Digital Foundry Article Technical Discussion [2020]

Discussion in 'Console Technology' started by Shifty Geezer, Jan 2, 2020.

  1. Mskx

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2019
    Messages:
    181
    Likes Received:
    188
    If USB type A ends up in the final console i wonder if it is because of mouse and keyboard support?
     
  2. AzBat

    AzBat Agent of the Bat
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2002
    Messages:
    6,698
    Likes Received:
    2,883
    Location:
    Alma, AR
    Think about it. What kind of devices do you typically connect to your console... Hard Drive, USB cable(for controller), Webcam, Mouse & Keyboard. Majority of all devices that fit those categories are probably still using USB type A. You could always use a USB-A to USB-C adapter if you need it, but yes the same can be said if it had USB type C instead I guess. :/

    Tommy McClain
     
  3. turkey

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2014
    Messages:
    921
    Likes Received:
    634
    Location:
    London
    A to C will half the bandwidth and massively reduce the power supplied.

    That said we have no idea on HDD upgrade / expansion path. A is probably mandatory to a point to make it possible to transfer games off the Xbox One

    I would like A and C really, especially with the idea of VR virtual link on C just in case they dabble in it. I suspect if they are throwing this much power at it the generation will be long, and who knows what will emerge. Not having high bandwidth expansion ports seems a poor choice.

    The one thing that instantly struck me was port location, central. I assume no riser boards for cost reasons so the mobo is right up the middle?

    With all that APU cooling what on earth needs that much space on the rear of the board? The disc drive is quite slim compared to this case design.
     
    AzBat likes this.
  4. BRiT

    BRiT Verified (╯°□°)╯
    Moderator Legend Alpha

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    15,949
    Likes Received:
    14,881
    Location:
    Cleveland
    Hopefully XSX has support for bluetooth devices, so keyboards, mice, cameras can just connect over bluetooth. Though I dont know if BT has enough bandwidth for streaming cameras or not.

    One could also use usb C to A cables for older devices, but that's additional $10 cost to the user, or usb C to mini-usb/micro-usb. That's how I imagine I'll connect my old XO external drives.
     
    AzBat likes this.
  5. Barrabas

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2005
    Messages:
    327
    Likes Received:
    276
    Location:
    Norway
    Df Direct - Preparing for PS5 and Xbox Series X: Performance Analysis Tools Revamp
     
  6. BRiT

    BRiT Verified (╯°□°)╯
    Moderator Legend Alpha

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    15,949
    Likes Received:
    14,881
    Location:
    Cleveland
    Interesting look at the tool set used by DF. I'd still like to see a write-up detailing them.
     
  7. Cyan

    Cyan orange
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2007
    Messages:
    9,063
    Likes Received:
    2,674
    hey hey, that's quite the improvement. Anything that makes your life easier leads to better videos and more detailed information. Richard sounds as if they were working on a Disney Pixar render farm before xD
     
    Rootax likes this.
  8. turkey

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2014
    Messages:
    921
    Likes Received:
    634
    Location:
    London
    I am surprised they did not have Virtualdub in the mix beforehand, it is an amazing tool for frame serving.

    I think whoever has been working on their process has made some massive strides in reducing lost time. This is great for their team moral I suspect as much and of course our viewing pleasure.

    One question is how will there be a test of screen tearing if you only have the encoded output? I assumed you just checked the first X pixels in each row down the screen to look for a prior frame match and then new data. I assume their flickering red line was the sampled data.

    Also does this new setup aid HDR in any way?

    I cannot get HDR via YouTube so would be interested to know how their offline files stack up.
     
    Cyan likes this.
  9. PSman1700

    Veteran Newcomer

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2019
    Messages:
    2,703
    Likes Received:
    903


    A look on what to expect from PS5, and XSX for the ones that get that.
     
  10. DavidGraham

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2009
    Messages:
    3,287
    Likes Received:
    3,546
    I wish DF does some analysis on Deliver Us The Moon too.
     
    pharma and PSman1700 like this.
  11. PSman1700

    Veteran Newcomer

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2019
    Messages:
    2,703
    Likes Received:
    903
    DF has some coverage coming about Star Citizen, very interesting as maybe next gen console games will look like that (late gen perhaps then).
     
  12. Jupiter

    Veteran Newcomer

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2015
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    1,062
    Mvidias DLSS became very impressive over time. Much better than that ugly checkerboard rendering/interlacing stuff. This tech is the future.
     
    turkey, pharma, Cyan and 1 other person like this.
  13. PSman1700

    Veteran Newcomer

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2019
    Messages:
    2,703
    Likes Received:
    903
    It was critized on forums back then, it was all nothing and checkerboarding was much better. Oh what things have improved over time.
     
    pharma and Jupiter like this.
  14. Jupiter

    Veteran Newcomer

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2015
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    1,062
    Interlacing will never be a very good solution. There was a reason why it is also used less and less in television. I only use it when I want to make static screenshots. The id engine is also very fast. Most other engines can't even get the this visuals at half the fps.
     
    PSman1700 likes this.
  15. Cyan

    Cyan orange
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2007
    Messages:
    9,063
    Likes Received:
    2,674
    DLSS is a boon for people with 4k screens. If it became the norm I'd get a 4k high refresh rate ultrawide curved monitor --wish I were rich. Plus nVidia promised better support for 3440x1440p screens. The 1080p native signal with DLSS looks arguably better than native 4k.
     
    PSman1700 and pharma like this.
  16. Cyan

    Cyan orange
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2007
    Messages:
    9,063
    Likes Received:
    2,674
    hehe, VirtualDub is a tool that I downloaded several times in the past just because I wanted it as a video player which could easily play frame by frame.

    Something I wonder is why they haven't used the framerate counter from nVidia for their videos. Instead of using 3rd party tools that eat resources, using the built-in framerate counter in nVidia Geforce Experience.

    Also, the Game bar from MS has a fps counter too, which being built at the OS level should also eat very little resources.
     
    #36 Cyan, Jan 16, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2020
  17. turkey

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2014
    Messages:
    921
    Likes Received:
    634
    Location:
    London
    I suspect it's the need for a frame time graph, Halo 3 is a good example here. I believe it has a pretty solid 30fps for the most part but the frame timing is off so it has a judder. Any conventional tool will show 30fps.

    Microsoft themselves failed to detect this because they used more conventional tools. This specifically made them change their testing.

    Also if they use the same system they can more easily integrate different sources into the same analysis. Same workflow, same video fidelity, and I would think confidence that a rogue driver update will not dissrupt the workflow.
     
    milk and BRiT like this.
  18. turkey

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2014
    Messages:
    921
    Likes Received:
    634
    Location:
    London
    A new video on doom



    Intersting on the 35fps game logic. I wonder if Xbox S/X with freesync ,or 120hz output could give a smooth performance with a suitable display.
     
  19. turkey

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2014
    Messages:
    921
    Likes Received:
    634
    Location:
    London


    120hz and vrs is here already, great vid
     
    Cyan and BRiT like this.
  20. PSman1700

    Veteran Newcomer

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2019
    Messages:
    2,703
    Likes Received:
    903
    Has been since atleast 2018 for VRS, 120hz even longer ago.
     
    Cyan likes this.
Loading...

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Beyond3D has been around for over a decade and prides itself on being the best place on the web for in-depth, technically-driven discussion and analysis of 3D graphics hardware. If you love pixels and transistors, you've come to the right place!

    Beyond3D is proudly published by GPU Tools Ltd.
Loading...