CG vs. Real-time cutscenes

[Sonic]

In my monthly thread trying to contribute to the forum I have decided to ponder about CG and real-time cutscenes.

It seems increasingly apparent that CG is still being used for many of today's games. A huge chunk of funding that would be better spent on the game still goes to the artists who create the CG. Now in today's generation we are seeing more and more real-time cutscenes for a majority of a game or even the whole of a game. It's fairly easy to differentiate between the 2 as the quality of CG is still exponential levels beyond what current consoles are capable of. But I'm not concerned with this generation.

In the next generation of consoles it's fairly obvious they will have vast amounts of graphical power to tap into. Will it still be feasible for developers to go ahead and use CG for games or is it time to switch completely to real-time? It's up to the developer of course, but I am asking the opinion of the Beyond 3D community as a whole. It seems that real-time is the way to go and that the money saved on CG could be used for more art in a next-gen game.

Just wondering B3D's community thoughts.

 

[theafu]

Rpg's and blizzard games often remind me why CG still serves a purpose in games. At the same time games that use all cg to drive a story in a game ruin it for me in some respects as I like the game to progress the story more then a non interactive sequence of video.

 

[akira888]

One problem is that the massive costs incurred in order to model/ texture /animate CG are indicative of the future costs of creating all of the in-game art assets, as slowly but surely we are approaching the day where that will be renderable in real-time...

 

[Deepak]

If a game is good, it doesn't matter whether the cutscenes are done in real time or CG...for example MGS1 cutscenes were in real time and drove forward story beautifully....similarly CG cutscenes in Dino Crisis 1/2, RE series never looked out of place becse they were well directed. Well, amount of CG cutscenes will get less and less and will be done entirely in realtime as more processing power becomes available and as the difference in CG and real time becomes blurier, and it certainly looks the case in next gen console.

 

[zurich]

As I mentioned in another thread, games like KOTOR use ingame art assets in pre-rendered/offline sequences, which works well. I doubt this is true for the massive space battles, but it certainly is for the Ebon Hawk takeoff/landing scenes. This is good for cost and time efficiency.

Next gen, when texture/model work approaches the CG level, we may see more of this.. ie: take the assets, give it the offline, pre-rendered treatment, and use it for niche cinematics when the engine itself won't cut it.

 

[cthellis42]

I think we're going to see a lot more engine-only scenes in games next generation. The trend has already started now that CG isn't exponentially better than what the engines can handle (Certainly it CAN be, but the absolute top qualities are still expensive, and engines can now handle quite a lot and in the future much, much more), and it seems to make the most sense to construct in-game scenes that don't totally break the flow of the game. "Cut-scenes" at that point may get more detailing, but I don't see them as having to really break from the engine to do so.

I think will be a LONG time before opening CG cutscenes are dropped, though, as they make for some of the best advertisements and demos, and a way to really "wow" people when they just start the game. CG closers will still probably be common, too. Just how far companies want to go with it...? <shrugs> As they start sorting out unit expenses and total dev costs, they'll sort things out as makes the most fiscal sense.

One thing's for sure, though--companies that have the $$$ and WANT to shell out for premiere titles will still strive for the highest quality they can, which means CG cutscenes a-go-go.

 

[V3]

High quality rendered CG in high quality video, is still what I like to see.

I bet, the real-time will be impressive too, but I still want to be suprised by high quality rendered CG.

 

[jvd]

I just want cut scenes gone . I hate a break in the story . They should just add it into the game play .

 

[Phil]

I just want cut scenes gone . I hate a break in the story . They should just add it into the game play .

Final Fantasy didn't have breaks?

 

[rabidrabbit]

I find it hard to imagine how a story line like for example FFX's could be told without any cut-scenes. To advance a story you need some dialogue, and it would be silly if the characters talked all the time wihile you were fighting, while guiding the characters through the worlds, while solving puzzles etc... that would be so annoying
To make the cut-scenes interactive would not make much sense either.
To tell a story, the gameplay has to pause. I see no other alternative, except if you want a constant narrator on the backgroung, or sheets of texsts between levels.

 

[notAFanB]

I just want cut scenes gone . I hate a break in the story . They should just add it into the game play .

Final Fantasy didn't have breaks?

maybe Jvd is advocating avoiding preset (IE film like) cutscenes and rely on realtime plot shifting (a la deus ex and numerouse others).

personnelly there is an immersive factor in cutscenes which aren't several days in length.

