Unreal Engine 3 on R420 at GDC

I kinda agree... you've gotta admit though that it was a bit unfortunate as a first post - at least I had a hard time guessing whether he was for real or we just got trolled. But now it's all sorted out.

 

I don't know what you are implying, but the meaning of this emoticon is evil (aka me ) or very mad (which is the reason i put it this time). So what's your point?? :?

I don't know why a person can't say BS, if it's actually the case, this person being me or the president of France

 

Mark for the future, I would recommend not replying to people when you are "steaming mad". I know you are smarter than this. Your apologies are very thin. Thank you for helping me "realize" that these were outright lies.

edit: You say that you are not out to sell hardware, that you do not accept money from IHV's to promote favoratism to one or the other, and yet you have a nice fat "TWIMTBP" logo on your most popular games? Maybe this is my own conjecture, but I believe that you signed a contract with nVIdia to promote its hardware on ut2k3 and ut2k4?

 

Uh yeah, NV35 only has about 125 million transistors, not 175...

 

WOW This has turned into a pretty darn interesting thread!

I'm not going to get dragged into the hardware rumour fest that's happening. While it's all good fun, I'd rather wait till NDAs have expired and we actually have some real hardware to test, then it should get real interesting! 8)

I would like to make one point though; I'm 100% certain that Epic work equally with all hardware manufacturers to ensure their products work well for all consumers- Not doing so would be rather foolish from a business point of view. I'm also sure that they don't favour (from a technical stand point) any one manufacturer over another (A la Tiger Woods 2004 etc).
I do however believe that having a large nVidia logo with "The way it's meant to be played" boldly displayed around it on Epics packaging DEFINATELY DOES contribute to harware sales. Anyone suggesting that it doesn't is obviously rather naive

Finally, I'm very pleased to see another industry big player like Mark Rein is on the boards. Mr Rein, thanks for taking the time to post here and to clear up the original poster's claims. Please stop by again soon (*hint* Developers board maybe? )

Mike

 

Sure, but they are not selling hardware, they are selling adds, the right to put an hardware logo on Epic's games. It's just as saying that TV are selling Cars because we have cars ads. they are selling spots not cars

 

Sure, but they are not selling hardware, they are selling adds, the right to put an hardware logo on Epic's games. It's just as saying that TV are selling Cars because we have cars ads. they are selling spots not cars [/quote]

No, that's a completely wrong analogy. The computer is not selling nVidia hardware, Epic's games are via advertisement.

The coorect analogy to TV is any show that is "brought to you by...product X." That show is selling product X.

 

What is with people getting many log ins to support their twisted views?

 

I'm sorry but that the exactly same thing, the message is different than "Nv kick ass" but it's still an add.

 

I'm not defending no one, lets be clear here. Someone on the Nvida/EPIC camp felt it was necessary to send in Damage Control (Mark Rein) and felt it was important enough to do on a message board. All that was said that he felt the ATI equipped machine was running slightly faster on a demo, and now after the last few days of posts including Mark Rein...I have good reason to believe him.

 

So every rumour that is denied (by someone who should be in a position to know) is automatically true :? Good lord, no wonder we have "Aliens blew up the WTC, honest" theories.

What if you read back through the whole thread, and replace every instance of "NVIDIA" with "ATI", and every instance of "ATI" with "NVIDIA"?

 

This doesn't exactly translate into "slightly faster" you know...

 

spellsinger = fuad

 

My guess is to help hold off any allegations that they're in any one particular vendor's pocket. It'd imply favoritism if they only showed it on one system but not on the other. That moronic TWIMTBP logo already gives them enough grief (and they deserve some grief for spreading such a blatant lie every time the program launches, imo) so they don't need to make it worse.

And, since the purpose of the gdc demo is to market their software to developers, it becomes even more vital that they show their engine will run on hardware from both of the major vendors.

 

Huh?

The fact is Epic actively and officially advertises on behalf of nVidia, and not ATI. There is no debate about this.

I'm not saying this is "inherently evil". I'm saying to deny that for Mark Rein to claim that he doesn't help to sell hardware is naive at best.

 

I do agree with Doomtrooper to a certain extent. I would not expect that just a mesagge on this board would be so important, that Mark Rein needs to jump in, create a new account, and start shouting 'bullshit!'. There's tons of FUD going around on the internet, why is this one post so much more important than the rest? Why not just keep your mouth shut?

