Microsoft aquires Beam game streaming

[eastmen]

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2016/...-site-will-integrate-features-into-its-games/

Should those features not interest people who are hooked on either YouTube Gaming or Twitch, Beam's other major differentiation might do the trick: ultra-low latency. Beam advertises an average difference of 200 milliseconds between when a game event happens and when viewers see it, which will certainly make chat during frenetic games that much smoother between players and fans. The service says that functionality comes in part from Beam being built entirely out of HTML5.

To me this is major news. They can intergrate special hardware in Scorpio to enhance it even further and tie streaming to xbox live member ships.
The community features already put beam above twitch imo and MS should be able to add a great deal to it

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Good for average users, established creators using YouTube and Twitch are unlikely to switch. They'll stay where the fat revenue is.

 

[eastmen]

Good for average users, established creators using YouTube and Twitch are unlikely to switch. They'll stay where the fat revenue is.

yes but it will give a chance for new creators to get noticed

 

[Silent_Buddha]

yes but it will give a chance for new creators to get noticed

Unlikely. It basically comes down to this. Unless Twitch does something boneheaded to drive away the major streamers then Twitch is where viewers will continue to go. Since Twitch is where the vast majority (like 95% or more) of stream viewers go when they wan to see someone streaming (even if it's just to browse random streams) then that's where Streamers go to try to get an audience.

It's basically at the point where it feeds itself. Viewers go to Twitch because that's where all the big streamers are. Streamers use Twitch because that's where all the viewers are. Rinse and repeat.

There have been plenty of competing services that offer better streaming quality but they all inevitably fail because discovery is abysmal at the competition. Some big streamers used to try to move away from Twitch to the competing stream services. And while their followers would follow them, their new subscribers and new viewers would drop massively. That meant that over time they'd gradually lose subscribers since there was little to no discovery because viewers almost always use Twitch to discover new streamers. And so they'd end up going back to Twitch, at which point they'd once again start gaining subscribers and new viewers.

That was even worse for streamers trying to make a name for themselves. They had the same problems with discoverability but they didn't have any followers that could attempt to draw in new followers.

If you watch many of the more successful Twitch streamers, this inevitably comes up time after time after time when people will ask the streamer if they'll go to X new streaming service because it's "better than Twitch." And then the streamer will say no, and then explain why it isn't economically feasible for them to do so (discoverability drops massively).

I just hope for Microsoft's sake they didn't pay a lot for this acquisition.

Regards,
SB

 

[Shifty Geezer]

How does a fifth of a second make realtime typed chat better? That's one or two letters latency!

 

[eastmen]

Unlikely. It basically comes down to this. Unless Twitch does something boneheaded to drive away the major streamers then Twitch is where viewers will continue to go. Since Twitch is where the vast majority (like 95% or more) of stream viewers go when they wan to see someone streaming (even if it's just to browse random streams) then that's where Streamers go to try to get an audience.

It's basically at the point where it feeds itself. Viewers go to Twitch because that's where all the big streamers are. Streamers use Twitch because that's where all the viewers are. Rinse and repeat.

There have been plenty of competing services that offer better streaming quality but they all inevitably fail because discovery is abysmal at the competition. Some big streamers used to try to move away from Twitch to the competing stream services. And while their followers would follow them, their new subscribers and new viewers would drop massively. That meant that over time they'd gradually lose subscribers since there was little to no discovery because viewers almost always use Twitch to discover new streamers. And so they'd end up going back to Twitch, at which point they'd once again start gaining subscribers and new viewers.

That was even worse for streamers trying to make a name for themselves. They had the same problems with discoverability but they didn't have any followers that could attempt to draw in new followers.

If you watch many of the more successful Twitch streamers, this inevitably comes up time after time after time when people will ask the streamer if they'll go to X new streaming service because it's "better than Twitch." And then the streamer will say no, and then explain why it isn't economically feasible for them to do so (discoverability drops massively).

I just hope for Microsoft's sake they didn't pay a lot for this acquisition.

Regards,
SB

Like I said it all depends on what MS does with this . Twitch has done many bonehead things ni the past and seem to be willing to do them again. They still don't have a decent player for the pc.

MS has the power of its platform. Like I said they can enable better compression on the xbox scorpio that is only avalible to Beam and also make a more stream lined client that intergrates with the xbox line up.

I don't think Beam would over take Twitch but it really doesn't have too.

Bing has been a slow grower but is over 20% of the US search market now
http://www.winbuzzer.com/2016/08/30/microsoft-bing-continues-take-googles-search-share-u-s-xcxwbn/

and the UK

http://www.digitalstrategyconsultin...g_gains_on_google_with_20_uk_market_share.php

can't find numbers in other regions but I am sure MS would love 20% of video game streaming.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Bing's growth is likely because people type their search into the address bar and just view the results, and with Win 10 that's Bing by default which many people won't (know how to) change. If searching required selecting Google or Bing, I don't think Bing would get a look in. The only way to get similar results for streaming would be to have MS use their own stream system by default and users not know to switch. Well, if they're wanting to stream on Twitch (as that's where the audience is) but end up streaming on Live, they'll probably go looking!

