With all the talk about the PS3(and some about Xbox2)......

[Fox5]

What do you think the next Nintendo console, assuming there is one, will have? So far what I know about it is
CPU designed or produced by NEC

And that's it. I'd guess NEC will only produce the CPU, but who knows, maybe it will even have powerVR technology integrated into it, making for a potentially kickass gaming cpu. As for a gpu, I think their only choice would be grabbing whatever ATI has at the time, unless they've started working on something. Though if the next system did have powervr technlogy, I could see them passing on ATI completely, especially if microsoft goes ATI. The other alternative I could see would be stepping out of the console business and making a gameboy advance that can also hook up to TVs, either a mini version of the gamecube+gameboy player, or something with powerVR technology. Oh yeah, I also still don't see nintendo having any serious Internet gaming, and probably will go for a $200 or lower price point.(Unless they really want to compete with the PS3 on an equal or better technology level.)

 

[zurich]

I still think the next Nintendo console will have its portable counterpart integrated.. not bundled, but say, the controllers ARE the GBA2. GamerFeed ripped off my idea and wrote a feature on it :?

http://www.gamerfeed.com/index.php?ftrid=137

Bleh. But I think this will be of paramount importance to Nintendo, in order to truly leverage their handheld dominance into the console world.

 

[Fox5]

I think not, the handheld would be too expensive as a controller. Besides, could you imagine stuffing any console's controller into your pocket? Or would you want to play a console game with a gameboy as a controller? It'd be nice to have a screen on the controller, but I think they'd either have to build it into the controller(with perhaps a cartridge port and they can make the console play the gameboy games, or at least be able to read them) or perhaps make it detachable and you can switch it between gameboy and the next console(unlikely, people would lose it) or how about a mount on the controller just to stick a gameboy on? Or maybe the controller can be detachable and like the buttons come off, and you clip the gameboy onto the handles. Or maybe nintendo will just be nintendo and not do any cool ideas.(Besides, despite what nintendo says, I still think Internet connectivity is better than gba connectivity, it is more practical and actually has a purpose rather than a cheap gimmick...who wants to get together to play a console game looking at a 2 inch screen when you have a 27 inch tv right in front of you? Also, as xbox live has shown, people are willing to shell out money for even just peer to peer connections, but I don't think any gamecube games have sold well because they link up to gba, sure pokemon colloseum will but that is only data transfer not using a little screen.)

 

[Evil_Cloud]

I hope someone will use Dreamcast's VMU idea ... :/

 

[Grall]

I foresee Nintendo with GPU from ATi, Microsoft PROBABLY with GPU from Nvidia (ATI doesn't have resources to handle both, besides would be risky with possible conflicts of interest, possible problems with either customer crying foul regarding IP theft by the other etc).

Nintendo will PROBABLY use an evolved IBM G5 processor as CPU. Dual (or more) Altivec units plus hyperthreading seem likely. IBM guys hint as much at such research already taking place in a recent Ars Technica interview. More cache etc, whatever else might happen with the core over the course of two years seem natural.

Microsoft *WILL* use CPU by Intel and that CPU will be a version of P4, that's almost a definite. M$ is inexperienced with non-x86 apart from Itanic (and anyone thinking that power-sucking monster will be used is plain NUTS, lol). AMDs Opteron/Athlon 64 is unsuited for UMA, the on-chip memory controller is grossly underpowered. Of course, M$ could choose to not do UMA in XB2, and then AMDs approach would likely be superior, but AMD also lacks in fab capacity. They have no interest in selling millions of CPUs on the cheap to M$ when they can sell them to computer manufacturers and home users for much better profit margins.

Intel CPU will probably be tejas core, but NOT 6GHz. Prescott will be old hat by 05, and Intel will want to get it away from its product lines methinks. Core differences between prescott and tejas is fairly small; tejas will keep same L2, get slightly bigger L1 and trace caches, maybe better hype-threading etc, but those changes will be minimal in comparison to the rest of the die. Tejas will get more SSE3 instructions too afaik, which M$ would likely want in their console.

Methinks 4GHz tejas, but that's admittedly a guess. Could be shrunken prescott too, but I don't know if Intel will take that core down a notch in process size, and if they don't, M$ will have a hard time making their machine cost-efficient just like this time 'round. Tejas will appear at .65, of that I'm sure. If not at launch of XB2, then a while later, and hence M$ can save money. We gotta think long-term here. XB2 might be around til 2010 (the year we make contact ), is M$ still going to buy .9 chips seven years from now?


