R420 might only support pixel shader 2.0

I ruin linxu , multiple monitors and older games just fine on my ati card.

I've also had the same amount of good and bad experiances from both companys and the same goes with 3dfx and power vr boards too .

Remember he said why would an educated person .

If i was talking partial percision i would have said it .

I'm talking about the mixed modes in half life 2 the permier dx 9 game .

Its not full dx 9 running it .

Besides even with partial persision you buy a card that claims fp32 you expect to get fp32 . Just like if i buy a card with 32bit color i epect it to do it all the time not only when the speed decrease can be hidden.

 

As do I, but they also run better on my older, slower Nvidia card. Won't stop me buying ATI though, if NV4x doesn't fix all the problems of NV3x (and it doesn't look like it will).

 

page missing ?

 

Last time I checked (yesterday) dx 9 still allows me to use PS 1.1. I can even use old DX7-style texturestage setups.

If you run HL2 in DX9 Mode they simply use VS/PS 2.0 for each shader in the game. But most effects did not need more than 1.1 to do they job.

 

I'll Tell you exactly why, Superior Frame Buffer readback, For Framebuffer effects in PSX emulation, Max Internal Textures of 4096x4093 rather than 2048x2048 (which is a Huge Deal In PSX emulation with Petes OpenGL 2.0 Plugin) Please refer here.

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthr...ca14&threadid=33746684&highlight=Texture+Size


Full anistropic Filtering on All Angles in Everquest, Lineage 2, And Anarchy Online (trillinear Brillinear, Whatever it hardly matters in PSO and Everquest and Lineage 2, But you do notice on both my 8500 and my 9500 Pro when I had it, The areas that would lose filtering, Was Really bad in Everquest and Lineage 2 (Korean beta, Now I'm playen American Closed Beta, hehe) It is noticable.


Digital Vibrance was a huge seller for me. Super Sampling was huge deal to me as well. Heck even after I bought it they added more Super Sampling Methods for me. Furthering my support for Nvidia, (2x1, 1x2)


Frankly, We'll see if I made a mistake in the future of shader games. But I dont think I will. Not By the time games are running Full precision Shader 2.0/3.0 Like we're running DX 7.0 tech now (which wont be for at least another 2 years(If thats soon I'll be surprised) and my system will be obsolete by then anyway) At the Moment I am pretty impressed by Pixel Shader 1.1 Titles Such as Everquest 2, Lineage 2, Far Cry, ect, Which IMO arent too taxing, That being said,

Its a wait and see issue. Sometimes I think some of you people think that running a game on an Nvidia card is just this terribly awful gaming experience

subjectivity and what you want out of a card are a big deal tho, I knew exactly what I was getting and I havent flinched since.

 

Wow. I was talking about DX7 cards.

As for the rest of your post, you missed the point entirely.

 

You can do branching in PS 2.0. You just have to execute all possible paths and, at the end, choose a specific result. You may also have to do multipass if the branches you want to execute have too many pathways.

Dynamic branching will allow the pixel shader to do less work, at the expense of possible scheduling problems.

 

Are you sure? IIRC the high end gfFX cards are using a mixed mode with full precision and partial precision while there is a second different mixed mode for midrange/lowend cards which also uses some DX8 shaders.

Hmm, I'm not sure that makes sense. NVIDIA cards can use the Very High X and Y resolutions, while ATI cards can use High X and Very High Y resolution.

 

So do I, except Linux doesn't run fine, and I've had far more good experiences with my nVidia cards, and far more bad experiences with my ATI card.

Anyway, prime example of driver issue in Linux:
When switching to console mode (Ctrl+Alt+1-6), if I am running a program using OpenGL, X crashes. If I switch to console mode while not running an OpenGL program, upon returning to X, the colors are messed up, requiring a restart of X.

Additionally, it seems that most of the games I tend to like are OpenGL games. ATI seems to have more problems with these. For example, a recent patch for KoTOR enabled soft shadows for ATI cards. They caused the framerate to be about 1-2 fps on one specific map. The rendering is also very garbled in specific places. I have a very hard time believing it could be a bug with the game (no rendering algorithm should make the output look like this).

The garbled rendering essentially looks like every other 4-pixel block of a specific model is not rendered, causing a checkerboard pattern.

 

What doesnt Make sense? The Plugin Calls for 2048x4096 with max X/Y Cooridinates Try it yourself, It doesnt work... In Any Event if you try to set to High X and and Very High Y, it Looks pretty gross, as Shown in my screenies, Or you can test it yourself, You have a 9500 Pro available to you yes?

Has that been proven or Disproven on the Nv35 tho? No One seems to know,

 

You said earlier

But it should be 2048X4096 as you just said, instead of 2048X2048 Not sure what you mean by it doesn't work, High X/ Very High Y seems to work for me, I don't get any error message. Unless what you're trying to say is that the plugin will just automatically scale down the setting to High X/High Y on ATI cards even if High X/Very High Y is set. I would have thought it would crash if an unsupported mode was selected.

