Toshiba TC35285XBG

Discussion in 'Architecture and Products' started by Rob Evans, Mar 5, 2004.

  1. Rob Evans

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  2. moichi

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  3. Nappe1

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    hmmh... it has 2.5 Megabytes of eDRAM (20MBit) made in 130 nm process. eDRAM processes have come a long way pretty quickly.

    well, at least the market segment has some really tough competition soon:
    - Toshiba
    - ATI
    - nVIDIA
    - Bitboys
    - Mitsubishi
    - PowerVR

    any others?
     
  4. ram

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  5. Ailuros

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    I wouldn't count Sony out either for the foreseeable future.
     
  6. Luminescent

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    I wonder if this chip has anything to do with the renderer inside the Sony PSP?
     
  7. moichi

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    Sony published one paper about 3d processor for mobile-phone at ISSCC 2004(paper number 13.4).
    Spec is 4.7Mvert/s and 600Mtexel/s.
     
  8. Rob Evans

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  9. Nappe1

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    Maybe that's the most wanted speed on market right now. Both chips are based on so different architechtures that those numbers do not mean much. it's the real speed that end user sees. (Both architechtures have good and bad sides.)

    anyways, interesting to see that Toshiba states Vertice speed instead of triangle speed. Support of other primitives too perhaps?
     
  10. PC-Engine

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    MBX has much lower power consumption though. :wink:
     
  11. Ailuros

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    That flyer has slightly different numbers:

    http://www.arm.com/miscPDFs/1643.pdf

    MBX R-S @130nm

    300K gates
    Power: 0.7mW/MHz
    120MHz
    1.5Mtris/sec
    240M Pixels/s

    But Nappe is right; paper specs are just that paper specs. What comes out at the other end will be more important when first products will be available for sale.
     
  12. PC-Engine

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    [​IMG]

    Notice the 3D graphics block from the Toshiba part consumes twice as much power as MBX.
     
  13. Ailuros

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    Less than half.
     
  14. Rob Evans

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    Are you sure it uses more power? The Toshiba figures include the power consumed by the embedded DRAM.

    Does anyone know how much power 20Mbit embedded DRAM consumes at 125MHz? It would be very interesting if the answer was 'around 100mW'!
     
  15. PC-Engine

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    As a complete solution it still draws more power because it would still need additional main RAM. I think MBX can use main RAM as it's texture memory so it doesn't need a separate pool of memory.
     
  16. Nappe1

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    well, that depends... 20MBit is actually 2.5 Megabytes of RAM. if you have 320x240 screen, it will take (320x240x2x2)+(320x240x2)=450 Kilobytes of memory. (16 bit Z, 16 bit colors and double bufferin) So, there's still over 2 Megabytes left for textures, which is about the same as 4MB Voodoo 1 had.

    does it support texture compression? if yes, then it is even more likely that it does not need additional memory for graphics. Or external memory can be remarkably slower, if only front buffer is held in there. If it is tiled back buffer implementation, only tile being rendered has to be in eDRAM, while rest of back buffer is in external memory, need of eDRAM is much smaller and while external memory is needed, it has to be able to deliver only around 10% of bandwidth that eDRAM delivers. Of course this would mean also pretty radically different architechture as a whole, but that is the case usually on eDRAM based chips.
     
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