Further Metroid Prime 2 Impressions.

Discussion in 'Console Technology' started by Guden Oden, Dec 2, 2004.

  1. Guden Oden

    Guden Oden Senior Member
    Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2003
    Messages:
    6,201
    Likes Received:
    91
    Very little talk about this game I must say, especially considering how big a title it is for Nintendo. Why is that? We had like, a whole bunch of threads when the first one launched.

    Was it really that revolutionary then, and is it really that old hat now? :twisted: I personally believe the answer is "no" to both, yet surely this title deserves more talk than what we've had so far!

    I'm only as far into the game as to try to recover the boost ball (not very successfully I might add), but from what I've seen so far, graphics is generally a step up. There's a fair bit of TEV effects ("pixel shadery thingies") this time, though curiously the programmers chose to cause surface glimmers to respond to when the player's head turns and not when the player itself moves, which is just completely wrong compared to how things work in real life.

    The most apparent effect is of course the light bubbles in the dark world, which have what looks like a bumpmapped outer surface, and even seems to blur what's inside when looking at distant bubbles. That may be an illusion though, I'm not sure. There's also a bunch of reflective metal-like effects, and reflective cloth (!), and the water actually looks WORSE than it did in the original MP, with no surface interaction anymore.

    Granted, the waves looked pretty pap, but still, they were ACTUAL waves.

    Static level detail generally seem to be about on par of most rooms in the original game, but also a bit less than the most complex rooms (such as that huge temple room with the rotating pipe section in the floor). Perhaps this is so because of the slightly more impressive pyrotechnics, or maybe because the game didn't get rediculously delayed so level designers could sit there and twiddle with every room and add tons of little extras nobody would ever see unless they went over every square centimeter with the visor pressed towards the wall (like I did, haha).

    Enemies are lots more dangerous now, at least the larger ones. There's still plenty of pointless junk enemies, but space pirates can really kick ass now, and the crocodile things are real meanies etc. The Ing are more of an annoyance so far though; they typically take lots of damage to kill, but don't cause that much damage, with the exception of the minibosses. The boost boss nearly made me put a hammer through the top lid of my cube. I've disconnected it now so the game won't aggravate me any further... :p

    Atmosphere-wise this game doesn't reach up to the lofty heights of its forefather. Dunno, but these lightbulb guys just don't hold my interest like the Chozo did in the original MP. Also, the music isn't as suggestive either, the remixes of the original soundscapes and melodies aren't as good, and the new, original stuff also isn't quite as cool either. Maybe it's hard to be original when the first game was so very original in that respect.

    Anyway, I don't know how much I'll be able to play of this game. If the bosses are going to continue being complete bitches, then I won't like it at all. The boost boss didn't want to be in solid form at all after the first few shots I pumped into him. After that he just kept bouncing along like a pinball or floating in his slime form, going up into solid form for just a few seconds at most, it was impossible to get off any shots into him. Grrr...
     
  2. Jov

    Jov
    Regular

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2002
    Messages:
    503
    Likes Received:
    2
    If I get my copy tonight.. we'll do more talking. :lol: But I am hooked on Killzone ATM. enuff said.
     
  3. Ug Lee

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    176
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Australia
    I've been playing it the last couple of days, and I absolutely adore it.
     
  4. Jov

    Jov
    Regular

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2002
    Messages:
    503
    Likes Received:
    2
    Isn't MP2 released today? Or are you referring to KZ?
     
  5. Ooh-videogames

    Regular

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2002
    Messages:
    542
    Likes Received:
    1
    When it goes to that liquid form, you should then go into morphball form and use your morphball bombs. Great game, I'm near the end. The Last suit looks great. Game starts to feel different when get the last suit.
     
  6. SMarth

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    43
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'm a bit dissapointed by the game. I'll reserve my final judgment after it's finished, but for now I'll say it's inferior to the first one.

    True, the graphics are splendid, I often stop in rooms just to admire the ceilings and floors design. But the game is less interesting then the first one. I had hope for larger room and more action (the bosses are though, but most of the time the rest is just too easy) and a better interactive story with more freedom in the ways you can progress in the game. I think it's even more restrictive then the first one on this last point.

    As for the thoughness of the bosses, for now, I say it's about the same as the first one. They seems impossible at first, but then after a few tries, you find how to kill them and it's not that impossible anymore, but it does take a while to kill some of them.

    Currently the worst one took me 5 tries, that's not too bad and I'm not great at beating bosses. The last one I did, the spider one, was very relaxing. I think all bosses should give you some time to safely relax so you can found out how to beat them 8)

    Still, it's a good game but it doesn't surpass the first one.
     
  7. [maven]

    Regular

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2003
    Messages:
    645
    Likes Received:
    16
    Location:
    DE
    I think that's due to the cube not having cube-mapping (what a pun ;)), instead they seem to be some faking via the world-normal vectors. I think it looks fair enough (but as you said not quite right).

    Reflective cloth? You mean anisotropically shaded? I didn't remember any. But they also had fur (on the Luminoth's chest) which looked quite nice.
    I agree that the water is sub-par though. The problem probably is that they either use the TEV units for water-water or for visor-water and they decided to stay consistent.

    I disagree here. I think this game has got the same magic going on. I hate going to the dark world (although it is a bit better now that I've got the Dark Suit), and I feel like I know much more about what's happening around me; I find the background a bit better than the first one.

