Microsoft screwing up format unification says Next-Gen

Discussion in 'PC Hardware, Software and Displays' started by ROG27, Jan 9, 2006.

  1. ihamoitc2005

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    4.5 hours of HD movie on 1 disc? What bit-rate do you suggest for this and do you refer to single-layer or double-layer disc?

    Why do you think HD-DVD will have much lower cost? Drive manufacturer cost is ~ same and actual disc manufacture cost is same only difference is movies which is only little bit more for movie disc manufacturer because of initial equipment cost but DVD also had equipment cost but BD equipment is much more small and simple for movie manufacture. Also BD disc is not only 67% more space so 3hr movie and content can fit no problem but also has good scratch proof technology.

    Also what do you mean "slower moving technology"?

    Why do you say this my friend? What do you feel is cheaper about HD-DVD? Same drive technology (blue laser) but because of less "density" of disc data, actual drive speed (RPM) must be higher for HD-DVD to have same read/write rate so maybe HD-DVD drive is more expensive.

    Only big difference is disc protection technology and Blu-ray disc has new "fancy" super-hard protection layer but Blu-ray disc is also much less process steps for manufacture so cost is almost same as normal DVD. For "recordable media" cost/GB of blu-ray is much much less.
     
  2. scooby_dooby

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    Last time I checked most TV manufacturers do not license, fund and create content for their TV's.

    Even if Sony had no 1st party games they would collect royalties from an games released on their system. Any comparison between CE and Video Games is ridiculous. Console makers are in a distinct position in that they control content released on their hardware.

    Face it, your arguments againt MS are hyprocritical if you don't also apply them to sony, sony started out making walkmans and small audio components. They are now the major player in yet ANOTHER format war, just like they were with Beta and VHS.

    You can't blame MS and not blame Sony without being a complete hyprocrite.
     
  3. Bigus Dickus

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    Oh, c'mon. That's really just a ridiculous stretch of the term.

    B&W makes speakers. Are they in the "Music Industry?" No, they are in a branch of the consumer electronics industry.

    Monster Cable makes video/audio cables used for connecting players to displays, which are just as necessary in the playback chain as the player or display themselves. Is Monster Cable thus in the "entertainment industry" in the same way that you claim Sony making the player and/or display would be?

    Give me a break. That's the dumbest argument I've seen put forth in a long time.
     
  4. Edge

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    Most Xbox 360 fans are not too crazy about this HD-DVD drive, and knowing how well add-ons have sold in the past, this is not going to have much of an effect on the format war.

    It's still game over for HD-DVD as far as I'm concerned.

    Really now, how many threads do we need on the format war???
     
    #64 Edge, Jan 9, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 9, 2006
  5. patsu

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    It's just personal preferences. Nothing hypocritical or dumb about it.

    The essence of branding also include: Whether one is willing to affiliate oneself with a company, and how much premium one is willing to pay for a vendor's product given the same attributes.
     
    #65 patsu, Jan 9, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 9, 2006
  6. ROG27

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    We both have points here...but this argument is giving me a headache...I really never intended it to turn into this debacle...I was just ranting about how this twist affects me as a consumer at this point in time. It sucks. I was hoping this would be avoided with a winner in the early rounds.

    Plus...nearly all of their 'consumer electronics devices' deliver entertainment type content.

    That was the point I was making.
     
  7. ihamoitc2005

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    Blame

    I am sorry my friend I must disagree on this. Sony is promoting superior technology it has developed but MS is promoting inferior technology that is owned by other companies. Very different. Blame is always for company promoting inferior technology for this is not so good for consumers.
     
  8. scooby_dooby

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    Actually it is hypocritical to bash one company for 'not staying in their own market' while supporting another that has consistently gone outside of it's market(consumer electronic hardware) and created multiple format wars in the process.
     
  9. drpepper

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    Well, if the ratio to HDDVD drives sold for every 360 sold is respectable, I think the format wars will continue. But if your extrapolations are correct wrt add-ons then it will be as if MS never offered it in the first place and Blu-Ray still has the advantage. I think this announcement gave some life to the HDDVD camp, though by how much we'll not know till a year from now to get a better picture.

    True on your last statement, this could have been included with the multitude of threads relating to this issue.
     
  10. scooby_dooby

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    No, because superior technology is but one factor, it's not the end all and be all, otherwise we would have Beta right?