*G*

 

[silhouette]

Intel CPU will probably be tejas core, but NOT 6GHz. Prescott will be old hat by 05, and Intel will want to get it away from its product lines methinks. Core differences between prescott and tejas is fairly small; tejas will keep same L2, get slightly bigger L1 and trace caches, maybe better hype-threading etc, but those changes will be minimal in comparison to the rest of the die. Tejas will get more SSE3 instructions too afaik, which M$ would likely want in their console.

Methinks 4GHz tejas, but that's admittedly a guess. Could be shrunken prescott too, but I don't know if Intel will take that core down a notch in process size, and if they don't, M$ will have a hard time making their machine cost-efficient just like this time 'round. Tejas will appear at .65, of that I'm sure. If not at launch of XB2, then a while later, and hence M$ can save money. We gotta think long-term here. XB2 might be around til 2010 (the year we make contact ), is M$ still going to buy .9 chips seven years from now?
*G*

I don't expect anything around 4 Ghz (not from Intel especially).. The consoles does not have lots of space to provide enough cooling for a heater like Intel processors (a 0.9U 3.6 Prescott draws like 100W, which means lots of heat, which means requirement for very special cooling). Also 0.65u may not be ready when xboxII is out.. It may be an Intel processor, most likely a Prescott core, but running at very slow speeds like 2 Ghz to minimize power dissipation.. I guess even a 2 Ghz machine with a very powerful graphics core would make it very feaible for another 5 years..

 

[Panajev2001a]

(and anyone thinking that power-sucking monster will be used is plain NUTS, lol)

Cough... shrunk Deerfield ( 90 nm IPF )... cough...

 

[Grall]

I don't expect anything around 4 Ghz (not from Intel especially)

If PS3 Cell is announced to hit 4GHz, can we really expect M$ to go with 2?

They're bound to be deathly afraid to be seen as inferior, especially as they're running a very definite risk of getting steamrollered by Sony all over again like last time...

There's no way they can spin 2GHz 32-bit CPU vs. 4GHz 128-bit CPU (or cluster of 36 CPUs really) to be seen as anything other than grossly weak in comparison. Of course, that assumes Cell really DOES hit the magic 4GHz barrier, of which I am somewhat sceptical, but for argument's sake I'm assuming it will.


*G*

 

[Fox5]

Nintendo will PROBABLY use an evolved IBM G5 processor as CPU. Dual (or more) Altivec units plus hyperthreading seem likely. IBM guys hint as much at such research already taking place in a recent Ars Technica interview. More cache etc, whatever else might happen with the core over the course of two years seem natural.

If they're going with IBM, why don't they try to get a piece of the cell pie too? Anyhow, would a G5 really be competitive, I doubt you'd even see a 2 Ghz one in the PC market by the time nintendo's next system comes out, let alone in a console.(the G line has never really been much for mhz...and I don't know how the G5 compares to other cpus)
Oh yeah, and the reason I think NEC may be doing a cpu for nintendo's next system is http://www.planetgamecube.com/news.cfm?action=item&id=3785 this article. It mentions NEC and Nintendo may co-develop a processor for their next system.

 

[jvd]

nintendo with x 86 - 64 from amd. Thats my guess.

 

[DeadmeatGA]

...

Ninendo will drop its console hardware biz to focus on GBA series.

 

[zurich]

Re: ...

Ninendo will drop its console hardware biz to focus on GBA series.

Not while they're still in the black, which they are.

 

[notAFanB]

next gen? that depends on the stubborness of Nintendo HQ. but yes in the long term a 2 horse race makes it look like they are out.

 

[DeadmeatGA]

...

The sad thing is that Nintendo created the position they are in today; had Nintendo not killed the PlayStation(SNES CD), they would still be ruling....

 

[notAFanB]

Re: ...

The sad thing is that Nintendo created the position they are in today; had Nintendo not killed the PlayStation(SNES CD), they would still be ruling....

if not Sony then someone else. what was a major contributor to they demise is the sheer arogence that the public will *wait* tirelessly for they products (the war was effectively over by the time n64 made an appearence). had they been competitive around the PS1/Saturn era things may have turned out differently. (whoops trailing off here).