I thought your screenshots showed 2048X2048 compared to 4096X4096. If that's not right, what settings are the screenshots using?

 

Ok I just checked on this, sorry for the confusion, The screenies I showed, (High quality is 2048x4096 (Max X/Y)

The Other was Very High Y Sets it to 2048 while High X sets it to 2048,

Or High Y and High X set it to 1024x2048, Hope that clears up the confusion,

currently My screenshots Show High & and High X, Tho you can compare for yourself, The difference between 2048x2048 and 2048x4096 sorry for the Confusion I tend to type without reading my own posts proof reading is for sissies... um ya ;p



Btw, when I said Max Internal Resolution, I meant Max Internal Texture Sizes, R300, Radeon 8500 Only supports 2048x2048 Texture Sizes, Geforce 4 and Geforce FX currently support 4096x4096, hences Why I made that remark about Max Internal X/Y resolution, Rather than texture, So sorry

Summary

Max X/Y = 2048x4096
Very Max Y and high X = 2048x2048
High Y, High X = 1024x2048

 

Ok, that makes a whole lot more sense now...and darn it, depending on what the next gen offers, I was thinking about picking up a r9800 of some kind on the cheap. But there's no way I'm getting stuck with a card that doesn't offer nice PSX emulation results as it sounds like a hardware limitation.

 

Your right typo.. corrected.

How many people bought FX5200 even 5600's thinking they will run any DX-9, or bought a high end 5900 and thought a midrange ati card would run higher FPS when running full DX-9 (and not NV mode) Read the forums over the past year, how many people backed NVidia tooth and nail now have ATI 9800 pro's in their computers because they finally realized the truth
How many people expected that Valve would have to spend 5 times more work writting a special path for NV FX cards to be able to run his game at halfway decent framerates, or expected that he would automatically force anything lower than a 5900 to run in DX-8 mode. (Farcry appears to be doing the same thing as well as others.. The list goes on and on!!

Only in your head lad. Only in your head!! There is no doubt from anyone I can see in this forum that your head is one sided

 

Well the texture Size is definately a hardware Limitation. I have been really curious if the r420 will support 4096x4096 textures too. Something ATI should do since Nvidias been supporting since the Nv25, Despite how few aplications use it, its very possible they will...


*thinks this is kinda reminiscent of the old Voodoo3 Max texture size of 512x512 argument*

 

One thing that immediately springs to mind is a shader program that is accidentally using an uninitialised register or part of one. It's undefined behaviour in GL, but I know on at least some of our drivers it didn't always cause bad rendering. I believe we've implemented a workaround that should be shipping now or soon.

 

People buy expensive stuff based on misleading advertising all the time. Some never find out the reality until they own the product, deny the reality to justify their purchase, or just plain never realise the truth until they use a competitors product.

The vast majority of purchasers of almost anything never do much in the way of research on what they are about to buy. Graphics cards are no different to any other product in that respect.

 

NV20 actually..

 

I honestly do not believe People who buy most of these cards care to be honest. IMO the Vast Majority of people

Why do we always have to go back to the ancient and tripe DirectX 9.0 argument, The Shader argument really gets old. Because frankly, I get tired of these endless rants ,

I'm tired of posts, "Exactly" Like yours, Who cant see any reason or desire to own a produce based on different user preference, You see Nvidia and think "Wow Crappy DX 9.0 Performance, Lower Precision, My God Gaming on an NVidia card must be this awful user experience.

When in fact its not, I listed the personal Merits to why I chose an Nvidia card, You selectively ignored them and just chose to rant about crap, It gets so annoying to be called an idiot just because you have a different preference, And its people like you who make posts like "these" just upset me further, Because you simply cant see why I would want an Nvidia card, So you feel the need to "rub it in the face" of the users who prefer them. without Even taking the time to consider that they may like them for completely different reasons.

You May call it Denial, But it's not, I'm pefectly aware and Happy about my card, After owning a 9500 Pro and still owning an 8500 AIW DV, And I have not flinced since moving onto my FX 5900, I will continue to watch these forums and see if something occurs that makes me change my mind.

 

I really like that the two reasons why people bought these cards are ati driver problelms . Hell give me 10 mins on a nvidia site and i will find nvidia driver problems.Oh wait how about clipping plains , automaticly lowering the detail settings i'm asking for and lowering the fp persicion ? Let alone the ton of other problems i had with my 5800ultra like the wierd wavy lines while i was playing games , the fact that in ultima 9 i was getting texture loss. Try playing a game where your avatar doesn't have textures for a head . Uo with 3d mode not working. Thats great have bugs in a 6 year old game. Way to go nvidia .

And the other is emulation which is illegal and a plug in writen by a third party .


Those are all eductated reasons .

Yea good job on those .