Renesas SH-Mobile APE5R (SGX543MP2) @ MWC

T

tangey

Veteran
Renesas Mobile to Demonstrate the Industry's First POWERVR SGX MP Enabled Mobile Application Processor at Mobile World Congress 2011.


"dual-core implementation of the ARM A9 MPCore running at 1.2 gigahertz (GHz)"

Achieves a " new level of graphics compute density with significantly enhanced performance per square millimetre (mm2) and per milliwatt (mW)"

Its already been confirmed previously this is an SGX543MP2 configuration.

"graphics are more than five times the graphics performance of current generation devices"
The good ol' x5 again.

http://www.renesas.com/press/news/news20110210b.html
 
Have they ever been into mobile devices?
Honest question.
 
Has what ever been into mobile devices?

Renesas's SH-Mobile line? Yeah, in tons of DoCoMo FOMA phones in Japan.

This chip? It's not out yet. Apple's A5 will be the first Series5XT part in an end-product
 
ToTTenTranz said:
Have they ever been into mobile devices?
Honest question.
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Besides that NEC is for quite some time now part of Renesas, past Renesas SoCs have found themselves in various Fujitsu, Helio, Mitsubishi, Sony Ericsson and Sharp devices.
 
Ok, so they're big in the Asian market.
That's why I didn't know about them. I'm a little bit less ignorant now, thanks :)
 
Renesas always had a good "foot" in the car navigation/infotainment markets. Clarion, Alpine, Pioneer and Mitsubishi have all used their SoCs for their products.

I don't know where Renesas ranks nowadays after the merger with NEC, but it should be definitely in the Top5 of semiconductor manufacturers.

If memory serves well Renesas is the result of another big merger years ago. Does anyone recall the companies that merged back then?
 
Ailuros said:
If memory serves well Renesas is the result of another big merger years ago. Does anyone recall the companies that merged back then?
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Hitachi (where SH comes from) and Mitsubishi in the beginning to form Renesas, then a merger with NEC EC recently.
 
Rys said:
Hitachi (where SH comes from) and Mitsubishi in the beginning to form Renesas, then a merger with NEC EC recently.
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Thanks. They should rename the whole thing to HiMitsuNec, at least then I could remember the entire plot easier.
 
Renesas is the go-to semiconductor company when you want chips balanced for the graphics and time-to-market demands of a video game system.

Hitachi and NEC supplied Dreamcast, NEC has supplied Nintendo, and Renesas even delivered a fascinating MBX + VGP solution that brought back IMG's automatic hardware translucency sorting in a 2004 SoC called SH3707. It was specced for potential use in a mobile platform with its 150 MHz GPU (such a solution would've been perfect for DS and/or PSP had those manufacturers had a clue) yet Sega Sammy ultimately used it just for their Aurora arcade/amusement system.
 
Interesting that Renesas has a product with "SH" in the name but featuring ARM cores. The old SH-Mobile products do actually have SH4 processors (like the Dreamcast). The EMMA platforms were already ARM. I wonder if this means the processor is being phased out..

Hm, looks like there was already an SH-Mobile SoC that had both Cortex-A8 and an SH4, which they were calling a DSP. I wonder if that's what this one will be like.
 
I see Renesas have taken some more PowerVR series 5 I/P.
http://www.imgtec.com/corporate/newsdetail.asp?NewsID=629

".... has signed further multi-use licence and extension agreements with Renesas Electronics Corporation......., for graphics technologies from Imagination's POWERVR SGX Series5XT IP core family."

With Renesas already having 543, this suggests to me (purely based on timing) that they have taken a licence for 554.

I'd suggest there is a timeframe for tier ones to still be licensing I/P from series 5, and after that you'd expect series 6 to start to be announced. 554 has no announced partners, IMG have zero history over the last number of years of announcing graphics I/P, and then it never being used. Giving than 554 is at the top end of series 5 performance, its likely to be licenceed by tier 1 partners at this time.

Hence my assessment 554 is the prime suspect.

Note the announcement says "has signed further multi-use licence and extension agreements", so this is a number of different agreements and extensions, i.e. covering extended use of existing licences plus new ones, expect multiple chips of various capabilities/segments resulting from this announcement, Given renesas strengths and previous markets, the I/P will likely target car/mobile/tablets (554 gives them DX9 support, which their 543 licence does not provide).


