Why does Xbox One have a Bluray player?

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blakjedi

Veteran
A lot of the nonsense DRM controversy would evaporate if they just pulled out the Blu-ray player. There would be several benefits:

-The device could be smaller
-The device could be cheaper
-The device would be the actual streaming, digital download device that they envision.

No one worries about drm on solid state devices like phones, rokus, apple tvs... This is where MS could change the game once and for all. MS could make this an entirely new SKU, reduce the price and not miss a beat.
 
Packaged games are still a bone to retailers for carrying the low margin hardware. And there's still issues to overcome before they can be all digital. (data caps, low bandwidth users)
 
See my message on this very same topic in the DRM thread. I think this is at the very heart of the DRM issue as Jedi stated in his question.

Not sure why this needs it's own thread?
 
RancidLunchmeat said:
See my message on this very same topic in the DRM thread. I think this is at the very heart of the DRM issue as Jedi stated in his question.

Not sure why this needs it's own thread?
Click to expand...

I'm sorry I missed that. Feel free to combine mods.

I was simply wondering aloud, If Xbox one is the internet, cloud connected console why not just go whole hog?
 
Orion said:
nextgen games might be 10s of gigabytes in size, it is necessary.
Click to expand...
I've debated this one, but in the end is probably not necessary. Likelihood is that 500GB will hold 10+ (full retail) games and I would imagine it is rare for too many people to have that many on the go at the same time. With the cloud backup you can get access to you library and re-download a title that you may have cleared out previously. Even if you have a slow connection games can still be played while they are downloading content so you can start playing with just the bare essentials downloaded / installed (at least, Blizzard games do this).

Having read the Ars article and getting a clearer pictures of their goals it is clear to my thinking that the disk is there to bridge a short term gap - the leap of faith to fully digital was probably seen as too far so they offer a compromise solution while people warm to the idea. I personally think that within a silicon shrink or two their aim is to embed the system into other devices without disks.
 
Dave Baumann said:
Having read the Ars article and getting a clearer pictures of their goals it is clear to my thinking that the disk is there to bridge a short term gap - the leap of faith to fully digital was probably seen as too far so they offer a compromise solution while people warm to the idea. I personally think that within a silicon shrink or two their aim is to embed the system into other devices without disks.
Click to expand...

Boo-Yah. That's what I'm talking about. Wavey Dave and I got the same thing out of that interview.

The One wasn't originally designed with the BR (or any physical media) in mind. I think they added it in late in the process because they decided that it was too early to launch a DD only console. And it's the inclusion of the optical disc that is causing all these DRM issues.

(Jedi also came to the same conclusion which is why (s)he started this thread.)
 
Dave Baumann said:
I've debated this one, but in the end is probably not necessary. Likelihood is that 500GB will hold 10+ (full retail) games and I would imagine it is rare for too many people to have that many on the go at the same time. With the cloud backup you can get access to you library and re-download a title that you may have cleared out previously. Even if you have a slow connection games can still be played while they are downloading content so you can start playing with just the bare essentials downloaded / installed (at least, Blizzard games do this).

Having read the Ars article and getting a clearer pictures of their goals it is clear to my thinking that the disk is there to bridge a short term gap - the leap of faith to fully digital was probably seen as too far so they offer a compromise solution while people warm to the idea. I personally think that within a silicon shrink or two their aim is to embed the system into other devices without disks.
Click to expand...

It just wouldn't work as a purely DD device for a large portion of buyers. Where I live, for instance, it takes 2 days to download a 2+Gb file, and I'm on a fairly good connection. Maybe in 4 or 5 years the infrastructure may support a dd model but not yet by a long way.
 
BoardBonobo said:
It just wouldn't work as a purely DD device for a large portion of buyers. Where I live, for instance, it takes 2 days to download a 2+Gb file, and I'm on a fairly good connection. Maybe in 4 or 5 years the infrastructure may support a dd model but not yet by a long way.
Click to expand...

Hmm.. are you sure about that? Remember the always on line requirement? Do you think that could have something to do with the fact that maybe you can buy a game before it's release date, download the game over a period of time and then the game downloads the final components and is "unlocked" on the release date?

Also, it goes back to the original point that if you aren't going to be a consumer of streaming music or videos or movies or purchase other DLC content, then you don't have much value to MS as a customer?

I'm pretty sure the PS3 already allows "pre-loading" of first day downloads. I would assume the One would act the same way. You can pre-order the game, it downloads all the content available, and then just pushes out the "finer details" that enable the game to play on the day and date release.

Isn't that how the PS3 works now?
 
BoardBonobo said:
It just wouldn't work as a purely DD device for a large portion of buyers. Where I live, for instance, it takes 2 days to download a 2+Gb file, and I'm on a fairly good connection. Maybe in 4 or 5 years the infrastructure may support a dd model but not yet by a long way.
Click to expand...
As I said, I think its a bridge. Over time and as people get used to the idea of downloading games and get improved net connections the idea of doing things digitally will get less troublesome.

This just reminds me of the initial outcry over Steam and how it was such a terrible thing when it initially started. Now, 10 years later, it is the primary content distribution for games on the PC and retail sales are the left to the likes of Best Buy.

Assuming MS offer titles to be available on disk or purchasable directly via download I'll wager that it won't be too long before a sizable portion of the sales are direct download - the notion of pre-ordering and pre-loading that new game you really are looking forward to and being able to unlock it the second the release date is live (rather than having to wait, or queue at the retail store for the special 12 AM opening) quickly becomes appealing.
 
