PS4 officially Jail Broken!

[monstercameron]

I don't think the sony population would be affected by widespread piracy.
Sony's bottom line would be affected due to less purchases and therefore less licensing revenue.
Their developers and publishers would be pissed.

That's about it, but the gamers would be fine

I can only hope that piracy will bring down digital only prices a la steam.
Not sure if its worth downloading multiple multi-GB roms and pirating these games...especially for their single player only content.

 

[iroboto]

I can only hope that piracy will bring down digital only prices a la steam.
Not sure if its worth downloading multiple multi-GB roms and pirating these games...especially for their single player only content.

That would be an interesting reaction to piracy. I've often been under the assumption that piracy happens more due to accessibility at the right price than people just looking for free stuff.

 

[tuna]

Surely this is about perfectly legal homebrew.

You can already do "homebrew" on the hacked PS4. Just write a standard Linux program. If people were able to run stuff in the PS4 (Orbis?) OS that would be real news and Sony should be getting worried. But that does not seem to be the case here.

 

[iroboto]

Apparently PS2 emulation unlocked on firmware 4.05; thread on resetera
https://www.resetera.com/threads/ps...ked-complete-with-ps2-emulation-unlock.18093/
Translation from Google

The documentation Flatz on how to create and run custom packages has meant a revolution in the scene of PlayStation 4. The original idea was to open the way for the community lograse home run software natively, an initiative that gave birth to PS4HEN a homebrew enabler which has ultimately served to load backup copies.

In the heat of PS4HEN, recently has appeared a set of tools called PKG Kitchen that allow to easily dump the games of PlayStation 4 ( via FTP or USB to an external disk ), modify them and generate a pkg that the console with a firmwarevulnerable installs and loads. The list of compatible titles grows as the hours pass and new games are being tested, but it is expected that they will end up running virtually all those that require firmware 4.05 or lower such as Grand Theft Auto V , Bloodborne , Street Fighter V or Uncharted. 4 .

The method to load (that does not modify) backups in PlayStation 4 is independent of the software of the system, but like PS4HEN, the program that allows to install them and to execute them of native form, requires of a vulnerability. Currently the most recent one that has been published affects firmware 4.05but everything seems to indicate that there is also one in version 5.01, which in case of spreading would affect practically all the games available for PlayStation 4.

But the advances are not limited to the titles of PlayStation 4. In the last hours cfwprophet has published Free PS2 Pub Gen , a tool that allows you to create backup copies of PlayStation 2 games and run them on a PlayStation 4 (which integrates an emulator) using PS4HEN. Flatz has managed to run games like Klonoa 2(which does not work on PlayStation 3) and Shinobi. Again, with the hours the list of compatible titles should grow.

The present of the PlayStation 4 scene is promising and the best could be to come. To the advances that are happening since the publication of PS4HEN we have to add a next conference scheduled for February 3 in the framework of Recon Brussels 2018 . This presentation promises to explain how the combination of exploits with hardware attacks allows you to extract private keys and sign personalized kernels on PlayStation 4.

You will find much more information about the new possibilities that PlayStation 4 has opened in the scene forum dedicated to the console.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

So totally ripped and open to complete piracy? After PS3's successes, even including the huge key cock-up, how can this be so??

 

[iroboto]

If it does 'explode' I'm curious to see what impact this would have on the console industry

 

[3dilettante]

So totally ripped and open to complete piracy? After PS3's successes, even including the huge key cock-up, how can this be so??

Just going back to the earlier exploit that started this thread or the PS4 cloning exploit, there was a succession of vulnerabilities left open for long periods of time and a raft of mitigations or commonly-used defenses Sony had the option of using that they didn't.

The PS3's disastrous exploit was in part a case of a security method that was implemented with the contribution of at least one security-conscious partner in IBM. Bulletproof security is hard, but the largest screwup was that the part it left up to Sony.

Maybe Sony doesn't care that much, or hasn't learned that much. I'm not sure how the keys being extracted this time compare to those that were extracted with the PS3, perhaps that is documented more fully. Sony was eventually able to mostly contain that breach, at least after firmware updates.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Maybe Sony doesn't care that much, or hasn't learned that much. I'm not sure how the keys being extracted this time compare to those that were extracted with the PS3, perhaps that is documented more fully. Sony was eventually able to mostly contain that breach, at least after firmware updates.

Sony must care because they run around making fixes after the fact. Why not do it right in the first place? That degree on incompetence is mind-boggling. I'm sure we discussed how solid security this gen was going to be after last gen's learning experiences. Take PS3 security, implement right, plus a few more recent improvements...and yet it seems like Sony ballsed it up completely, almost to Nintendo degrees?

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Depending on how suitable the PS4 is for cryptocurrency, piracy may be the least of its worries.