Thats 4 licence announcements by IMG in 5 days, LG,Mediatek,Fujitsu and Renesas, plus the recent news item by VR-zone that Intel's cedar trail is SGX545. IMG are on a roll.
 
tangey said:
IMG have zero history over the last number of years of announcing graphics I/P
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Poor ole SGX555, not only is it dead but now it has never even existed :( Mind you, it was only pre-announced and the RTL was never finalised, so it's a very different situation from 554 but still...

Anyway I've heard from both IMG and ST-E that [strike]U9500[/strike]A9600 will be the first Rogue-based chip, so it's definitely true that there is still a window for 554. I suspect you might see it in unexpected places. I've definitely heard that they've got strong interest for it. (EDIT: Fixed A9500 to A9600)

However I'm not convinced this announcement *necessarily* means SGX554 as it could easily be SGX544 (or both). Why bother with 544 if you've already got 543 and aren't targeting the PC market? DXTC support for Windows Phone 7 and Renesas is a key partner to Nokia...
 
Arun said:
Poor ole SGX555, not only is it dead but now it has never even existed :( Mind you, it was only pre-announced and the RTL was never finalised, so it's a very different situation from 554 but still...
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Yeah well I did say over the last number of years, 510 & 555 got dropped off the roadmap years ago, and since that time, they've licensed everything they announced, even 531 which was obviously done specifically for NXP.

Anyway I've heard from both IMG and ST-E that U9500 will be the first Rogue-based chip
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Yeah, ST said A9500 was mali-400, A9600 is rogue, they have deliberately left the graphics in the A9540 vague, do you have any hints on that one (mail T604 ?)
 
A9540 should be some kind of Mali400MP.

SGX510 was interesting for its "Lite" pipeline (something like one pixel every two clocks). I'm glad SGX520 set the baseline for performance, though; don't want to skew too low.

I think ST-Ericsson swung for the fences with the A9600; I'm not sure Rogue implementations from other licensees will leave it comparing unfavorably for a while. Apple's A7 definitely won't be alone at the top.

ST-Ericsson is not looking to start as a bit player in the app processor market.

If Renesas goes with the 554, I assume they might implement a 554MP2, which is a load of ALUs.
 
Lazy8s said:
A9540 should be some kind of Mali400MP.
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Is the existing U8500 platform a single core mali-400 ?

The ST pr said:-
"The Nova A9540 delivers a four times improvement in graphics performance compared with the current generation, while the A9500 delivers state-of-the-art graphic capabilities on mobile devices"

Which would work I suppose if U8500 was single core.
 
tangey said:
Yeah, ST said A9500 was mali-400, A9600 is rogue, they have deliberately left the graphics in the A9540 vague, do you have any hints on that one (mail T604 ?)
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I specifically asked Louis Tannyeres what GPU was used in the A9540 and whether it was a Mali-400MP, but he refused to reply and said they didn't say anything about it yet. Given how open he was about everything else, it's rather surprising - this is very sensitive information apparently. Either way it can't be T604 because A9540 will tape-out before A9600, the A9600 is the first chip for Rogue, and Rogue RTL was finalised before T604 RTL.
 
Arun said:
I specifically asked Louis Tannyeres what GPU was used in the A9540 and whether it was a Mali-400MP, but he refused to reply and said they didn't say anything about it yet. Given how open he was about everything else, it's rather surprising - this is very sensitive information apparently. Either way it can't be T604 because A9540 will tape-out before A9600, the A9600 is the first chip for Rogue, and Rogue RTL was finalised before T604 RTL.
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Given laurent06's link (thanks for that info. laurent06) about indicating U8500 is single core, then A9540 being 400MP4 would kinda fit in (mind you probably only get twice the polys of a single core).

Arun..what you've said about A9600 and being first out with rogue sounds like they are confident that when it comes out, it is going to be the performanc leading Soc (in graphics at least, and likely generally) of its cycle, so I guess if you are confident its going to be the best, might as well shout about it.

Totally different story with the A9540, so perhaps better to play their cards cards close to their chest ?
 
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