Why you shouldn't blindly trust PR statements *cleanup*

Discussion in 'Architecture and Products' started by pharma, Jul 15, 2019.

  1. pharma

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    Update: Games supporting DLSS
    July 15, 2019
    https://www.kitguru.net/components/...rt-nvidias-ray-tracing-and-dlss-rtx-features/
     
  2. Ike Turner

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    How many of those game are actually out? Out of those how many actually have DLSS patched ? The damn thing is as good as dead. 90% of the games listed above will never have DLSS/RT support.

    Example: We Happy Few...
    https://steamcommunity.com/app/320240/discussions/0/1743358239833775643/
    7 months ago.nothing ever since..
    If you are a Dev all you need to do is promise &" look into it" and Nvidia will desperately add you to its fake list...
    If you needed more proof that those lists are nothing more than marketing crap...
     
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  3. pharma

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    The list is likely compiled from developer feedback on planned DLSS implementation. I notice Dying Light 2 is not on the list though they state to be experimenting with the feature. It's not a far stretch to assume other studios are also experimenting and if the result is satisfactory will include the feature.
     
  4. Shifty Geezer

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    That's what Ike has said. Mention you are looking into it, and you make the list. Doesn't mean it'll ever happen. Reminds me of all those consoles with promised launch titles etc., where they ended up with nothing. Basically, as a dev you register interest in case something proves worthwhile. If it doesn't, you don't do anything about it. So all 'this game is getting XYZ/releasing on platform's ABC' announcements can't ever be taken at face value. All such announcements are just, "if this tech goes anywhere, we'll be on board."

    The state of DLSS is the games released with it, and not the games associated with it. So as Ike says, which games actually have DLSS implemented (in its best, properly trained rendition and not the early form that's all blur)?
     
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  5. DavidGraham

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    It's almost guaranteed that any RTX game will support DLSS along side the RT features as a way to boost fps, as happened in Tomb Raider, Battlefield V and Metro Exodus, these games received DLSS even though they were not on the original initial list. NVIDIA also released demos for Justice and Atomic Hearts with DLSS support implemented, so the ground work for them is already done. DLSS was also added to Anthem, FF15 and Monster Hunter. It's also heavily expected that Vampires BLoodlines 2, MechWarrior, Cyperpunk and Call Of Duty will support DLSS since they are all confirmed to be RTX titles.
     
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  6. pharma

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    No that's not what Ike said.
    RT support??? Maybe you can explain again what he meant to say.
     
  7. Ike Turner

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    Directly from the horse's mouth below the list:
    https://nvidianews.nvidia.com/news/...racing-and-ai-to-barrage-of-blockbuster-games
    Summary: "We are probably full of shit but we legally don't care as long as we have people eating it up. Don't hate the playa. Hate the game!"

    Posting marketing crap from any company on this forum should become a bannable offense. Post technical presentations (papers/videos), third party benchmarks etc..But please spare us the PR BS once and for all.
     
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  8. pharma

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  9. BRiT

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    You mean the original PR piece which has items which have not materialized into actual DLSS support?
     
  10. pharma

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    There is currently DLSS support for some games on that list and for some games not listed that later added support for DLSS. I would not expect DLSS support for a game that has yet to be released.
    See @DavidGraham post above for the "materialized" DLSS supported games.
     
  11. BRiT

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  12. pharma

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    I suggest you re-read and note the DLSS list referred to is not the original Nvidia list but the list maintained by KitGuru site.
    Then continue to read @DavidGraham 's post.
     
  13. DavidGraham

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    NVIDIA's original and last list include 25 titles:
    • Ark: Survival Evolved
    • Atomic Heart
    • Dauntless
    • Final Fantasy XV: Windows Edition
    • Fractured Lands
    • Hitman 2
    • Islands of Nyne
    • Justice
    • JX3
    • Mechwarrior 5: Mercenaries
    • PlayerUnknown’s Battlegrounds
    • Remnant: From The Ashes
    • Serious Sam 4: Planet Badass
    • Shadow of the Tomb Raider
    • The Forge Arena from
    • We Happy Few from
    • Darksiders III from
    • Deliver Us The Moon: Fortuna
    • Fear The Wolves
    • Hellblade: Senua's Sacrifice
    • KINETIK
    • Outpost Zero
    • Overkill's The Walking Dead
    • SCUM from
    • Stormdivers
    https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/news/geforce-rtx-dlss-new-games-september-2018/
    https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforc...-new-technologies-in-rtx-graphics-cards/#dlss

    Out of that list, only these titles made the cut:
    • Shadow of the Tomb Raider
    • Final Fantasy XV
    • Justice (in a demo, game not released yet)
    • Atomic Hearts (in a demo, game not released yet)
    Despite this, NVIDIA proceeded to add support for the following titles outside the list:

    • Monster Hunter World
    • Battlefield V
    • Metro Exodus
    • Anthem
     
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  14. Shifty Geezer

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  15. entity279

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    ^^ So the lists are useless as they predicted correctly just 4/25, right? .

    Even if the extra games would have been there, the accuracy would have been 8/29 which is really poor
     
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  16. ToTTenTranz

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    6 games, since two of those are demos.
    Two of them being demos (i.e. single levels?) is very relevant because nVidia must train every scenario for every resolution, so in those demos we could be looking at less than 5% of the total development time to enable DLSS.


    While it seemed interesting at first (as a super advanced upscaler better than checkerboard), people have now been looking at DLSS for what it actually is:

    - nvidia's attempt at justifying turing's tensor cores as a relevant feature for games.

    Turns out nvidia's engineers can't for the love of their life use the tensor cores for anything in games, other than performing regular non-matrix FP16 calculations.
    DLSS takes months to train for each game, and they must to do so for every resolution because ultrawide takes another handful of months to implement on top of the previous, and apparently they aren't even using the tensor cores for that.

    And now that AMD's Contrast Adaptive Sharpening is better, open source and has already been ported to GPU-agnostic tools, I'm guessing DLSS will die very soon.
    I wouldn't be surprised if DLSS doesn't actually get implemented in more than the 6 already released games, since its implementation is such a waste of resources.
     
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  17. Naed

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    You seem to be trying to make it seem like that is a good thing?

    Nvidia are the ones that maintain that list. They are also the ones that are in the absolute best position to actually ensure that a dev on that list DOES implement the tech. So why should anyone applaud/praise them for fapping about and doing random things while having PR-puff like that list around?

    That a company, any company, not just Nvidia makes a "hey look, these titles will do X" list. And then does not ensure that list is at least 90+% true.

    it might be acceptable in your world, but i would prefer to try and live in a world where that is unacceptable behaviour.
     
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