HD 4870 review thread.

Discussion in '3D Hardware, Software & Output Devices' started by mczak, Jun 24, 2008.

  1. swaaye

    swaaye Entirely Suboptimal
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    I really miss NV's CP profiles whenever I use my 3850. I don't understand why they can't adopt that feature. Considering years have gone by here (most of a decade, actually), I kinda doubt they ever will.

    IMO CCC is seriously lacking compared to NV CP because of this. But hey, I can tell that lots of folks couldn't care less.
     
  2. OpenGL guy

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    Which tests are you looking at? R600 and RV670 look identical to me: http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/radeon-hd3870-hd3850_15.html#sect1

    Edit: Never mind. You meant Dynamic Branching, I was thinking Depth Buffer. Acronym confusion! :)
     
  3. ShaidarHaran

    ShaidarHaran hardware monkey
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    I've admitted this is an excellent feature and would very much like to see it implemented in the CCC (and yesterday). I just disagree with your remark that the lack of this feature is enough to warrant the purchase of an "inferior" card (I only mean this in the strictest sense - HD 48xx is faster than G92, particularly at enthusiast quality settings).

    For the record, I'm an 8800 GT owner, and I really do like the options NV's CP gives me, and wish that the CCC were as flexible.
     
  4. apoppin

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    Hi Desert SoCal
    Curious. What will a 1GB vRAM version bring? it is still only 256bit and 512mb DDR5 seems plenty and is balanced. For other GPUs, have we seen any significant performance increases going from 512MB > 1 GB? i guess perhaps at 25x16 but not so much below that, where i will be.

    i couldn't wait. My 4870 is still scheduled to arrive tomorrow; $309 seemed cheap compared to GT260; Nevermind 280 - i can get 2 x 4870 for that price. imo the Nvidia CP is an improvement over CCC, but imo CCC has also improved over the last few months. i have both 2900xt crossfire and g80 8800GTX.

    if you play classic games and bargain bin like i do, you might appreciate that AMD continues to increase performance for them and does not drop support when they get older.
     
    #144 apoppin, Jun 27, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 27, 2008
  5. Pete

    Pete Moderate Nuisance
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    Interesting, even if I'm out of my depth. Forgive my ignorance, but do all the fillrate tests ("B3D's" [Marco Dolenc's?], RightMark's, and I assume various 3DMarks) test fillrate in the same way? Are they wrong to do so, to not account for this limitation that may not reveal all the hardware, or is it correct to expose strict bilinear limitations and expect the full hardware set to be teased out with other tests (say, with AF)? Did Morgoth (and Tridam, etc.) get a simplified explanation from their sources at AMD?

    Is the data path b/w texture and shader units still the limiting factor? Looking at HW.fr's #s, where G80 and GT200 hit their theoretical limits but G92 falls short, it looks like they're limited by bandwidth to RAM rather than an internal path.

    (I'm embarrassed to admit that I'm not even sure that it's one bilinear interpolation per texture filter unit, or if the issue your discussing is the same criticism of 3DMark that was discussed here a while back, so if I'm not making any sense at all, just point me to the Beginner's forum and scowl.)
     
  6. Silent_Buddha

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    Honestly, I have an Nvidia card in my workstation and I've never used the custom profiles. Granted I don't fire up a game on that nearly as much as my regular destop computer but it happens from time to time when we do some LAN gaming at my place.

    I suppose it'd be nice, but I honestly would probably never use it. I find as time goes on I have less and less desire to screw around with custom settings to get something to work. If something doesn't work at the 3D settings I have set, I just don't play it unless it's something I feel I absolutely have to play. Then again I can't think of the last game I felt I absolutely had to play. :p

    As a former enthusiast who feels he's drifting more and more into the casual gamer side of things. I'd MUCH rather see more effort devoted to getting multi-GPU to the point where you don't need profiles and where AFR isn't the rendering method of choice.

    As far as I'm concerned, if it requires a profile I don't want to use it. SLI or Crossfire...

    Regards,
    SB
     
  7. shiznit

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    It is balanced, but I like custom texture packs. With Stalker 2 and Fallout 3 coming, I want to be ready :grin:.
     
  8. Dave Baumann

    Dave Baumann Gamerscore Wh...
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    A lot of work went into the modelling of the texture caching system before it was implemented. The efficiencies gained in full tiling of the memory is helpful as well.
     
  9. shiznit

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    is that why the 4800 smokes the GTX 280 in Oblivion w/Qarl's texture pack?
     