The thought did cross my mind, that maybe SpellSinger saw something that he wasn't supposed to see. Now, I can certainly imagine that that would give such an agressive response from Epic.

Ofcourse... the longer SpellSinger keeps quiet, not defending himself, the less likely that becomes. In which case, we've simply been lied to, and I'm glad that Mark was nice enough to inform us about it.

 

In an effort to be as civil as possible, I will gracefully state that the bias you possess easily bleeds through your posts, and it is very well apparent that you are an ATi fan that is holding on by a single thread in hopes that by some extreme fluke, the NV40 will turn out slower than the R420.

All evidence is pointing out that the NV40 is actually going to be a nice chip this time, so instead of you always throwing your two cents in, I'd like to insist for the sake of this forum that you keep some of your more radical ideas to yourself... It is getting extremely annoying to read every single one of your posts proclaiming the premature death of the NV40 akin to the second coming of Jesus Christ...

My only question for you is - So once the NV40 defeats the R420 in Half Life 2 benchmarks, or equals with it, it will be because nVidia hacked the hell out of it and gave Valve some money, right? I mean, the same engineers that consistently pumped out STELLAR cards for around 7 years prior to the NV30, couldn't possibly be able to do it again, right? Based off of what everyone is saying about the NV40, NV30 was an accident, and nVidia is back on target with the NV40.

Also, thanks Mark for clearing up this nonsense being spewed from an obviously biased fanatic. I think the only people that truly believed it were those already biased towards ATi and looking for some holy grail of evidence to somehow bring their arguments back to life, but hey, sometimes intervention is required before things get too out of hand!

 

Just remember who you're agreeing with. Doomtrooper is a well known and long time ATi fluffer, and it doesn't surprise me that he's busy trying to spin things as well as he can.

At this point it's safe to say that Spellsinger was trying to spread FUD and didn't expect it would be so directly snuffed out.

Even if he does come to "defend" his position, I'm still more apt to believe Mark Reign over some message board ATi homer.

Do you really think the next ATi product is as he stated compared to nvidia's next product? (running noticably faster at 2.5x the resolution after "The Carmack" has stated publicly the NV40 is "spectacular")

Just for the record, could you tell us what the difference is between selling hardware and "help"ing sell hardware?

The advertisements on the sides of busses help sell cellular phones, does that mean that busses *SELL* phones?

 

Nvidia would never 'cheat' would they...

 

mmm, peanut butter and jam on toast ... with a tall glass of cold milk.

Well.. that was kind of exciting there for a bit. Too bad it ended so rapidly.

At any rate it is a shame in one sense that Mark ended all the bs. For a second there I actually thought that maybe there was something too what Spellsinger was indicating. Thus giving us some insight with regards to the two gpu's we all want to see and here about. On the other hand it is good that things were cleared up and the truth be known.

Doomtrooper made a good point regarding TWIMTBP, TRAOD and developers advertising the highest paying IHV on there games. TWIMTBP clearly does suggest that "this software runs better on these varieties of cards" it comes off as a major approval to the ignorant. These advertising dollars are big bucks though and it would really be silly too turn them down even if the endorsement is for inferior hardware. End users who have no clue and do not read B3D ( ) might well believe based on the advertising support that indeed... "I need nvidia based hardware to enjoy this game the best, even the developer says so."

To the question as too why Mark Rein would bother with a poster here on B3D .. B3D has garnered a high regard amongst enthusiast if you ask me and for good reason. Allot of knowledgeable high caliber posters, developers and IHV types hang out - lurk- post here.(Along with individuals from other noteworthy sites that like to post speculative and rumor mill type news.. no names necessary. ) There are also a great many investment types that take what is said here as good information. Now that does not mean that all the information is reliable.(One only has to look at all the varieties of speculation regarding the R420 and the NV40 to realize that.) But there is a great deal of integrity to the conclusions of many of the posters here. It certainly is a good thing for Mark to stopped in and refute the claims of Spellsinger.(A self proclaimed developer.)

One last point though... This engine does not appear to be anywhere close to release. There is no hardware in the near future that would run it at acceptable speeds. Even if there is truth to the suggestion that the R420 runs it slightly faster then the NV40 it really is not much of a consequence since the release of the title is so far down the road that we will all be talking about the R500 and NV50 in the past tense, err at least I hope so.(hmm, maybe we will be speculating in the same manner. :? ) My point, what's the big deal?