Imagination Technologies up for sale

Discussion in 'Graphics and Semiconductor Industry' started by tangey, Jun 22, 2017.

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  1. entity279

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    I think you @Nebuchadnezzar are working at IMG according to your LE profile? Just stating/asking this in case it were not known.
     
  2. tangey

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    A question that I would suggest a lot of people buying shares in-between the two periods would definitely want answered.
    from yahoo:-

    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/apple-challenges-imagination-technologies-disclosure-194803546.html
    Having been an IMG investor since they were videologic (but more or less by good luck, exiting prior to the current upheaval), I do know historically that IMG was very light on details on many licencee arrangements, with NDAs regularly cited, and when it came to Apple, info was pretty much non-existant, which was clearly at apple's request.

    When you get a "we won't be using anything from you, and intend not to pay you a penny in 12-18 months time", it is not spinnable.Maybe IMG decided there was enough grey in alledged previous communications to give them a pass. Who knows, I'm not a lawyer,
     
    #62 tangey, Jul 18, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2017
  3. Nebuchadnezzar

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    Just throwing out the UK market legislation in case people weren't aware.
     
  4. Entropy

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    Talking about the information timeline specifically, I feel there are a number of things that point to Apples description being correct.
    1. As IMG is for sale, their current leadership does anything in their power to keep share prices up. The statements of Andrew Heath are demonstraby deceptive.
    2. Apple responded as a rebuttal to Andrew Heaths claims as they cast a shadow on the company. (How IMG communicates to their shareholders is after all their own business/problem).
    3. Apple was open with their intention to develop proprietary IP even before the first date in their rebuttal. And it cannot be a surprise to IMG that Apple hasn't licensed their later designs. What interest could they have in any duplicity here?
    4. IMG personnel started jumping ship and made comments that suggested that they knew that Apple wouldn't keep providing IMG with funding.

    This is a business thread, and the business side of this is going to play out as it will. I care little for investor interests, I merely hope that good ideas will be put to use and that employees suffer minimal consequences.
    But I admit that being a science guy, I find AH irritating. All of us here who have followed this know that feigning surprise in Apple going their own way is ridiculous and dishonest.
     
  5. Rufus

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    Imagination driver issues are preventing Atom CPUs from being upgraded to the latest version of Windows 10.

    https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/201...ems-wont-get-windows-10-creators-update-ever/

     
  6. Kaarlisk

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    Also, other older drivers do seem to work fine, so I suspect that it actually is a bug that the vendor is unwilling to fix and Microsoft cannot/does not feel a need to work around.
     
  7. tangey

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    We are about 2 months since they announced the entire company was for sale. Not only hasn't there been any formal word about how things are progressing, but surprisingly, there hasn't been any leaks or rumours. Normally, regardless of agreements, one generally sees some rumours or whispers of interested parties.
     
  8. ^M^

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  9. tangey

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    Well an offer has been made, but it's far from done and dusted.

    The bidder is the same company that was knocked back by the US from buying Lattice. I've seen reports that they are basically a shell company for the Chinese government. The deal requires MIPS to be purchased by another US company for $65M (img bought it for $100M, another brilliant IMG deal).
    It also has an unusual aspect to it, in that it gives img 60 days to come to a resolution with Apple. Any payment made by Apple, above an undisclosed amount, will be divided 50/50 between the new owners and the old shareholders.

    I guess the thinking is that with canyon ranch having deeper pockets, Apple might see it as a more credible threat to being sued for IP infringement and thus maybe better to buy themselves out of the situation, however Apple don't have a history of backing out of litigation easily, so I'll be surprised if anything comes of that. It would be highly ironic if effectively a Chinese company ended up suing a US company for technology IP infringment, given China's history in these matters.

    Also, now that there is a serious detailed bid, it will surely quickly flush out if anyone else is going to counterbid. With IMG already having a buyer for MIPS, it might make the remaining company more attractive, and less difficult to purchase.
     
    #69 tangey, Sep 23, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2017
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  10. Grall

    Grall Invisible Member
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    Just weird that Apple simply didn't buy Img; they have a pile of money the size of nebraska sitting outside the U.S. which they refuse to bring home for tax reasons, buying Img would have required just a few wheelbarrows' worth of that money, they'd get control of all that IP, and no pesky lawsuits to deal with either - which in the end might just end up cost just as much as Img's asking price at the time! :p

    I'm not getting it. But I guess I must not be enough of a genius CEO to understand these matters... ;)
     
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  11. manux

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    I don't think imgtech would be good buy for apple. Patents yes, some of the engineers yes, rest of it useless and would be expensive to shut it down both money and reputation wise. Even for engineers it's probably better to hire than acquire. Buy the company and you might notice the talent you wanted jumps the ships on first chance and you are left with the resources you didn't want and that make you bloated and inefficient. At least when you hire people want to come work for you.
     
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  12. snc

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    I also can't understand why apple didn't buy it. Imagination has top notch mobile gpu and now apple will not have advantage over android competition.
     
  13. manux

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    Apple already released product with their own gpu that is faster and more energy efficient than previous imgtech solution they used. Probably whatever gets released next year is real far along development... It's not like apple started this thing yesterday.
     
  14. snc

    snc
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    Yep but in 10nm ;)
     
  15. Grall

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    "Expensive" is a relative matter, especially for a company like Apple with cash reserves larger than some first-world nations, and it's not as if their foreign cash reserves is doing them any good just sitting there anyhow. Might as well make that money work for them. Getting bogged down with lawsuits which might go on for years are also horrendously expensive and can put dampener on peoples' willingness to join your company (for example if it looks as if you're a scummy IP thief), and might also put downwards pressure on your stock value, especially if it looks like you're gonna lose.
     
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  16. Entropy

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    Apple would have bought if they needed to. They didn’t.
    This is over.
     
  17. manux

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    Why would apple have any less/more trouble with 7nm than anyone else? Designing SOCs is not a new game to apple.

    One might argue in house design for cpu, gpu, inference accelerator etc. is big advantage to apple as they own their own roadmap to future and are not bogged down by generic designs available to everyone.
     
  18. snc

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    I mean they have custom gpu that perform better than imagination gpu in iphone7 but difference is only 30% faster (as they said during iphone 8 and x presentation) and its on 10nm vs 16nm iphone 7 so what advantage is this? None.
     
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  19. manux

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    It also consumes less power while being faster. The process scaling alone isn't anymore what it used to be and claiming only process makes new apple soc tick is not necessarily true. It looks like new apple soc is competitive if not great.
     
  20. snc

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    "With a more aggressive geometric shrinkage, this process offers 2X logic density than its 16nm predecessor, along with ~15% faster speed and ~35% less power consumption. This process continues leveraging the revolutionary FinFET advantages to help customers achieve best density and power efficiency." http://www.tsmc.com/english/dedicatedFoundry/technology/10nm.htm
     
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