 

[keegdsb]

Nintendo will PROBABLY use an evolved IBM G5 processor as CPU. Dual (or more) Altivec units plus hyperthreading seem likely. IBM guys hint as much at such research already taking place in a recent Ars Technica interview. More cache etc, whatever else might happen with the core over the course of two years seem natural.

If they're going with IBM, why don't they try to get a piece of the cell pie too? Anyhow, would a G5 really be competitive, I doubt you'd even see a 2 Ghz one in the PC market by the time nintendo's next system comes out, let alone in a console.(the G line has never really been much for mhz...and I don't know how the G5 compares to other cpus)
Oh yeah, and the reason I think NEC may be doing a cpu for nintendo's next system is http://www.planetgamecube.com/news.cfm?action=item&id=3785 this article. It mentions NEC and Nintendo may co-develop a processor for their next system.

Uhm, isn't Apple making a dual 2GHz G5 machine now?

(Well, it isn't shipping yet)

 

[DeadmeatGA]

...

Companies almost certainly sign exclusivity clauses when they cooperate on certain project.

This means Nintendo cannot not turn to ATI(Xbox2) and IBM(PSX3) for whatever they are cooking, simply because MS and SCEI will not allow them to.

Nintendo may have no choice but to quit now.

 

[notAFanB]

Companies almost certainly sign exclusivity clauses when they cooperate on certain project.

on hardware and technolgy? yes. on trading (different hardware/tech) I'm not so sure of.

 

[PC-Engine]

I don't expect anything around 4 Ghz (not from Intel especially).. The consoles does not have lots of space to provide enough cooling for a heater like Intel processors (a 0.9U 3.6 Prescott draws like 100W, which means lots of heat, which means requirement for very special cooling). Also 0.65u may not be ready when xboxII is out.. It may be an Intel processor, most likely a Prescott core, but running at very slow speeds like 2 Ghz to minimize power dissipation.. I guess even a 2 Ghz machine with a very powerful graphics core would make it very feaible for another 5 years..

http://www.nec.co.jp/press/en/0306/3001.html

Main features of NEC's water-cooling module

(1) Through optimized design of the radiation plate and the ingenuity of the coolant passage configuration below the CPU attached area, a cooling performance of 80W (2 times that of conventional systems) is realized. Moreover, the optimized piezoelectric pump structure suppresses the operating noise up to the whisper level of about 30dB, in turn enabling highly efficient water-cooling performance.

(2) By development of a piezoelectric pump with higher water pressure and slimmer size (thickness 5mm), the thickness of the aluminum radiation plate that contains the water circulation channel is reduced to within 3 mm. The increase in the thickness of the chassis is reduced to 4mm, half that of conventional water-cooling methods.

(3) By integrating the aluminum radiation plate, the tank and the piezoelectric pump, ease of installation in personal computers and long-term reliability is achieved.

(4) Hermetical sealing is improved through the use of materials with little liquid permeability. In turn the size of the cooling liquid tank is reduced by 9/10 compared to conventional tanks.

Features of the conventional water-cooling system

(1) Water pressure of the electromagnetic centrifugal pump is relatively weak. If the thickness of the circulation channel is decreased, cooling-liquid flow is restricted.

(2) The system is difficult to install as the tank, pump and CPU attached area are all inter-connected to a metal pipe and a rubber tube.

(3) Installation of a large tank is necessary as cooling liquid seeps through the resin parts of the tank, pump and the connection tubes resulting in liquid reduction over time.

The water-cooling module developed by NEC is the slimmest model in the world. When installed in a notebook personal computer increase in thickness is minimized. In order to drive a conventional piezoelectric pump alternating voltage of 100V is necessary. However, with NEC's water-cooling module system the pump can be driven with 5V of direct voltage. As a result it is easy to install in all IT equipment. This product is suitable not only for use in notebook PCs, but also in servers and desktop computers. It is expected that it will be positioned as a core technology for spreading the water-cooling system in IT equipment and that it will be used as an alternative to the conventional water-cooling heat sink and heat pipe.

NEC Personal Products, Ltd. plans to commercially produce the water-cooling module within two years. NEC aims to create a de-facto industry standard and will actively work towards licensing supply of its module technology to parties outside the NEC Group.

That bit of info was for those doubters who keep claiming that water cooling is not viable in a console because of some mysterious law that says heat dissapation will be a problem.

 

[Josiah]

MS will likely want to keep costs down with XB2, I could see them going with a 2-3 GHz AMD CPU. maybe forget including a hard-disk with the system, and use a "trimmed down" version of R500.