RancidLunchmeat said:
Isn't that how the PS3 works now?
Click to expand...
Don't know about PS3, but that's for sure what Steam allows.

(And, no, I hadn't seen this post before posting my previous!)

[Edit] Of course, with the online requirement and the need for the game to work through live it is possible that physical copies may be allowed to be purchased and installed early but with a clear sticker on it saying "Not playable before..."
 
Dave Baumann said:
As I said, I think its a bridge. Over time and as people get used to the idea of downloading games and get improved net connections the idea of doing things digitally will get less troublesome.

This just reminds me of the initial outcry over Steam and how it was such a terrible thing when it initially started. Now, 10 years later, it is the primary content distribution for games on the PC and retail sales are the left to the likes of Best Buy.

Assuming MS offer titles to be available on disk or purchasable directly via download I'll wager that it won't be too long before a sizable portion of the sales are direct download - the notion of pre-ordering and pre-loading that new game you really are looking forward to and being able to unlock it the second the release date is live (rather than having to wait, or queue at the retail store for the special 12 AM opening) quickly becomes appealing.
Click to expand...
Yes, I think it is a bit too early to abandon the physical media for obvious reasons. I have an average connection -6+MB- but I can't complain, if so I'd be whinging for the sake of it. I can download 500MB in 12 minutes or so, which is not that bad.

Launching the console without physical media nowadays would be a blind bet. More like saying; "I wonder what it would be like if bears could fly."

Besides that some people are collectors. They might want a disc. I'd like to have and keep my favourite games in a disc -pretty much like Call of Juarez, Skyrim and RDR this generation-. Just because of nostalgia and the ability to play those games again and in case servers go down forever, you never know.

Call of Juarez for instance has some sentimental value to me, 'cos my total casual brother used to play it. It was the only game he played. And I used to cry with laughter while watching him play and getting angry and frustrated, in such a way that I couldn't stop laughing.

I wonder if games will be also downloadable from Gamestop or Game and the such on the Xbox One.

It'd be nice move and perhaps a game could be cheaper in the digital store of let's say Game than Gamestop's. Or maybe Gamestop's digital store could have some extra DLC because of an exclusive deal and the like.

In regards to this subject, what seems to be an anonymous post from a Microsoft's engineer -pastebin, take it with a grain of salt- has made into the news.

http://www.pcauthority.com.au/News/...on-xbox-one-we-suck-at-telling-the-story.aspx

He says (among other things)

“Think about it,” he opines, “on steam you get a game for the true cost of the game, 5$-30$. On a console you have to pay for that PLUS any additional licenses for when you sell / trade / borrow / etc. If the developer / publisher can't get it on additional licenses (like steam), then they charge the first person more. [...] If we say ‘Hey publishers, you limit game to 39.99, we ensure every license transfer you get 10$, gamestop gets 20$’ that is a decent model... Microsoft gets a license fee on first and subsequent game purchases, compared to just first now? That's a revenue increase.”

It’s a great point, and he makes it even clearer. “The goal is to move to digital downloads, but Gamestop, Walmart, Target, Amazon are KIND OF FUCKING ENTRENCHED in the industry. They have a lot of power, and the shift has to be gradual. Long term goal is steam for consoles. [...] If you always want to stay with what you have, then keep current consoles, or a PS4. We're TRYING to move the industry forwards towards digital distribution... it's a bumpy road.”
Click to expand...
 
The goal is to move to digital downloads, but Gamestop, Walmart, Target, Amazon are KIND OF FUCKING ENTRENCHED in the industry.
...
We're TRYING to move the industry forwards towards digital distribution... it's a bumpy road
Click to expand...
I read that as "we don't want to share revenue with other industry players, and we would like the middlemen out so we can take a larger portion of the revenue".


Oh please. They can Fking accomplish what this engineer is saying by giong DD without doing any of the DRM to physical based games. What an excuse.

Just price your DD games cheaper on Xbox Live and you'll take these middlemen out.
Mission Accomplished.
There's absolutely no need to fiddle with the disk based DRM.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
blakjedi said:
A lot of the nonsense DRM controversy would evaporate if they just pulled out the Blu-ray player. There would be several benefits:

-The device could be smaller
-The device could be cheaper
-The device would be the actual streaming, digital download device that they envision.

No one worries about drm on solid state devices like phones, rokus, apple tvs... This is where MS could change the game once and for all. MS could make this an entirely new SKU, reduce the price and not miss a beat.
Click to expand...

Should be fairly easy to create a XBOX "PSP" when they feel for it.
 
blakjedi said:
No one worries about drm on solid state devices like phones, rokus, apple tvs... This is where MS could change the game once and for all. MS could make this an entirely new SKU, reduce the price and not miss a beat.
Click to expand...

Typical content on those other devices are very cheap.

People would have different expectations for $60 content. Especially considering that there are no manufacturing or distribution or inventory costs like those with physical media.

Especially the ability to recoup some of the purchase price when you're done, like many people do with DVDs and CDs by re-selling them.

Now, if they price the DD games at $30 or $40 max because all games are DD and they have none of the costs of physical media, that would truly have been revolutionary. But the problem is that most digital media is priced at parity with physical media, to protect existing revenues streams and/or maximize profits.

Companies have the right to price their digital content for their benefit. But this right may be in conflict with what's best for the consumer.
 
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