My Revolution upgrade fantasy

Iron Tiger

Regular
We all know that Nintendo has said the Revolution won't be able to output in HD because the HDTV userbase is currently too small. But what about 2 or 3 years from now, when Xbox360, PS3, Blu-ray, HD-DVD, and HD broadcasting push more and more people to adopt the technology? Could Nintendo have an upgrade plan for then?

Here's how I envision it. Nintendo could offer an add-on that houses a die-shrunk Hollywood GPU (without the audio processing and whatever other superfluou subsystems may be on the standard Hollywood chip), a "Crossfire" compositing engine, additional video memory, and a higher bandwidth video output. The device will act as pass-through for older games that aren't supported (and support could potentially be "patched" on for some games via download), or run actively for supported games.

At launch, a flagship HD title will be bundled with it (for the first million or so units), and following its launch, games will offer the option to run in HD with the add-on, or SD without it. The pricing would be low enough to allow it to be bought with a Revolution and still cost less than an X360 or PS3, but high enough for Nintendo to make a profit on each unit shipped.

An HD Revolution (with integrated dual die-shrunk GPUs, video memory, and HD output) will be sold alongside the SD Revolution at a premium price, until the SD Revolutions can be phased out, at which time the HD Revolution will drop to the lower price point.

Now, this is just a little fantasy of mine, but the marketing falls in line with things Nintendo has done in the past. They offered an upgrade (Expansion Pak) that let certain N64 games run at higher resolutions. They launched the DS with a demo of a flagship game to demonstrate its potential out of the box. They revised the GB, GBA, and DS, and sold them alongside the originals until they could be phased out and replaced by their revisions. And all of these moves were successful for Nintendo in the past. The only thing that could prevent Nintendo from doing something like what I've outlined for the Revolution is that it's either technically impossible to do, or if the Revolution will indeed launch with HD output already integrated.
 
No, no, no, no, no...

No Sega CD, no 32X, no 3DO expansion... should I go on? If Nintendo even thought about HDTV, they should have implemented it into the Revolution. Any implementation of HDTV would exist in their next console. I know it's your dream and all, but the past has shown quite a negative history towards that way of thinking. The only device that sort of succeeded was the PS2 HDD, and even then it wasn't the big splash it was supposed to be.
 
typoEDR said:
No, no, no, no, no...

No Sega CD, no 32X, no 3DO expansion... should I go on? If Nintendo even thought about HDTV, they should have implemented it into the Revolution. Any implementation of HDTV would exist in their next console. I know it's your dream and all, but the past has shown quite a negative history towards that way of thinking. The only device that sort of succeeded was the PS2 HDD, and even then it wasn't the big splash it was supposed to be.
I think the N64 Expansion Pak was a lot more successful than the PS2 HDD, but then it also cost a lot less and supported a lot more games. And that's the model it would be following. Priced at $69.95 - $79.95 with a pack-in game or demo to enhance the appeal. And then integrate the functionality into the console, much like the N64 that shipped with the Expansion Pak and Donkey Kong 64.
 
in 3-4 years nintendo can simply launch a new revolution, a tad stronger or a lot cheaper then the current ps3/xbox360.

this one wouldnt even be in competition with the revolution1, and they could chose which drive format to support, and certainly offer the best 1080p support of the whole bunch.
 
Iron Tiger said:
I think the N64 Expansion Pak was a lot more successful than the PS2 HDD, but then it also cost a lot less and supported a lot more games. And that's the model it would be following. Priced at $69.95 - $79.95 with a pack-in game or demo to enhance the appeal. And then integrate the functionality into the console, much like the N64 that shipped with the Expansion Pak and Donkey Kong 64.

It, like the PS2 HDD, was successful because it was bundled with highly-anticipated games (the Exp. Pack with Donkey Kong 64 and the PS2 HDD with Final Fantasy XI). But what you're suggesting is far too expensive--the PS2 HDD had a hard time selling considering the cost of it and FFXI in the same pack. I don't think Nintendo would ever do anything like that, though I am not aware of any 'expansion' ports other than whatever device enables DVD playback.
 
I won't guess at how much a die-shrunk Hollywood GPU core with video memory and an HD output would cost to manufacture, but I'd guess it would cost a lot less than most people imagine. And the idea as I've outlined it doesn't rely on an expansion port. Crossfire takes the digital output (the GC had a digital A/V output port) from the base device and combines it with the output of a second chip, and outputs it to the display. Support would be at a driver (read: game) level.
 
The issue isn't really the output circuit, it's whether the machine has the grunt to support the resolution at reasonable framerates.

