Framework PCs

[Silent_Buddha]

Holy cow, I just saw my dream laptop. If I didn't already have a Surface Book 2 which is still doing just great, I'd be pre-ordering one of these right now.

A COMPLETELY Upgradeable Laptop? - YouTube

Previously I'd kind of wanted a Panasonic Toughbook purely because of the ability to change and upgrade individual components easily. But since it's meant for use in non-standard laptop environments, it's ruggedness means it's not only really expensive but bulky and well REALLY bulky.

So, here's Frame.Work coming in with a really impressive machine that shows that you can have a sexy ultraportable that is also super easily serviceable.

On your laptop you want HDMI instead of DP? Just change it. You want all USB-C and no USB-A? Just change it. You want HDMI, DP, USB-C and USB-A? Just change it. You only need 1 thunderbolt USB-C? Just do it and toss in SSDs in the other 3 ports.

Hell since you can change it on the fly, you can just bring along extra modules. Replace the display out module with an SSD module then just swap in the display out module when you need it.

Want to disconnect the battery because you'll be using it on mains power whenever you use it for an extended period of time? Just do it and save wear and tear on the battery pack. Want to change the keyboard? Go for it.

Man, it was almost like this laptop was built just for me! User upgradable, user repairable, user configurable on the go? Hells yeah.

Oh and it has a 3:2 aspect ration screen. My god, I'm tempted to get one anyway, even though I don't really need a new laptop. Hell, it's not even super expensive for that functionality.

Apple? Screw off.
Microsoft? Screw Off.
Dell, HP, Lenovo, etc.? Screw off.

C'mere Framework, you're my new best buddy.

Framework | Framework Laptop pre-orders are now open

Since the screen is also extremely easily replaceable hopefully they'll come out with more display options in the future.

Regards,
SB

 

[SpaceBeer]

There are few reviews already, and the people who had the chance to use it, agree this is a great product. And I would say price is also fair. For some users 4c/8t Tiger Lake might not be enough, but in this form factor, it should be good. Also it might be possible to replace MB in future (and maybe RAM if next arch it's succeeded by DDR5).

I doubt I will need new laptop in next year or two, but in such case, this would be my first choice.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Interesting update from Linus. Not what I was expecting from a video from him.

TL: DV (too long didn't view ): This is the first laptop he's purchased with his own money in something like 16 years. He's invested in the company. Interesting discourse on why it isn't as easy to make money as a company as many people seem to think it is. A good watch.

Regards,
SB

 

[zed]

Looks very nice, if I was in the market for a laptop this would be worthy of consideration
The only thing is the intel CPU's my last CPU was an intel and the fan noise annoyed me so much (I had to have it underclocked all the time) I would prefer to have AMD (my current PC is much quieter) or even better something by arm like the M1 (though I dont want apple)

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Looks very nice, if I was in the market for a laptop this would be worthy of consideration
The only thing is the intel CPU's my last CPU was an intel and the fan noise annoyed me so much (I had to have it underclocked all the time) I would prefer to have AMD (my current PC is much quieter) or even better something by arm like the M1 (though I dont want apple)

Yeah, Linus was talking to them about trying to get AMD into their laptops and it's something they are working on.

If they made something like the Surface Book with an AMD CPU, I'd probably get one even though my Surface Book 2 is still fine for the most part. I've gotten so used to using the touch screen in conjunction with the keyboard, that I'd really want a touch screen. And it's been extremely handy at times being able to detach the screen and just hand it to someone.

Regards,
SB

 

[Cyan]

well, it could be the safest way to have a great computer at a reasonable price nowadays.

From immemorial times we call those "cloned computers", which is the typical PC build of old. Given the current crisis we are into, this might be the best alternative, specially in a mobile world.

"Clone computers" are very expensive nowadays, 'cos most of them are meant to be built by gamers, and there is an important market around that.

