Kinect technology thread

Yeah, pretty interesting. After all the patent buying stuff that Microsoft did I am very surprised to see that PrimeSense is free to work with various partners for this kind of thing, first with the drivers and now this, which will apparently even lead to a full PC App Store for applications targetting the device, including supporting developer libraries and what not.
 
Yeah, pretty interesting. After all the patent buying stuff that Microsoft did I am very surprised to see that PrimeSense is free to work with various partners for this kind of thing, first with the drivers and now this, which will apparently even lead to a full PC App Store for applications targetting the device, including supporting developer libraries and what not.

Don't Microsoft own Primesense? Therefore it really is a part of Microsoft carrying on as a semi-independant entity?
 
The agreement may well be exclusive for consoles. MS don't much like hardware, so are unlikely to want to own the PC camera-interface hardware market. Better for them and the whole Windows platform to have 3rd parties supplying and competing with hardware, as long as it's Windows of a sort (new CE version for set-top boxes) provigind the media interfaces.
 
No, they just license some Primesense tech. They did buy 3DV and Canesta in the last 12-18 months, ostensibly for the patents they hold.

It makes me wonder what effective and alternative solutions are out there that Sony or Nintendo can use for a controller free interface and gaming.

The guy who worked for Move said in an interview that they experimented with 3D cameras before and they just waited for the costs to go down for a 3D camera with more resolution.

He did mention that there are alternative solutions like a dual camera but that doesnt sound as effective. Or is it? They probably have a solution at hand which they didnt mention for strategic purposes? We didnt see any patent filed from them though (kept it a secret?). It would be funny if they didnt pattent their solution and happens to be the same as one of the patented solutions owned by 3DV and Canesta :LOL:
 
Very cool ... you have to move in slow motion to get decent framerates for now, but you won't get a cheaper motion capture studio anywhere I bet! Now hook this up to Blender and we're talking REALLY cheap. ;)
 
Yeah, pretty interesting. After all the patent buying stuff that Microsoft did I am very surprised to see that PrimeSense is free to work with various partners for this kind of thing, first with the drivers and now this, which will apparently even lead to a full PC App Store for applications targetting the device, including supporting developer libraries and what not.
I've seen on their site that they are exclusive on console, free on everywhere else.

Not sure if it is a smart move (for Ms, that could lock exclusiveness in many areas) but should fasten the ecosystem for applications for these devices. And since they all are most likely based on the same reference design they should have very similar capabilities. (However this asus' camera won't have to deal with audio. I wonder if they will be able to provide higher resolution streams due the extra bandwidth available)
 
The Asus device can use the full USB 2.0 spec instead of half. There are also other options there of course, such as USB 3.0 or eSata, compression, or whatever. But USB 2.0 seems likely if they want to make a mainstream device.
 
Very cool ... you have to move in slow motion to get decent framerates for now, but you won't get a cheaper motion capture studio anywhere I bet! Now hook this up to Blender and we're talking REALLY cheap. ;)

He states in the description that he captures at 30fps, it's the screen capture software that produced the low fps video.


Cheers
 
Ah, I see! Even better (he should get better capturing software ... tssk ;) ).
 
But how big is the change that kinect can Rrod a 360.
A lot of sources(BBC and 1up) are reporting it. When i think about it, it seems really not possible how much more heat and power can the usb connection generate. I believe a full used usb hub takes like 5 watt or something(?)
 
But how big is the change that kinect can Rrod a 360.
A lot of sources(BBC and 1up) are reporting it. When i think about it, it seems really not possible how much more heat and power can the usb connection generate. I believe a full used usb hub takes like 5 watt or something(?)

Usage change perhaps: prior to connect, you might play a few hours here and there. Post kinect, you have longer or more frequent gaming sessions?
 
I believe Kinect processing is done on the GPU, but I'd expect usage is the more likely culprit. People with old xboxs playing long sessions when they get Kinect for the first time, or something like that.
 
But how big is the change that kinect can Rrod a 360.
A lot of sources(BBC and 1up) are reporting it. When i think about it, it seems really not possible how much more heat and power can the usb connection generate. I believe a full used usb hub takes like 5 watt or something(?)