What your suggesting would require effectively packaging a new more powerful graphics chip into the addin. That's unlikely to be cheap.

The N64 expansion was nothing more than a couple of RAM chips.
 
I knew I'd overlooked something major when I was thinking this up and it just came to me what it is. How does the Crossfire Hollywood GPU know what to render? It doesn't, unless it has a connection to the CPU, and that's not provided through the digital video output port. The Revolution would have to have a PCIe-like expansion port for the expansion device to connect to. So I'll just flush this fantasy down the toilet.
 
Iron Tiger said:
I knew I'd overlooked something major when I was thinking this up and it just came to me what it is. How does the Crossfire Hollywood GPU know what to render? It doesn't, unless it has a connection to the CPU, and that's not provided through the digital video output port. The Revolution would have to have a PCIe-like expansion port for the expansion device to connect to. So I'll just flush this fantasy down the toilet.
Unless you have to buy a motherboard add-on with it! Seriously though, revolution games will probably have too low of a texture resolution to look good in high-definition. When I came into this thread, I expected something about an add-on to the Revmote controller....
 
nintenho said:
Unless you have to buy a motherboard add-on with it! Seriously though, revolution games will probably have too low of a texture resolution to look good in high-definition. When I came into this thread, I expected something about an add-on to the Revmote controller....

"It's hard out here for a nintenho"? ;)
 
A gaf posted stated this

Oblivion
runs better on PC than 360
(Today, 03:52 AM)
Reply | Quote

#163
It turns out I made a mistake. It's actually an x800 (no 1 in there). Forgive the confusion.

So how does it compare according to you tech whizzes?

Edit: ^^ It was in the Feb. issue just so you know, Thunder. The one with the PS3 in space on the cover


so if rev gpu is comparablie to the x800, how does that fair in your minds guys.
 
geo said:
"It's hard out here for a nintenho"? ;)
.....yeah, huh?

Well, actually this forum is perfect really. It's so sterile, you don't have to worry about tools being pissed off at my username. The mods at GAF won't even give me a chance so I asked them to at the least start a poll asking if my name is too annoying. What is wrong with people?

Back on topic....
 
Thunder Emperor said:
A gaf posted stated this

Oblivion
runs better on PC than 360
(Today, 03:52 AM)
Reply | Quote

#163
It turns out I made a mistake. It's actually an x800 (no 1 in there). Forgive the confusion.

So how does it compare according to you tech whizzes?

Edit: ^^ It was in the Feb. issue just so you know, Thunder. The one with the PS3 in space on the cover


so if rev gpu is comparablie to the x800, how does that fair in your minds guys.
Are you sure he wasn't joking? He's a pretty big nintendo fan. How old is the x800 anyways?
 
nintenho said:
Are you sure he wasn't joking? He's a pretty big nintendo fan. How old is the x800 anyways?


I know he is, still trying to confirm with anyone woho has got that issue of edge, x800 was the last ati line before the x1800 series lunch so about a yea rmax i would say
 
Thunder Emperor said:
I know he is, still trying to confirm with anyone woho has got that issue of edge, x800 was the last ati line before the x1800 series lunch so about a yea rmax i would say
That's impressive if true....

By the by, are you also on GAF? Can you pressure Vent and the other mods to make a poll asking if my username is annoying? PLEASE!:cry:....they offered me an alternative name and I said "spore" but that's no where nearly as cool! Ya know?
 
nintenho said:
That's impressive if true....

By the by, are you also on GAF? Can you pressure Vent and the other mods to make a poll asking if my username is annoying? PLEASE!:cry:....they offered me an alternative name and I said "spore" but that's no where nearly as cool! Ya know?


Lol I am on GAF but I just got my anme back after a ban so they won't be listen to me for a while. sorry man.
 
Thunder Emperor said:
Lol I am on GAF but I just got my anme back after a ban so they won't be listen to me for a while. sorry man.
Oh dammit all. Just randomly spring it on them (mods) in a thread that one of them is in and see how they react. Just don't mention that my alternate name is spore or else the mods will get frisky...
 
BTW do you now that ATI said it is devoloping a new design for Nintendo, but if we are speaking abut PC like CPUs why the X800 like and not a X1600 it is a better performer, better features, cooler and cheaper...So it wouldnt make sense something like that.


ERP said:
The issue isn't really the output circuit, it's whether the machine has the grunt to support the resolution at reasonable framerates.

Then why they dont suport it at all? For very simple games could be nice if the dev wanted (not that it would help in general) ... unless it as some very specific bottleneck (edram, BW ...that would fit in what is described by you , I think) [Edit] or unless you mean for keeping visual fidelitty.
 
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