    From what I've read, he's supposed to be a bit of an exception. I've just gotten the super-missiles and will now go back to upgrade a bit. :D
     
  8. Ug Lee

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    176
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Australia
    Official release date is Friday, but stores broke street date up here on Tuesday. :D
     
  9. pshain_stl

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2003
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    Boost Ball Boss

    From what I found, you had to roll around and bomb the shadow form till it would solidify (basically forcing it out of shadow). After doing that, pop up and shoot. Don't know if that helps, or if you were already past that.

    I was very happy with the game overall. Received a 90% on my first runthrough, about 14 hours.
     
  10. Bohdy

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    731
    Likes Received:
    4
    I'm stuck just past where you posted you were, Guden (playing without hints like hard man can be a drag at times) and I completely agree with your impressions so far.

    The game is technically (not even talking about graphics) a work of brilliance but it doesn't quite seem to have the same magic as the first one. The flow is not as smooth and maybe its because the areas don't have as much variety (hey I know the wood/lava/ice/etc combo is horribly cliche but I have always liked it).

    One thing I can definitely say about it is that the game is incredibly VAST! Maybe it just feels this way but its like one area is larger than the entire first game.

    Also, I had thought that it would be harder based on what people have said, but the boost guardian is the first time that I have seen a game over screen!

    Anyway, there is lot more more to play before I formulate a final opinion. :wink:
     
  11. [maven]

    Regular

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2003
    Messages:
    645
    Likes Received:
    16
    Location:
    DE
    Boost guardian is kicking my ass as well. Got there yesterday evening, died twice, went to bed.
    If you get hit by the ball or slime, it does some serious damage. I don't think I've gotten it below half its health. :(
     
  12. Goldni

    Regular

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    394
    Likes Received:
    1
    Great game. I'm at about 30% through. I've died 3 times total. The graphics are incredible and the attention to detail is second to none. I like the specular lighting on enemies now and those two little mini boss dino things looked great. I think the water looks improved but not as animated as MP1. Also the actual waterfalls look average and the backgrounds (when outside overlooking a ledge) look awful.

    The particle effects and the lighting are really well done. I like rolling around in morphball mode just looking at the glow it emits onto surfaces. There was one save room I'd swear there was bump mapping on the floor. And the metal grates, etc look very good. The music is haunting me. Although I still like MP's music better (although I'm only at 30% with Echoes). The level design is unbelievable btw.


    I'm not saying this game deserved 10's from the reviewers but there were two other hyped games that got 10's from everybody last month that fail to impress me as much as Echoes has. Anyways I hear Echoes is selling well. That's good to hear.
     
  13. Bohdy

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    731
    Likes Received:
    4
    Just by-the-by, I'm disappointed that Retro didn't end up using per-pixel lighting on everything with Echoes as I originally thought that they would from the movies. You can still see the lighting going over the polygons, although its smooth in the elevator sequences.

    And I agree that the "scenic" backgrounds look far too much like a texture mapped on a skybox. Sure that is what they are but it shouldn't look like it! :)

    Halo 2 especially had incredible scenic backgrounds in comparison.
     
  14. Fox5

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2002
    Messages:
    3,674
    Likes Received:
    5
    How do they do the reflections and water in wave race: blue storm?
     
  15. Squeak

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2002
    Messages:
    1,262
    Likes Received:
    32
    Location:
    Denmark
    Sphere maps? Also I think cube mapping is only an improved way of doing sphere maps, so they look more natural (less distortion because of the way the reflection is rendered), in many cases the difference won't even be noticeable.
     
  16. darkblu

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    2,642
    Likes Received:
    22
    depends what you mean by reflections. specular-reflective effects can be done with sheer mapping techniques over vanilla planar texures - that's what 'environmental mapping' meant originally. AAMOF some guys have produced very impressive stuff using those (e.g. melbourne house with their TDLM). but cubemapping is of a magnituded easier to work with, for producing continuous reflections, paticularly over dynamic environments.

    to get back ontopic:

    i'm still making my way through mp1 - i'll be getting mp2 on the very day i see the mp1 finish screen on my tv. unfortunately that ore boss has been very effective in postponing that moment for me :?
     
  17. Fox5

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2002
    Messages:
    3,674
    Likes Received:
    5
    Well, the water in wave race is constantly moving(due to the waves and all) and all the while reflecting all the racers, as well as some objects in the environment.(I don't think it reflects the entire level though)

    [​IMG]

    http://gr.bolt.com/games/gamecube/racing/wave_race_blue_storm5.jpg
     
  18. darkblu

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    2,642
    Likes Received:
    22
    the water may be dynamic, but it does not reflect itself. it's the environment that gets reflected that matters. from those shots i'd assume the 3d objects that have reflections are just mirror-rendered under the plane of the water. the only pixel-reflective effect on those pics may be the specularity of the water ripples, which could have been produced with those same 2d envmapping technique i mentioned.
     
  19. Bohdy

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    731
    Likes Received:
    4
    ARGHHHH :shock: Spider Guardian. :shock:

    Brain... Melting... Down... :x
     
  20. Readykilowatt

    Regular

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2004
    Messages:
    317
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    New York
    I know how you feel. :lol:

    Just be patient. (The Boost Guardian was more difficult to defeat IMO)
     
Loading...

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Beyond3D has been around for over a decade and prides itself on being the best place on the web for in-depth, technically-driven discussion and analysis of 3D graphics hardware. If you love pixels and transistors, you've come to the right place!

    Beyond3D is proudly published by GPU Tools Ltd.
Loading...