Regards,
SB

 

[iroboto]

Depending on how suitable the PS4 is for cryptocurrency, piracy may be the least of its worries.

Regards,
SB

LOL. Considering prices haven’t moved unlike GPUs. Yea that would be terrible. But I don’t see someone being able to code it for PS4. That would be a hell of a job. You’d need access to the SDK

 

[BRiT]

LOL. Considering prices haven’t moved unlike GPUs. Yea that would be terrible. But I don’t see someone being able to code it for PS4. That would be a hell of a job. You’d need access to the SDK

Well its not like the PS4 /4Pro SDK wasn't leaked either, but for earlier version.

But ... still far easier on the other platform, just register the $100 self developer registeration and run UWP application with nearly 75 - 80% resources available (6 of the 8 threads available and majority of gpu).

Surprised havent seen Cryptomining software for consoles yet.

 

[Cyan]

Depending on how suitable the PS4 is for cryptocurrency, piracy may be the least of its worries.

Regards,
SB

well, just like GPUs, it'd certainly help out with decentralization.

Well its not like the PS4 /4Pro SDK wasn't leaked either, but for earlier version.

But ... still far easier on the other platform, just register the $100 self developer registeration and run UWP application with nearly 75 - 80% resources available (6 of the 8 threads available and majority of gpu).

Surprised havent seen Cryptomining software for consoles yet.

maybe when Electroneum matures... But there is software for the Xbox One, iirc

 

[idsn6]

Apparently PS2 emulation unlocked on firmware 4.05; thread on resetera
https://www.resetera.com/threads/ps...ked-complete-with-ps2-emulation-unlock.18093/
Translation from Google

I feel that this should be angering users. Sony has mostly-general PS2 emulation, but is artificially restricting it to resell drip-fed individual titles instead of allowing gamers to play their own substantial existing libraries of physical PS2 discs. Compared to Microsoft's backward-compatibility efforts on the Xboxen, this is straightforwardly anti-consumer.

 

[Cynicalking]

I feel that this should be angering users. Sony has mostly-general PS2 emulation, but is artificially restricting it to resell drip-fed individual titles instead of allowing gamers to play their own substantial existing libraries of physical PS2 discs. Compared to Microsoft's backward-compatibility efforts on the Xboxen, this is straightforwardly anti-consumer.

For the gamers indeed...

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I too wanted PS2 BC with our existing discs. However, learning how MS does it, I understand why it's not happening and its not anti-consumer any more than other business decision.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/d...es-available-more-ps2-titles-running#comments

"Reported tests for PS2 game playback have shown that some titles which could not be run on PS3's software emulator (for example, Klonoa 2) do run on PlayStation 4. However, others do not fare so well, and with no specific tuning, graphical gitches or other artefacts may intrude."​

The emulator can't be trusted to run reliably on all games meaning it can't be offered up as a PS4 feature.

MS are running BC as a loss leader it seems. It's a significant undertaking to test and tune every game. If you aren't reselling the games, you are doing it for the sake of goodwill. MS have more invested in this as they want XBox/Live Games to be a platform across devices, and setting the standard that all your old games run, and thus so will future games if you stick with MS, is in their financial interests. Either Sony also do the same loss-leading testing and tweaking of the emulator for the sake of goodwill, or they let it run 'as is' with no quality assurance which would be fairly unprecedented for a supposed high quality console, I think, or they decide the quality isn't enough and the cost to certify games isn't too great, and leave it as is. The latter seems their option. Though these days people may be more accepting of a Beta quality service.

Point being, MS don't show BC is easy and Sony are being cheapskates. MS, who included BC aids into their system, still have a significant undertaking to enable it. Sony testing thousands of games to tune the emulator and let people play their old discs makes no business sense unless they want to change their story to 'PlayStation Forever' and promise BC in future hardware, which they can't do with PS3. I suppose the argument is, if your PS2 games were so important to you, why'd you get rid of your PS2?

 

[tuna]

LOL. Considering prices haven’t moved unlike GPUs. Yea that would be terrible. But I don’t see someone being able to code it for PS4. That would be a hell of a job. You’d need access to the SDK

You can just boot standard Linux with the included GPU-drivers.

 

[iroboto]

You can just boot standard Linux with the included GPU-drivers.

really...

damn well that changes things.

 

[3dilettante]

Sony must care because they run around making fixes after the fact.

This seems to often be a fix for the immediate exploit. The lack of defense-in-depth measures within the system that made the exploits so readily jump to practical usage apparently takes longer to revise.

Why not do it right in the first place? That degree on incompetence is mind-boggling. I'm sure we discussed how solid security this gen was going to be after last gen's learning experiences. Take PS3 security, implement right, plus a few more recent improvements...and yet it seems like Sony ballsed it up completely, almost to Nintendo degrees?