 

[eastmen]

Its really interesting here are some thoughts

1) I wish it was a bit fatter in the back. The cooling is okay for lower chips but if you want to use this to game on vacation its goin to be a toaster oven. I would have liked to see them give it a bit more hight for taller fins.
2) Why ram side by side instead of stacked like how most laptops do it ? Seems like a lot of wasted room . They could have added another nvme drive slot or used that extra room for better cooling
3) I also feel like the expansion cards are bigger than they need to be or some of them should have been more than one port ? Like the USB c one , looks like you can easily have 2 usb c ports on there or you could have had one that was micro sd and usb c . Or again why not hve a micro display port and usb c on a single one ? Lots of wasted space imo

Otherwise it looks pretty good

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Its really interesting here are some thoughts

1) I wish it was a bit fatter in the back. The cooling is okay for lower chips but if you want to use this to game on vacation its goin to be a toaster oven. I would have liked to see them give it a bit more hight for taller fins.
2) Why ram side by side instead of stacked like how most laptops do it ? Seems like a lot of wasted room . They could have added another nvme drive slot or used that extra room for better cooling
3) I also feel like the expansion cards are bigger than they need to be or some of them should have been more than one port ? Like the USB c one , looks like you can easily have 2 usb c ports on there or you could have had one that was micro sd and usb c . Or again why not hve a micro display port and usb c on a single one ? Lots of wasted space imo

Otherwise it looks pretty good

For [1], it's an ultraportable, thus it has all the benefits and drawbacks of an ultraportable. It's not meant to challenge Alienware gaming notebooks. It's mean to go head to head with ultraportables from Dell, HP, etc. Maybe in the future they'll make a gaming oriented laptop, but they are doing the the right thing by focusing on one market segment first.

For [2], it's an ultraportable. Due to space restrictions for an ultra portable all of the best ones have ram situated like that. Take the HP Envy line of notebooks, for example (Removing and Replacing the Memory Module for HP ENVY 15-u000 x360 Convertible PCs | HP® Customer Support ). Or my Surface Book 2 ... oh wait I can't replace the memory in that since it's soldered to the board. Or the modern Apple MacBook Pro ... oh wait the memory is soldered on the board and you'd void the warranty opening it up anyway. OK, amendment, all the best Ultraportables that even allow you to replace the RAM, are like that.

For [3], regardless of how small or large they can make them, they all have to be a uniform size because they are swappable. The same expansion slot that provides a USB-C port also needs to be able to provide a wired ethernet connector or a USB-A port or a full sized HDMI/DisplayPort connector. Thus all of the expansion cards are a uniform size. It's a small price to pay to be able to easily swap out connectors and customize the laptop to the configuration you need at any given moment.

Remember, this was made by former Apple, HP, and Dell engineers who wanted to dispell the myth that a thin and sexy Ultraportable has to be a locked down device that is not user serviceable because it's an Ultraportable. They were tired of perfectly good laptops being discarded just because, the CPU fan (for example) was going out on a hard to service MacBook Pro, for example. Or if the battery life is going to shit, instead of throwing it away like a MacBook Pro, just very VERY easily replace the battery.

You can easily change and swap out and service pretty much everything in the device. Keyboard, memory, storage, ports, battery, MB, display bezel, CPU heatsink/fan assembly, etc. Once you open it up, there's even handly icons and text to help you remove and change components inside of the device.

Regards,
SB

 

[eastmen]

For [1], it's an ultraportable, thus it has all the benefits and drawbacks of an ultraportable. It's not meant to challenge Alienware gaming notebooks. It's mean to go head to head with ultraportables from Dell, HP, etc. Maybe in the future they'll make a gaming oriented laptop, but they are doing the the right thing by focusing on one market segment first.

For [2], it's an ultraportable. Due to space restrictions for an ultra portable all of the best ones have ram situated like that. Take the HP Envy line of notebooks, for example (Removing and Replacing the Memory Module for HP ENVY 15-u000 x360 Convertible PCs | HP® Customer Support ). Or my Surface Book 2 ... oh wait I can't replace the memory in that since it's soldered to the board. Or the modern Apple MacBook Pro ... oh wait the memory is soldered on the board and you'd void the warranty opening it up anyway. OK, amendment, all the best Ultraportables that even allow you to replace the RAM, are like that.

For [3], regardless of how small or large they can make them, they all have to be a uniform size because they are swappable. The same expansion slot that provides a USB-C port also needs to be able to provide a wired ethernet connector or a USB-A port or a full sized HDMI/DisplayPort connector. Thus all of the expansion cards are a uniform size. It's a small price to pay to be able to easily swap out connectors and customize the laptop to the configuration you need at any given moment.

