Regarding the Pathetic State of FSAA Today

Discussion in 'PC Gaming' started by Mize, Jan 29, 2011.

  1. Mize

    Mize 3dfx Fan
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    So I have this rig now that can run most any dx9 game at 19x12 with 8x SSAA...but move to dx10 or dx11 and I'm left at the mercy of the developer's laziness to have anything other than AMD's MLAA. And developers are, indeed, quite lazy.

    I realize that if AA is my cup of tea I'm likely better off in the NV camp as they have managed to force SSAA on more titles, but my 580 experience was a disaster in 2D so here I am back in the red camp.

    I remembered when the V5-5500 first came out with RGSSAA and how amazing it looked in the few games that weren't complete slide-shows. The prospect of that kind of IQ, coupled with the AF breakthrough of the 9700 Pro, in future games was tantalizing and obvious; someday in the not-too-distant future, all games would have kick-ass anti-aliasing and anisotropic filtering.

    So now we're about ten years later and the dx feature sets have grown by leaps and bounds, but anti-aliasing has seemed to fall by the wayside. Games like DS2 get rave reviews even though they are riddled with crawlies and no high-quality way to get rid of them.

    Is this just an artifact of gaming being held hostage to the twitch-game console player who doesn't even know what AA is? Is there hope for returning to truly high-quality AA?

    For the time being it's going to take a lot to tear my from my dx9 library. BFBC2 is a great game, but I keep exiting to windows and firing up Fakefactory because it just looks so much better...

    [rant off]
     
  2. digitalwanderer

    digitalwanderer Dangerously Mirthful
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    [enthusiastic cheering/encouragement of rant!]

    Heartily seconded, drives me nuts too.
     
  3. Mize

    Mize 3dfx Fan
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    Note: screenies of Fakefactory HL2(0) in the redunkulus thread for how AA should look reference...
     
  4. Scott_Arm

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    Or you could play games because they're fun.
     
  5. Mize

    Mize 3dfx Fan
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    Well, duh?

    Unfortunately for me, suspension of disbelief is as important in gaming as it is in movies. Horrible CG in a movie and you're left being pulled out of the story mentally.

    Creeping stealthily through the underbrush in a shooter and suddenly surrounded by crawly leaves and trees has a similar effect for me. I can still have fun but the immersion is not nearly as good. In fact, one could use your argument to just say consoles are good enough and, indeed, they can be. I play consoles all the time, but they lack the immersion of a PC game. IMHO PC games are heading that way and I think it's a bad thing.

    Some guy on Rage3D said of DS2 not having AA that he doesn't pause the game to look for jaggies. I certainly don't either, but I notice them and it takes away from the immersion. I should also add that, even in fps games, I am not a twitch-gamer. I'm too old for that (I peaked in twitch skills during Q3A) so I move more slowly and less frantically and I find that far more entertaining.
     
  6. Scott_Arm

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    I used to be a PC gamer, and I've never been particularly sensitive to lack of AA. On that platform, the first thing I'd usually turn off was AA to gain back some performance, if I wanted to crank some graphics options up a notch. I'd rather play a game with high details and no AA than medium details with AA, basically. I guess it sucks that AA is broken in a lot of games now, but honestly, if the games are good, then it shouldn't matter. I'll play a 2D sprite game that looks like it was made in 1992 if it's fun.
     
  7. Mize

    Mize 3dfx Fan
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    I guess I'm not being clear. There are lots of games where AA doesn't matter, but there are games where immersion makes the game far better and, in those games, it makes a ton of difference for many of us.

    Today's enthusiast hardware can easily handle high details, AF and AA, but that option is largely gone even though it was available a generation or two back. That's the frustration. We finally got that hardware that took V5-5500 AA, Geforce T&L and Radeon 9700 AF and dumped all into one that could do it all better than those three and yet we can't use it in most of the latest games.
     
  8. digitalwanderer

    digitalwanderer Dangerously Mirthful
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    I need high details and AA, I'm a PC snob kthxbye. :yep2:
     
  9. Neb

    Neb Iron "BEAST" Man
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    digitalwanderer = Graphics conoseuir.
     
  10. Mize

    Mize 3dfx Fan
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    Anyone here have any experience using Tommti's downscaler to get SSAA-like results on any game?
    I'm going to install it and configure it for a couple DX11 titles to give it a whirl. Basically it downsamples from a higher-thank screen resolution to create and AA effect.
     
  11. Davros

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    the thing is if a 3rd party tool can do it why the hell cant ati ?
     
  12. Mize

    Mize 3dfx Fan
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    Well, technically downsampling isn't AA. It's just another way of achieving an SSAA type effect on the final image. Essentially AMD's "version" of this (MLAA) is a bit more sophisticated even if it doesn't give SSAA results.
     
  13. Davros

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    I thought thats what ssaa was. you rendered the image at a high resolution and then scaled it down using some type of filter
     
  14. CNCAddict

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    I never cared about AA with older titles because the games had such small worlds that seeing detail in the distance was no big deal. Now with games that have miles of view distance, AA and high resolution are critical. Crysis was one of the worst cases with the awful appearance of the leaves. Now with deffered rendering it will only get worse...I hope nVidias SRAA is a cure all.
     
  15. homerdog

    homerdog donator of the year
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    Lol? Of course we play games because they're fun, but it's insulting when a dev with a many million dollar budget can't be arsed to include a basic feature like AA because they think we're too fucktarded to tell the difference.
     
  16. Neb

    Neb Iron "BEAST" Man
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    We sure play to have fun but it is also great if PC capabilities are exploited and AA support is one important aspect. These days is should be present in all games and devs implement it instead of hacks by ATI/NV to be able to apply AA.

    Homerdogs sig FTW.

    [​IMG]
     
  17. Neb

    Neb Iron "BEAST" Man
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    This.
     
  18. almighty

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    I can force MSAA on practically ANY game, well except for Dead Space...

    Download RadeonPro, load up a games .EXE and force MSAA using Star Craft 2's MSAA profile = Job done....AA that works in 995 of games that didn't normally support it..

    S.T.A.L.K.E.R shadow of Chernobyl for example looks amazing with hacked MSAA :wink:
     
  19. Silent_Buddha

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    Hell, I've been going with a policy of not buying games that don't support AA for years now. There's been a few cases where I've made an exception but for most everything if a dev can't be arsed to support AA or allow their engine to use control panel AA then I can't be arsed to buy it.

    Aliasing has bothered me from the first day I played a 3D software rendered game way back when before consumer 3D accelerators existed. I just can't fathom how developers can be so ignorant that all their efforts for whatever new hot 3D rendering technique is completely and totally ruined by aliasing. Good AA, IMO, should be at the very top of the list whenever a game is made. Because without it, all games are completely ugly and irritating pieces of junk. :p

    Regards,
    SB
     
  20. Simon F

    Simon F Tea maker
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    It is, though, if possible, you don't sample using a regular rectangular grid.
     
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