 

[eastmen]

Bing's growth is likely because people type their search into the address bar and just view the results, and with Win 10 that's Bing by default which many people won't (know how to) change. If searching required selecting Google or Bing, I don't think Bing would get a look in. The only way to get similar results for streaming would be to have MS use their own stream system by default and users not know to switch. Well, if they're wanting to stream on Twitch (as that's where the audience is) but end up streaming on Live, they'll probably go looking!

Like I said creating the better software for their xbox line up would be a start. They can also entice streamers to move over to beam. Sure the big guys wont move but there are a lot of people streaming on twitch that aren't making money but have small followings and will move if they can make money.

MS already has its own channel where game clips are uploaded automaticly. Enabling that type of feature for beam or even displaying beam streams on the dash can drive growth.

Another place they can find an audience is by making it easier to stream. The software on twitch for that is horrible. Features aren't supported on the xbox one / ps4 and most gamers who want to seriously stream need to buy extra hardware like the eldgato streamer. On the pc side there are multiple streaming software packages that cost money and are janky or free and well crap. If MS can make a feature rich streaming solution on xbox and pc with feature parity and make it easy to use that is a one up over twitch.

Oh and lets not forget payments . Right now as a streamer on twitch you can make money by getting partnered which requires a lot of followers and active viewers. You can subscribe to that channel for $5 a month or they beg for paypal donations. The way twitch is set up now its just a stream of people thanking every new follow or donation with huge pop ups. A stream lined setup for payments could go a long way in making both users and broadcasters switch to something new

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I won't argue that MS can't compete, but it's nigh impossible to migrate an entrenched audience. I wouldn't bother trying to create an alternative auction site to eBay, for example. All these things thrive on popularity, and a startup with zero followers (or single digit percentage sized market share) won't have the size necessary to attract the content to be something people want to adopt. Whether Facebook, YouTube, Twitch, Android, Windows, etc., there's literally no point trying to take these on unless one's willing to plough crazy money into forcing growth (eg. big payouts for users!).

There was one I was directed to recently, a crowdfunding startup just for indie games. Nice idea, but it's pointless if no-one follows it, and if no games use it (because there are no followers/users) then no one will use it so no games will bother releasing on it... Hence you have to use Kickstart or Indiegogo - an established player with the reach to actually work.

 

[eastmen]

I won't argue that MS can't compete, but it's nigh impossible to migrate an entrenched audience. I wouldn't bother trying to create an alternative auction site to eBay, for example. All these things thrive on popularity, and a startup with zero followers (or single digit percentage sized market share) won't have the size necessary to attract the content to be something people want to adopt. Whether Facebook, YouTube, Twitch, Android, Windows, etc., there's literally no point trying to take these on unless one's willing to plough crazy money into forcing growth (eg. big payouts for users!).

There was one I was directed to recently, a crowdfunding startup just for indie games. Nice idea, but it's pointless if no-one follows it, and if no games use it (because there are no followers/users) then no one will use it so no games will bother releasing on it... Hence you have to use Kickstart or Indiegogo - an established player with the reach to actually work.

There aren't other auction sites but Amazon has allowed users to sell their items on their site . YouTube has the likes of vimeio and others competing with it. Yes it wont become as big but you don't need to be the market leader to compete. Look at Facebook , you still have Instagram , twitter , google hangouts and so on competing with it because the pie is so large that even a little piece will make someone money.

Kickstarter has its indegogo to compete with. Also if the indie game crowdfunding site offers a big name a low % they could get them on their platform and after that big name brings in eye balls they can then get more games and backers to their site. That was what happened with kickstarter. Kickstarter exploded because of back to back known names coming into the space. Chris Roberts , Lord British , the broken age guys and so on.

MS bought this tech and I am sure they will expand it and push it forward. I've looked at the site and the site is leagues better than twitch so they have a good base to start from. If they intergrate it into scorpio with better compression + the faster chat and give a way for smaller broadcasters to make money without spaming the channels I think it will grow quite nicely.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Look at Facebook , you still have Instagram , twitter , google hangouts and so on competing with it because the pie is so large that even a little piece will make someone money.

Most of these are doing something different. Attempts to recreate a social site similar to Facebook basically fail unless contrived like Google+. MySpace etc. are dead.

Kickstarter has its indegogo to compete with. Also if the indie game crowdfunding site offers a big name a low %

Right, it's about incentive to get content and users. Now in this example, a small percentage is no incentive when the number of users of the sire is hundreds. If you're looking for $50,000, you need something bigger than a 500 ppl crowdfunding site. So no project in its right mind is going to use that service as it just won't work. The only way to get a big name on is either by the family owing you a favour or offering them a big payout. "Look, we'll pay you $20,000 for listing with us even if you don't get funding. Then you can take it elsewhere if it fails." But it's all about incentive.