Remember, this was made by former Apple, HP, and Dell engineers who wanted to dispell the myth that a thin and sexy Ultraportable has to be a locked down device that is not user serviceable because it's an Ultraportable. They were tired of perfectly good laptops being discarded just because, the CPU fan (for example) was going out on a hard to service MacBook Pro, for example. Or if the battery life is going to shit, instead of throwing it away like a MacBook Pro, just very VERY easily replace the battery.

You can easily change and swap out and service pretty much everything in the device. Keyboard, memory, storage, ports, battery, MB, display bezel, CPU heatsink/fan assembly, etc. Once you open it up, there's even handly icons and text to help you remove and change components inside of the device.

Regards,
SB

@Silent_Buddha

1) Still would have been ultra portable with a slightly thicker back . Unless ultra portables are designed around children.
2) I don't buy ultra portables so i wouldn't know. I use a surface tablet for travel Seems like i said above a little more fat in the trunk could fix this .
3) Still doesn't explain why the smaller connections can't have two of them or multiple of them on one block. Like I said if you can fit a usb c and a mini/micro display port in the same space as a display port why not do so ? Your wasting a ton of space on an already limited form factor


I don't dislike the idea , maybe a non ultra portable will appeal to me more with some of my concerns addressed.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

I grow more and more impressed by this company.

At this point I can't imagine buying a standard laptop computing device (Windows, Linux or even Mac) from anyone other than this company.

Hopefully, at some point in the future they will be able to offer AMD CPU options.

Regards,
SB

 

[swaaye]

It's certainly been a hot topic forever, but I'm not sure notebook upgradability matters to me. Notebooks often get a lot of wear in their lives and physically fall apart in the long term unlike a hearty steel desktop case. And the hardware changes so drastically in the long term I might as well replace the entire thing anyway (ideally with a discounted year old used machine hehe).

 

[Silent_Buddha]

It's certainly been a hot topic forever, but I'm not sure notebook upgradability matters to me. Notebooks often get a lot of wear in their lives and physically fall apart in the long term unlike a hearty steel desktop case. And the hardware changes so drastically in the long term I might as well replace the entire thing anyway (ideally with a discounted year old used machine hehe).

Upgradability is only part of it. Being able to have it serviced easily and more reliably at shops other than the maker is the other big one. IE - making repairs more affordable and not subject to a manufacturer deciding that X device is no longer going to be repaired by them.

If that video is correct, then Framework are the only laptop maker that will provide detailed schematics to 3rd party repair shops in addition to any parts they may need to repair a device.

And another part of that is making a design that isn't prohibitively expensive to repair (thus encouraging disposal of the entire device rather than repairing the device) so that less e-waste potentially goes into landfills or 3rd world countries where they contribute to toxic pollution from attempting to recycle them.

Regards,
SB

 

[swaaye]

The only time I've needed to send a notebook in for repair is for defects and those are taken care of under warranty.

Mainstream notebooks also tend to be parted out and there are spare parts available from everybody's favorite auction site.

But like the barebone notebooks such as from Clevo that are almost build from scratch and modular, and curious crowd funded mobile devices, it is cool to see another development.

 

[eastmen]

Upgradability is only part of it. Being able to have it serviced easily and more reliably at shops other than the maker is the other big one. IE - making repairs more affordable and not subject to a manufacturer deciding that X device is no longer going to be repaired by them.

If that video is correct, then Framework are the only laptop maker that will provide detailed schematics to 3rd party repair shops in addition to any parts they may need to repair a device.

And another part of that is making a design that isn't prohibitively expensive to repair (thus encouraging disposal of the entire device rather than repairing the device) so that less e-waste potentially goes into landfills or 3rd world countries where they contribute to toxic pollution from attempting to recycle them.

Regards,
SB

I might get one when my surface pro 6 dies. Was thinkin I could get myself a model and then when I am ready to upgrade a large portion of it , take those parts and make my nephew one and just have parts cycle down from me to him to my niece eventually. I am the only one who upgrades constantly. Then again I am hoping for the neo to rise again

 

[tuna]

Get me a 4k screen and I will consider this!