There's caring a lot, and caring not that much. Also, Sony's system software chops this gen seem to be showing their limits. They are improved from the prior one, but the rate of improvement has been a little sluggish.
I'm kind of curious what that might mean for the next gen, which I'm not counting on being easier since the competition has committed to a very comprehensive platform for enhancement and integration.

 

[idsn6]

The emulator can't be trusted to run reliably on all games meaning it can't be offered up as a PS4 feature.

Playstation backward compatibility, even when new consoles flat-out include the previous generation's hardware, has never been 100% reliable or faithful. Xbox backward compatibility has been more miss than hit. Even so, the utility of the feature in the general case has outweighed the problems with these exceptions and hasn't been an impediment to its being offered, advertised, and welcomed.

MS are running BC as a loss leader it seems. It's a significant undertaking to test and tune every game. If you aren't reselling the games, you are doing it for the sake of goodwill. MS have more invested in this as they want XBox/Live Games to be a platform across devices, and setting the standard that all your old games run, and thus so will future games if you stick with MS, is in their financial interests. Either Sony also do the same loss-leading testing and tweaking of the emulator for the sake of goodwill, or they let it run 'as is' with no quality assurance which would be fairly unprecedented for a supposed high quality console, I think, or they decide the quality isn't enough and the cost to certify games isn't too great, and leave it as is. The latter seems their option. Though these days people may be more accepting of a Beta quality service.

Free, open-source emulators maintained by unpaid programmers with essentially none of the hardware documentation or financial resources of Sony have managed to grow significant databases of working and even enhanced games, and their efforts are much more credibly done for goodwill considering that they get no cut from a hardware sale or software download that they helped facilitate. Sony has tens of millions of customers with hundreds of millions of PS2 discs who are likely willing and certainly readily available to do the grunt work of testing and reporting issues in a new beta service for the ultimate aim of being able to play their games again.

Point being, MS don't show BC is easy and Sony are being cheapskates. MS, who included BC aids into their system, still have a significant undertaking to enable it.

Microsoft has several implementations of backward compatibility. Some have required significantly more effort per game, but 360 compatibility on the XBO is relatively straightforward, is essentially what the PS4's PS2 emulator is doing, and is supported for both existing discs and new digital purchases. Even accepting the premise for the moment that Sony's general PS2 emulator cannot be released due to quality concerns, the fact that (unlike MS) they are deliberately locking it from playing user discs of already released and vetted titles is conclusive that, rather than being cheapskates, they are being actively greedy and anti-consumer.

Sony testing thousands of games to tune the emulator and let people play their old discs makes no business sense unless they want to change their story to 'PlayStation Forever' and promise BC in future hardware, which they can't do with PS3.

This is an all or nothing fallacy, similar to your first argument. Sony essentially already had "Playstation Forever" with their good stewardship of BC on PS2, PS3, and Vita. The PS4 broke with that history for what is now evident to be no good reason. BC for the PS3 is hardly the lynchpin required to continue offering compatibility; people already understand and are understanding of why it isn't possible.

I suppose the argument is, if your PS2 games were so important to you, why'd you get rid of your PS2?

Why did I "get rid of" a console that was notorious for rampant Disk Read Error fatalities and hasn't been in production for five years?

 

[MrFox]

These things are based on market research. It's neither pro or anti consumers. What I would consider anti-consumer is planned obsolescence, manipulative gambling-style game design. EULA abuses, lying about capabilities, timed exclusives hush money, knowingly releasing broken games to patch later, software patents abuses, online drm for 1p games, etc...

But features development need to provide some gain otherwise they get scrapped if not enough gamers want it enough to shift the market in your direction. Same for game cancellation, people are sad, but people's sadness don't pay for the game development.

I remember sony's marketing survey I received by email several years ago. They asked about the importance of BC for next-gen purchase intent, media playback, also about remasters, favorite game genres. Another independent market survey was about price bracket vs purchase intent. .. Results are not public, but the PS4/pro features and first party investments are certainly the result of their existing base preferences. The hard part was interpreting correctly among the noise online: sony did, while nintendo and MS didn't.

What I really wanted was true hardware PS3 BC on PS4 at launch but obviously there is no market for it to justify the hardware solution. I kept my old ps3 instead which is 100% hardware PS1/2/3. And the demand for BC is mostly during the first few years. Really old games are for collectors (with the old consoles)

It should be obvious looking at sales figures that two-and-a-half-generations-old BC is not moving consoles anymore. Notice how those who suddenly care about BC are all xbox fans. They wouldn't switch to ps4 if it half a halfassed software BC. Let alone PS2 BC.