensus though that things were changing!

You're right, his comments would probably give a different impression in the full context.
Interesting group of people, although it is a bit odd that Nintendo who makes both the best selling console and the best selling handheld isn't represented.

 

[patsu]

It's a bit embarrassing how Phil Harrison goes on about non-tangibles and servers and connectivity, while then having to admit that it doesn't seem to interest the consumers much. Goes on to try to put down the Wii and finishes up by showing that he doesn't understand the social networking scene. Sad.

Live performance is hard isn't it ? It may be straight from the gut comments/impressions, past experiences, personal theories, etc. which require some editing to make coherent. This is just my interpretations...


Phil seems a firm believer in social gaming and digital distribution. On social gaming being next-gen, I think Nintendo's approach is more economical/lean and effective. It does not require much infrastructure to play Wii except your hands. You have fun with people in the same room. It's more engaging because the simple actions and large movements draw everyone in (instead of relatively complex finger exercises).

Large scale social gaming that involve servers is on another level of business. It may require next-gen users, netizens, to appreciate. In that sense, it's somewhat exclusive only to certain growing segment of consumers (Social gaming != Network gaming). I'd imagine PS2's SingStar, Buzz and EyeToy all have pretty interesting local experiences to drive their successes (although I'd admit I have not played PS2 Buzz and SingStar).

As for putting down Wii, I think it's just his personal reaction. He admired Nintendo's performances, lamented at Sony's own failure, but ultimately chose to wear his Sony hat.

Still strange. He's President of the world wide studios for crying out loud. He's gotta have some power.

Yeah... I was thinking he may be referring to the XMB/System guys. He may need them to deliver some building blocks for his social networking programme, but the department was (still is ?) swarmed with requests from all over the world and had to prioritize.

EDIT: On Phil's digital distribution comment, I have a slightly different view from him. I recognize the numbers and studies on young people moving away from packaged goods, but I also think that the packaged goods people will continue to innovate to stay relevant. Blu-ray should be able to do/bridge both storage and digital distribution. For now, they have to grow the footprint first. Pronto.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Interesting group of people, although it is a bit odd that Nintendo who makes both the best selling console and the best selling handheld isn't represented.

I thought that, but then Nintendo tend to just keep themselves to themselves. That's probably a good reason why MS and Sony get so much internet attention despite Nintendo eclipsing them on hardware sales, because Nintendo don't offer anything beyond the hardware to play on, whereas the others provide sound-bites, tools talk, networking schemes, and all sorts of stuff. They're kinda isolated, creating their own hardware and selling their own software on it, and not really gelling with the rest of the industry AFAICS. Of course you don't need to when you're being as successful as them!

 

[pipo]

He can only arrange for games to be made.

Ah. Of course. Now I get what Arwin tried to say too. Cheers!

Yeah... I was thinking he may be referring to the XMB/System guys. He may need them to deliver some building blocks for his social networking programme, but the department was (still is ?) swarmed with requests from all over the world and had to prioritize.

Or the he didn't get the new controllers he wanted...

 

[Arwin]

Ah. Of course. Now I get what Arwin tried to say too. Cheers!

Or the he didn't get the new controllers he wanted...

And don't forget that he only just got the world wide studios position in 2005.

 

[patsu]

Or the he didn't get the new controllers he wanted...

Which controller ?

I want my Batarang back Sony.

 

[pipo]

Which controller ?

I had nothing special in mind.

I want my Batarang back Sony.

Well, if there's one controller that could make a return...

/coat

 

[....]

It's a bit embarrassing how Phil Harrison goes on about non-tangibles and servers and connectivity, while then having to admit that it doesn't seem to interest the consumers much. Goes on to try to put down the Wii and finishes up by showing that he doesn't understand the social networking scene. Sad.

I don't think the social gaming scene is that big, when you discount nintendo's cult followers from generations past, hardcore gamers input, and budget consumers. I will have to see how they do in the years to follow, they've basically had one year on the market, a large chunk of sales have been gobbled up in large parts by hardcore gamers(who tend to buy every console), and hardcore nintendo fans(some buy separately for themselves, to give to their girlfriends, to their kids, to their parents, to their relatives, to their friends, etc.).

In the years to come as most hardcore fans, as well as nintendo cult followers have been satisfied, and it is to the casuals directly that it would be selling, it will be interesting to see what happens. Especially once we have the other 2 higher value consoles at reasonable below 300 dollar price points. I know at school, kids saying let's play wii-fit on wii, will definitely not go as well as let's play GTAV coop on ps360.

Late this generation, a sub $300, ps3 with recordable blu-ray might become an option, regaining vhs like functionality for HD content.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I don't think the social gaming scene is that big, when you discount nintendo's cult followers from generations past, hardcore gamers input, and budget consumers. I will have to see how they do in the years to follow, they've basically had one year on the market, a large chunk of sales have been gobbled up in large parts by hardcore gamers(who tend to buy every console), and hardcore nintendo fans(some buy separately for themselves, to give to their girlfriends, to their kids, to their parents, to their relatives, to their friends, etc.).

And all those reports of grannies and mum's playing Wii are make believe? I'd like to see some real facts that hardcore gamers are buying Wii en masse rather than enjoying their traditional games in HD on the other consoles. I'd also like evidence of this Nintendo fanbase that'll buy Wii no matter what, that same fanbase that bought 50 million SNES, 30 million N64s , and 21 million GCs. Those Nintendo fans didn't buy up GC as quickly as Wii is being bought. Neither did the hardcore gamers. Your theory says GC should have being bought as quickly. I know people who have never cared for console gaming get a Wii, which IMO is clear proof they're reaching a different audience, and the advertising strategy used has to be providing a good part of that. It's also basic common sense that social gaming would be a big drive, as human beings are by nature social animals. We enjoy getting together, and the chance to play computer games together is going to appeal in the same way board games or party games or sitting around watching a movie will.

Late this generation, a sub $300, ps3 with recordable blu-ray might become an option, regaining vhs like functionality for HD content.

And a sub-$300 Wii with BluRay media device could be launched too, with inbuilt HDD for PVR functions out of the box. Which has nothing to do with the social scene and its impact on gaming, so is off topic.

 

[....]

blu-ray wii , how about dvd wii first?

As for the gamecube even though it offered nothing new, had limited nintendo first party support, and a backlash from nintendo fans on both the h/w design and some of the software(e.g. celda.), it still managed to sell around 20M.

This time the wii launched with a hardcore nintendo fans dream, a realistic zelda, followed by a new mario, at a very low price.

I also didn't say the social gaming scene was nonexistent, just smaller than believed. In this generation many hardcore gamers might first buy a wii as a second or first console due to the high prices, especially initially, of the two other consoles, something that was not the case last generation, where the cube would likely have been last on the purchase list.

If nintendo remains with paltry basically absent online, lacking third party support, no dvd/bluray playback. The large 120+M playstation base will eventually move to a console that can support what they've grown accustomed to, and has THE GAMES, franchises, and sequels they're used to buying.

Also VHS like functionality in the HD era is important and could be a factor if included on future low cost ps3 versions. DVD/BLURAY/RECORDER + 3rd party GAMES + ONLINE will attract many many people, and will be a factor when choosing a similar priced console without such.

Things like GTA missing will be big on perception though, not everyone buys it, people share it, go to their friends houses to play it, etc. Not being able to do so, when all the kids at school are doing it will obviously cause wii parents to have to consider if not outright buy another console.