Technical investigation into PS4 and XB1 audio solutions *spawn

Discussion in 'Console Technology' started by Brad Grenz, Jun 2, 2013.

  1. macabre

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    And what about the materials ? Shouldn`t it be possible to take an average brightness value of a material`s maps and translate the data to drive a selective EQ and reverb ? The filtered Sound could then be used as the reflection or mixed with the original source.
     
  2. Relab

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    There's necessary no correlation between brightness (light frequencies) and an audio frequency depended reflection coefficient.

    A black and a white coated metallic surface will have close to the same reflection properties for the various audio frequencies, no matter the value of brightness in screenspace.
     
  3. macabre

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    I wasn`t thinking about the diffuse maps but the ones for reflection, roughness , specularity. Of course it is probably not possible for the program to tell the difference between a painted metal vs painted plastic without additional Input but could be a starting Point.
    And of course it would just be a hack because it doesn`t account for an object`s volume or mass - running a physics Simulation just for Sound is Overkill.
     
    #983 macabre, Apr 25, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 25, 2014
  4. Davros

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    Its sort of been done allthough the visual properties are not used you need to add extra properties to your materials like sound reflection/absorption for the audio, eax does this.
    creative labs eagle creates a a simplified polygon representation of the scene
     
  5. milk

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    Well, the whole point of my hypothesis was to leveredge what was already part of the rendering engine anyways for audio, sidestepping the need for an extra sound sim specific representation of the scene.
     
  6. Davros

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    Yes its technically possible, its just less demanding to wave trace a low poly version of the environment.
    for example a bullet casing lying on the floor would reflect sound but is it really worth while calculating how it impacts on in game sound.
    As far as I can ascertain shape isn't capable of wave tracing it would have to be done on the cpu

    (ps: i'm sure in a supported engine eagle auto creates the simplified level for you)
     
  7. Arwin

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    Or on GPU
     
  8. Cyan

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    Now that they officially killed Kinect, :/ I just hope they free up the multiple audio processors to make something good out of that decision, true 3D audio will be possible and amazing reverb effects and the like.
     
  9. Scott_Arm

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    Holy shit, you're obsessed with the audio processor.

    I don't see how they can free up those resources to be generally available, unless they disabled Kinect and made it so it didn't work anymore. The parts of the audio block that are used for Kinect would be used with the voice control, which is not being disabled. Even if you manually disabled it on your console, someone else might want to keep it on, so devs couldn't count on those resources being generally available. Unless your game basically said, "Improved audio with Kinect disabled!" as a feature.
     
  10. Cyan

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    I don't think you understand what making Kinect optional means. This means that they killed it, developers only want money, not experimenting, so they won't use Kinect.

    If they don't use Kinect, and the entire fanbase isn't going to have it, they could well liberate the audio cores.

    After the twist in the winds that was the whole Xbox One launch, they will have to settle or set some options for developers.

    A simple note in games saying "This game is going to disable some Kinect features", to take advantage of audio or whatever they want to do is something I can see happening after the changes.
     
  11. Scott_Arm

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    So, you think that loading up the next Call of Duty is going to disable voice commands so I can't say, "Xbox Go Home"? There may actually be some resources they could free up on the skeletal side of things. If your game doesn't use skeletal tracking, you should be able to free up those resources. When you go back to your home screen and the game gets minimized/backgrounded/paused, then you can give those resources back to the UI. As far as the audio processor goes, unless you actually want to turn voice control off when you enter certain games (which would be really dumb) then I think you're not going to free those resources up.
     
  12. Rurouni

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    It depends on whether that audio stuff for kinect is being used by voice command UI or not. If Kinect needs to use that audio processor for voice command, then it will not be released for games. Otherwise, people that have been using Kinect voice command suddenly can't use it on some games. Unlike the old Kinect, Kinect 2 functions is tied to the OS UI. MS must make sure that people that do want to use Kinect on X1 can do so.
     
  13. Cyan

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    It might seem dumb but it isn't. You have to go with the lowest common multiple.

    Developers are going to say... ok, we won't be using Kinect because there is nothing saying "Kinect is essential to the Xbox One, and it will not work without it", so... they will want to use the machine to the max at some point. -especially later into the generation-

    What would be your choice if you were a developer? Develop for a potential part of the customers or develop for every single Xbox One? That's the point, now Kinect is marginalised...:/
     
  14. taisui

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    the chips used by kinect for audio processing are most likely specialized, meaning it'll be very difficult to use it for other purpose.
     
  15. Cyan

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    That would be odd if true. Aren't they programmable?
     
  16. taisui

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    Programmable in what they are designed to do, and it already does encode/decode/dsp/speech/mixing in conjunction with Kinect.

    Surprise me with a high value scenario.
     
  17. Shifty Geezer

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    I can imagine some class lawsuits in that case from everyone being sold an XB1 on the strength of its voice control losing access to voice control. The moment you can't swap functionality from game to app via voice control, the produce is no longer what you bought. MS can't really afford to disable that. If it does happen, it'll be another messy chapter.
     
  18. bkilian

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    They are general purpose DSPs with some custom instructions.
     
  19. taisui

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    but they ARE just DSPs :wink:
     
  20. Cyan

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    :smile2: They are going to adapt the interface.

    http://www.computerandvideogames.co...-be-redesigned-with-controller-users-in-mind/

    Additionally, I just want to either disconnect Kinect from now on forever or set it on fire, but I don't care about it anymore.

    I wasted a lot of energy defending it, got burnt, and while your ideas, your favourite football team..., are sacred, Kinect is not.

    Ideally they will spend those resources in something useful, which is the console itself. Give us better sound, free up the GPU, and let Kinect die.

    There is no grey here, it's just black and white for me, as with most things in life. For Kinect to regain any trust it should be featured with every single Xbox One, and you can see that that won't be the case.
     
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