    Superior technology must be weighed against other factors, mainly projected costs, and realistic requirements. HD-DVD supports 4.5 hours of very high quality video which already surpasses realistic requirements, more than VHS or DVD ever provided.

    So, both formats are sufficient, and BR extra space is really not necessary. The main issue is truly cost, therefore if BR is truly signifigantly more expensive than HD-DVD, then blame should go to whoever is pushing it IMO.
     
  11. AW0L

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    I want a format war!.

    competition is good for who? not the companys competeting but for us the consumer. a format war will allow the formates to bottom out early. If one wins the format war we'll end up paying their price, but a late war will bottom out the price, the winner will end up pricing low and once there, their consumers wont want to pay higher then what was expected during the war, which means the winner cant price up anymore, once a lower price has been excepted by the consumers.
     
  12. drpepper

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    I wouldn't consider the technology "inferior" or something "superior" over something else. Just that they provide a solution they feel is necessary. :)

    I think HDDVD and BRD are both advanced tech. As it stands, what really makes them different is the current and potential capacities they can handle. I personally would rather have a 50 GB writable disc than a 30 GB disc. But that's just me... :wink:
     
  13. AW0L

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    dammit i did it again, I went comma crazy and forgot to put some periods in in my last post
     
  14. ROG27

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    You and I define markets differently...

    and seeing as no one is going to agree on how we cut market lines here...

    you cannot label me a hypocrite.

    Sony is in the business of delivering entertainment content...which has traditionally been delivered on removable media...this media takes all shapes and sizes depending on need for portability, size, access speed etc.

    Sony has always been into developing removable mediums on which to transport entertainment content. It's part of their business. I think I have sufficiently proven that Sony has always and always will be an entertainment company (whether it be on the device or content side of the spectrum).

    I don't see your point in calling me a hyporcrite...I never once initiated calling any of you anything.
     
    #74 ROG27, Jan 9, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 9, 2006
  15. ihamoitc2005

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    Market

    Sony is hardware design and development company with very large R&D budget so to have invention of creation of new technology for consumer electronic device is Sony "core" market no? Also this makes difference for Sony movie studio because they can have better disc for movie publishing purpose.

    But Microsoft is software development company, not hardware development company and it is promoting inferior hardware format that it does not own or develop, very different from what is "core" Microsoft and is not even Microsoft side business. HD-DVD support by Microsoft is not for better product, better profit, but for long-term strategy to weaken competitor in different field. Very different from Sony. Loser from HD-DVD is consumer.
     
  16. Carl B

    Carl B Friends call me xbd
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    Uhhh....

    But anyway, I like you're thinking WRT the format war more or less equaling a price war of sorts. That's a positive spin on this whole thing at least.
     
  17. drpepper

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    You're right, marketing and convenience to the customer is also very important in terms of a successful technology. If the world was ideal we would all be driving fuel efficient sedans and playing games off of powermacs, but we're not... :(

    I don't quite understand this. Realistic to what? In the electronics world, I believe you can never have enogh space or power. If Blu-ray offers more capacity then the choice is clear.

    One word, conjecture. This statement is truley folley. Those extra spaces will be used. Whether its to include multiple episodes in SD of a TV show or something else. I'd like to have all the Seinfeld episodes on 1 disc, probably not going to happen, but the less discs I have to have the better.

    Cost advantage will not last long for HDDVD as parity will eventually be reached.
     
  18. Sis

    Sis mental_v-sync=off;
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    No, people have agreed on how to cut market lines. You either misspoke earlier when you said Sony was always an entertainment company or do not understand what it means to be an entertainment company. Perhaps you really meant they were always an electronics company, in which case they have a vested interest in standards for consumer electronic devices. They were surely not always an entertainment company, but that is not really important in any regards...

    Why you insist on debating a point that is obviously wrong I don't know. Just concede that you were wrong--it doesn't really detract from your point that MS has little to no vested interest in the HD disc format...

    .Sis
     
  19. Sis

    Sis mental_v-sync=off;
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    Once again from the top: there are other consumer electronic companies backing HD-DVD. There are several studios backing HD-DVD. So why is Microsoft in the wrong for supporting HD-DVD? If they backed Blu-ray, would that make them right?

    .Sis
     
  20. drpepper

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    Nope, let's just say they're screwed no matter what decision they make.
     
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