  10. apoppin

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    Hi Desert SoCal
    so we really don't know?
    - if it already smokes the 280GTX in Oblivion with the Qarl texture pack, will an additional 512MB vRAM make that much difference - especially if i OC it further?

    i just wanted a GPU on launch .. my first ever!; and the sucker is cheap enough, $309! For now, i am at 16x10/16x12 with a likely upgrade only to 19x12 - not 25x16.
    - also, i simply don't want to wait and i am [now] ultimately looking forward to an X3 solution, after i upgrade my LCD/MB/CPU.

    i might get stuck with it; oh well, it is here in a few hours
    :shock:

    i am also curious to see if it will work with my 2900xt in my MB's 2nd PCIe 4x slot =P
     
    #150 apoppin, Jun 27, 2008
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  11. Sunday

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    please link!
     
  12. Dio

    Dio
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    Good thing he wasn't talking about SC...
     
  13. hoom

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    Weird, Anandtech has a big bitch about how the tent filter AA modes blur the textures, fails to notice that at least the edge detect examples had clearly sharper textures than the NV MSAA equivalent & then goes and tests most of the games with only 4*AA, no AF at all :roll: WTF! :?:
     
  14. apoppin

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    Hi Desert SoCal
    look at who i quoted; the previous post :razz:

    shiznit, mentioned it and i was questioning him on it:


    seriously not so weird when you consider they wanted me to do an IQ article for their site!! :shock:
    - i would say, at the very least, IQ is their weakness; they don't like to do the comparisons.
     
    #154 apoppin, Jun 27, 2008
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  15. ShaidarHaran

    ShaidarHaran hardware monkey
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    :smile:

    music to my ears <3 that's my exact gaming workload ATM, so I'd be happy to get a nice perf. boost over my 88GT as highest in-game settings w/4x MSAA (forced via CP), 16x AF, and HDR cause min. FPS to drop to the point where slight stutteriong can occur for brief moments during the most graphically-intense scenes. It's extremely rare though, maybe 5 seconds out of half an hour of gameplay, so I imagine a 48xx would allow me to add even more image quality (probably via more AA samples) while possibly eliminating the aforementioned FPS drop.
     
    #155 ShaidarHaran, Jun 27, 2008
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  16. apoppin

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    Hi Desert SoCal
    i still don't have any link, however, my 4870 is here today [if UPS will leave it without me being home] and i still have GTX 8800 [and HD2900xt crossfire] to compare with; i have to look for Qarls pack as i uninstalled Oblivion awhile ago; it ran OK on my GTX, as i remember at 16x10 - but i will have comparisons this weekend hopefully to report to you.

    You mention Micro stutter. Do you have 8800GT SLi?

    EDIT: i do not have the latest texture pack 3
    1.68 GB will take me more than a weekend to D/L over 56K dialup :cry:
     
    #156 apoppin, Jun 27, 2008
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  17. ShaidarHaran

    ShaidarHaran hardware monkey
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    I find it excruciatingly difficult to read Anandtech video reviews as of late. Anand isn't as technically-adept as many of his counterparts at other review sites (and it shows) and Derek Wilson is more of an Nvidiot than I remember. They seem to be doing little more than parroting review guides.

    Some of the things they said in their HD48xx review can't be construed as anything other than horribly-biased opinion. All their little "knocks" against ATi were either a misunderstanding, or not a strong enough negative to be worth commenting upon, especially given the price to performance ratio. Absolute performance means NOTHING if both cards play the game smoothly at the same settings, but one costs half as much as the other.

    It's almost as bad as reading one of Charlie Demerjian's over-the-edge rants. At least I can somewhat tolerate Charlie's bias since he's rooting for the underdog, I mean, I can understand the mentality but who roots for the 800 lb gorilla that is clearly offering inferior value? People with an ulterior motive, that's who.
     
  18. apoppin

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    Hi Desert SoCal
    sadly, i have to agree. They also rush their reviews by being last minute; and that is partly why i am here, not there. B3D has the very best architectural reviews. It appears that AT editors also come into their latest reviews with preconceptions they hold all the way through it.

    i updated my last post; possibly too late. i do not have the latest Qarls texture pack Three which has the SI map. It is a 1.68 GB D/L and it will take me longer than the weekend with 56K dial-up to D/L it. i will do those comparisons between 4870 > GTX8800 and HD2900xt Crossfire - ASAP. I am still also very interested in doing IQ comparisons between r600/g80 and r770.

    i can do texture pack 2, easily enough, 307.79 MB
     
  19. ShaidarHaran

    ShaidarHaran hardware monkey
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    I look forward to seeing your results.

    I said micro-stutter initially in an attempt to convey the point that the stuttering was very brief. I do not have SLI. After posting I realized the potential for confusion so I edited the post and replaced micro-stutter with just plain stutter.

    Doh! Sorry to hear that :( I'm so happy I'm on cable...
     
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