Hum not a surprise if they were to tracking tht kind of movement they would also track hands more precisely possibly fingers. So still FUD... At this rate we will have new about playing guitar not possible on Kinect all over again. Issues about the sitting position will be raise every time one site want some extra clicks, etc.
Kinect technology thread
- Thread starter LightHeaven
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Maybe maybe not for one seeing how looks the skeletal representation Kinect creates from the camera capture I wonder how it would be possible. I mean last time we saw there were three points from the elbow to the hand (say elbow, wrist, hand) how could you spot rotation when they are aligned? And even with not aligned I'm not sure the precision (pretty much the opposite actually) of the capture would be good enough to be considered as a reliable input for a game.
To bad the presentations on Natal are not available on ms gamefest site. It's still unclear to which extend the libraries Ms made available allow for shapes recognition based on 2D data (and if yes at which cost) for example. We know actually few about what Kinect can or cannot do? We know the resolution on the Z axis and that pretty much all.
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We know Kinect doesn't track hand orientation as the system can only track joint positions, so I'm wondering where you heard the bowling game uses wrist movement? eg. Point your arm straight towards the screen, hand flat, palm down. Now rotate your arm so the palm points face up. Kinect has no mechanic for tracking this motion, seeing only the extended arm position. Now if the hand is flexed back there should be enough area to get another point. I can't find any videos that shows the skeleton tracking to see if the hand is being watched. If so, that'll give some rotation information.
Well like I said, there's a video on the Giant Bomb site showing Jeff trying the bowling game and talking about the wrist issue specifically (and showing how to do an effect ball). It doesn't seem to prevent people from enjoying it though.
Kinect is helping to inspire people to think about hands-free interfaces and different applications for the home. Interfaces for surgeons? Monitoring the elderly? Not yet, but maybe when the tech matures.
http://www.newscientist.com/article...for-games.html?DCMP=OTC-rss&nsref=online-news
http://www.newscientist.com/article...for-games.html?DCMP=OTC-rss&nsref=online-news
Exactly, one thing I noticed Matrick drop in a GT interview, casually enough, was something about them stressing Kinect as a "controller free experience".
I remember initially there was talk about "scanning in" objects to use in games via Natal. All that has dropped by the wayside now, and I'm sure it's for purity of message. Perhaps though I think it might be brought back at some point after release if Natal is a hit. But for now I think they very strictly want to stick to the "controller free" mantra.
Even cheap TVs run Linux nowadays.
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Veteran
I dislike how the Kinect thread is split now. I'm not sure where to put things, so I posted this in both:
http://www.develop-online.net/news/35198/Source-pins-Kinect-manufacturing-costs-to-150
A bit much for a crappy VGA camera (with only a 30hz refresh) a couple of microphones and CMOS sensors and a tilting base.
Maybe they're using expensive plastic.
http://www.develop-online.net/news/35198/Source-pins-Kinect-manufacturing-costs-to-150
A bit much for a crappy VGA camera (with only a 30hz refresh) a couple of microphones and CMOS sensors and a tilting base.
Maybe they're using expensive plastic.
$150 to make?
seems unlikely..
RGB - cost $10. Looked online for various prices.
Microphone - probably $10 at most.
Motor and housing - probably $10 at most.
The thing I can't seem to find prices are of the infrared projecter and monochrome cmos detector.
seems unlikely..
From MS's website said:
RGB - cost $10. Looked online for various prices.
Microphone - probably $10 at most.
Motor and housing - probably $10 at most.
The thing I can't seem to find prices are of the infrared projecter and monochrome cmos detector.
The article mentions that $150 is not just for the BOM, but also the R&D costs. Remember they bought 3DV Systems & licensed the tech from 3DV Systems. If the rumor is legit, then it definitely explains why Microsoft is treating this like a new system launch.
Tommy McClain
If every time our company bought a new one we jacked up a $30 product to $150 due to recovering purchases ... 
Resolution, refresh rate, and processing power do seem to be things we will need to wait until next gen to get a solution that is more robust. Kinect should do all the dance, gesture, and gross movement apps just fine though.
Resolution, refresh rate, and processing power do seem to be things we will need to wait until next gen to get a solution that is more robust. Kinect should do all the dance, gesture, and gross movement apps just fine though.
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corduroygt
Banned
A 420 line IR security camera sells for $80 in Amazon, and that's with the lens, weatherproof housing, etc, and it's made by Sony...
http://www.amazon.com/Infrared-weatherproof-surveillance-warning-1CX/dp/B000WYVFZS
The "Projector" is a IR laser diode and I'm guessing some sort of diffraction grating, from what I've gleaned from PrimeSense's stuff.
They don't need an IR specific camera as all CCD pick up IR, and have a filter to remove it. There's a YouTube been posted before showing how to remove the PSEye's IR filter and add optical filter (used photographic film) to enable Wii or head tracking with mounted IR LEDs. so the actually Kinect camera gubbins are probably two identical cameras, once with an IR filter for the optical feed, the other with a visible light filter for the IR detection, and then you'll have the IR projection, whatever that is. The move away from TOF depth detection has meant a very cheap BOM, but of course costs to produce a marketable product and sell it are never as low as what it costs to buy the bits and put them together!
So it maxes out at 30fps too, gosh. Microsoft still skimping as hard as they can.
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Veteran
AND it's only VGA now, before it was 1.3 MP and the mic doesn't track multiple voices and all the onboard processing hardware has been removed.
How can it possibly cost 150 to make? Usually manufacturing costs don't include R&D costs
The components don't cost that much, so what, are they getting Swiss watchmakers to put it together.
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That's what I was wondering too, but then you have statements like these:
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=252703
Which begs the question, what's going to happen when Kinect 2 lands (if it comes out at Xbox 3's launch) will devs still support the current Kinect or move to 2 or what.