MS has two options with their own streaming. One is to offer it in parallel and try to get people to voluntarily move over, and the other is to force people to use their service. If they go the former, who is going to stream on XBeam to an active audience of 20,000 when Twitch has 20,000,000? There needs to be incentive. And if they go the latter, which is something MS has prior with, they would probably just piss everyone off. "How come we can't stream XBox games to Twitch and have to use this friggin' XBeam shit? No-one even uses XBeam!"

MS bought this tech and I am sure they will expand it and push it forward.

They'll push it, but growth isn't a given. They pushed Zune and Windows Mobile etc. and got nowhere because those markets were already contested and secured by the market leaders. It's highly questionable that a new public game steaming service could get anywhere unless it's backdoored to success somehow. YouTube could introduce game streaming, as could Facebook or Instagram or any other platform with a massive public following as a social media service. But a new player really isn't going to do well. It'd be like some outsider wanting to bring in a new console. If Daewoo phoned you up asking for your advice on creating a new console, what would you say?

Just looking at Beam, its viewers are barely in the triple digits. 108 people watching Minecraft videos. How is anyone aspiring to get an audience of 10,000 going to achieve that by broadcasting on Beam? Why's any viewer going to default to Beam? Make streaming of all XBox games exclusive to it for one month after release...would that help grow it or just create outrage? It'll probably be included as standard in Win 10 and on the dashboard of XB1, for sure. Do people use their consoles for watching game streams?

 

[BadTB25]

Do people use their consoles for watching game streams?

I did/do. Mostly I use my Shield TV, but every now and then I use Twitch. I think Beam can be successful if, like Eastmen said, they find away to include the capture software for free that competes with the paid versions.

I did notice that the quality of the stream is a bit better than Twitch for the few times I watched MS streaming on it.

 

[BRiT]

People absolutely use their consoles to watch game streams, especially when its integrated into the core dashboard and os as part of the social aspects.

 

[eastmen]

They'll push it, but growth isn't a given. They pushed Zune and Windows Mobile etc. and got nowhere because those markets were already contested and secured by the market leaders. It's highly questionable that a new public game steaming service could get anywhere unless it's backdoored to success somehow. YouTube could introduce game streaming, as could Facebook or Instagram or any other platform with a massive public following as a social media service. But a new player really isn't going to do well. It'd be like some outsider wanting to bring in a new console. If Daewoo phoned you up asking for your advice on creating a new console, what would you say?

Just looking at Beam, its viewers are barely in the triple digits. 108 people watching Minecraft videos. How is anyone aspiring to get an audience of 10,000 going to achieve that by broadcasting on Beam? Why's any viewer going to default to Beam? Make streaming of all XBox games exclusive to it for one month after release...would that help grow it or just create outrage? It'll probably be included as standard in Win 10 and on the dashboard of XB1, for sure. Do people use their consoles for watching game streams?

YouTube has game streaming. Its called youtube gaming . It launched around the same time beam did.

Yes beam viewers are lower than twitch that's for sure but remember Beam doesn't exist on the ps4 or xbox one currently. So its going to have am uch smaller audience. I am sure one of the first things MS will do is make a Beam app for windows and xbox one / scorpio.

You don't need to make xbox games exclusive to Beam. You can offer better features and perhaps even earlier access to beam streamers. You can enable better broadcast software.

And yes I watch twitch and youtube streams from my xbox one.

 

[AzBat]

Here's a capture of an email I received from Beam today. Looks like a bit of success for Beam & more news coming Sept. 14.



Tommy McClain

 

[BadTB25]

Also, they need to make it compatible with as many Android/IOS devices as possible.
I can download it for my Shield Tablet, but not my Shield TV. I could probably sideload it, but would prefer to wait for official support.

 

[eastmen]

Yea I stream a bit on twitch but I'm thinking jumping on beam may be good because it will be easier to get seen and create a following. I wont kid myself I doubt I would get over a 100 followers on twitch.

 

[bunge]

What's the next killer feature for streamers? Make it exclusive to Scorpio and available to watch on all systems.

 

[BadTB25]

Yea I stream a bit on twitch but I'm thinking jumping on beam may be good because it will be easier to get seen and create a following. I wont kid myself I doubt I would get over a 100 followers on twitch.

What's your Twitch/Beam channel name?

 

[BadTB25]

What's the next killer feature for streamers? Make it exclusive to Scorpio and available to watch on all systems.

If they want wide-spread adoption, making it exclusive would not be the right call imo. They need to have the Beam app on as many platforms as possible.

I think making it integrated with the XB1/Scorpio OS/games and making it easier for Xbox/Win10 streamers would be enough.