As it is run on the GPU using the shaders to run the skeletal tracking algorithms, it would be similar to what Furmark or highly efficient and dense compute shader use on graphics cards do. So just go and compare power useage when running Furmark without some form of power containment (GTX 580 with app detection off or 4870 befor a certain version of Catalyst driver introduced app detection for Furmark) to any other game or benchmark that use all parts of the GPU.

And since ATI/AMD didn't start implementing hardware based power containment until 5xxx series of cards, then there's a chance this might be generating excessive levels of power use on earlier X360's. Especially before they started to shrink the GPU.

Regards,
SB
 
I believe Kinect processing is done on the GPU, but I'd expect usage is the more likely culprit. People with old xboxs playing long sessions when they get Kinect for the first time, or something like that.

Somehow long sessions and Kinect games don't match up ...

I'm voting for the GPU theory. They have to really work that thing to process the data, no question about it, so it makes a lot of sense.
 
5 million Kinects sold, all played over Christmas, it seems likely to me to be coincidence. A portion of 360's will RROD (my friends PS3 YLOD just before Christmas) in that period no matter what was being played, likely a higher increase over usual numbers because people ahve time of work and family/friends to game with. But as everyone was playing the same thing, the reports are - "I was playing Kinect when my XB360 died," "me too," "gosh, so was I!" - and the connection between Kinect and XB360 is made.

What is needed is a comparison of what proportion of 360's died at the same time other years, irrespective of what was being played, so see if there is a change caused by what is being played rather than just lots of people playing. But even then, if 360's weren't as active other years because they weren't showing everyone the latest, greatest thing, it wouldn't be terribly accurate.
 
Wow, that sounds almost EXACTLY like the complaints many computer users had about using a mouse versus keyboard shortcuts. :)

Mouse being slow, needing a "good amount of dexterity," etc. to achieve simple actions. And yet I'd take a guess that 99% of computer users don't bother with keyboard shortcuts anymore even if they are orders of magnitude faster and 100% accurate (I still sometimes click on the wrong thing with a mouse if I'm in a hurry).

Now my point here isn't that motion controls will achieve as much universal popularity over conventional controls as the mouse did over keyboard controls but that sometimes "fastest" or "most accurate" or whatever isn't what people end up wanting to use. Sometimes things like intuitive and easy to understand is better.

We're still in the very early days of hands free control systems. It arguably took the computer mouse 21 years (prototype in 1963 to first mainstream useage in a Macintosh in 1984 with various less popular implementations in between) to get to a point where computer users would even consider it. Then arguably another 6 years from that until the first popular version of Windows (version 3.0) brought it to most PC users. And another 5 years from that before it started to become the defacto PC control method for the majority of computer users with Win95.

I imagine we'll be seeing massive experiementation with this before a solid and consistent method of control is settled upon.

Regards,
SB

You are telling us exactly what I am trying to explain : the mouse became the best intuitive tool to use the 'graphical interface' when 2D GUI became popular with Macintosh and Microsoft graphical operating system. In 80row text interface, the mouse is almost useless because interface is text oriented, and text input is done using a keyboard, so keyboard shortcuts was the way to go.
Nevertheless, even in graphical interface, keyboard shortcuts are still fully used, precise and 100% reliable, but needs to be memorized and integrated by the user. Mouse and keyboard are living together nowadays !

Same goes on with kinect/primesense technology. As it is actually applied to the actual interfaces, it does only mimic mouse or keyboards input scheme.
So for the moment, it is experimental and useless. Maybe it is more convenient for musuem and such situation where giving keyboard/mouse to public is full of annoyance and technical problems (usability, sanity, worn out, etc...) but even if the wow démo seems to be working, it is limited, slow and exhausting . And just keep in mind that human people always choose the lazy path (i.e. mouse keeps user memorize keyboard shortcuts)

I guess it will be difficult, need a long time to find a really usefull, effective and consistent scheme for handfree input devices.

Applied to gaming, the kinect system is at ease when the puppet is the player (dance central or all fitness gaming, no lag as the system is waiting on the virtual skeleton to match the attended position) but when the puppet-master is the human player, a 'steady' body seems really limited (walk in 3d space without walking in reality ? hu ? ) and for the moment, when the excitement fades, all I see for the moment is laggy and simple input scheme.

Interested in this new technology, but still waiting for something "woerth" it. :LOL: (I am french, sorry for the joke and my english)
 
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