 

[V3]

I just want cut scenes gone . I hate a break in the story . They should just add it into the game play .

Break in the interaction you mean ?

Cut scenes tied gameplay events together, I don't see how it can break the story.

Anyway, I want a silence movie type cutscene more, with no text or voice just actions.

 

[jvd]

WHen does a movie just stop. Switch to something else to explain the story. The movie story moves foward with action going. People talk while blowing things up.


I just don't want a stop . I want to instead of a cut scene with the bad guy saying " hahah I'm going to take over the world and you are powerless to stop me" Have something where you are fighting him during game play and he talks to you to advance the story line .


FF it stops . At some points for a half an hour of fmv. If i wanted to sit and watch a movie i'd turn the tv on or buy a dvd for 20 bucks .

I was hoping the gen we were in would get rid of cut scenes . But hopefully the next one will. With the one following it to perfect it .

 

[megadrive0088]

If PS3-GCN2-XBOX2 can do in realtime what was CGI on PSX, then i wouldnt mind getting rid of CGI rendered cutscenes. If games can look as good as FF8 CGI, then I'd be willing to give up even better looking CGI, to keep the consistancy up. I really dislike going from realtime story telling, to CGI scenes. it breaks the consistancy.


If PS3 can do Tekken 4 CGI and FFX CGI in realtime cinema, and perhaps even gameplay scenes (maybe not in gp til 3rd/4th gen software)
then there is little point in wasting resources on CGI cutscenes. better to put it into making your games look and play as good as they can, and be fun.

 

[jvd]

If PS3-GCN2-XBOX2 can do in realtime what was CGI on PSX, then i wouldnt mind getting rid of CGI rendered cutscenes. If games can look as good as FF8 CGI, then I'd be willing to give up even better looking CGI, to keep the consistancy up. I really dislike going from realtime story telling, to CGI scenes. it breaks the consistancy.


If PS3 can do Tekken 4 CGI and FFX CGI in realtime cinema, and perhaps even gameplay scenes (maybe not in gp til 3rd/4th gen software)
then there is little point in wasting resources on CGI cutscenes. better to put it into making your games look and play as good as they can, and be fun.

See i don't care about graphics. I care about game play . In game cut scenes using fmv has just been a way to advertise better graphics than what they are delivering . I wish they never had fmv in games to begin with .

 

[Tagrineth]

N64 games tended to have a lot of realtime cutscenes instead of prerendered... mostly because N64's mpeg support is horrible and there isn't enough space for a lot of it but still...

Has anyone played Hybrid Heaven for N64? That game had one amazing fully-realtime intro... not amazing graphically, but very well scripted.

 

[V3]

See i don't care about graphics. I care about game play . In game cut scenes using fmv has just been a way to advertise better graphics than what they are delivering . I wish they never had fmv in games to begin with .

Nah, I like FMV as long as they're not conversation, but action base, if they're conversation, it will bore me.

 

[cthellis42]

Odd as it sounds, not all games are or SHOULD be focused on gameplay only. Modern gaming is able to encorporate so many different things, and we should be ENCORAGING them to continue to cover all levels. Final Fantasy and Xenosaga and the like are cinematics first and foremost (though their gameplay is just fine, and plenty of it for those looking for it. Challenging...? Not particularly, but that's not always why people play games either.) and as such graphics and sound will always be on a high end, and prominantly featured.

I think FFX handled pretty well, in fact, as there was lots of smooth transitions and more use of engine-only scenes, and some places you could see them trying to mix more dialogue with action with othe breaks to try to not make EVERY cut take forever with no change. (Not that I mind it, personally, but it you could see were toying with different approaches.)

Especially in the "RPG" genre, we see a LOT of different styles, and all have their pros and cons. No approach is something I want to see abandoned, shifting all of "X-type" of games in my preferred direction. If I don't like a way something is done I won't play it--simple as that. But I want the industry to be moving in ALL directions, as that keeps it the freshest, and gives us much more chance of interesting experiements and them finding angles that hadn't been tested before that we can discover and enjoy. ^_^

If I'm watching a movie, I'm not always wanting to watch a comedy. Or a three hour drama. Or a big project or some popular license. Or an action/effects extravaganza. Or an introspective art film. EVERY form of media has a whole host of flavors--gaming especially, as not only can we get VERY close to what other forms of entertainment provide (and in some ways able to go much futher past them), but they provide a level of interaction of any concentration as well.

Games are entertainment, along with so many other things. Just what entertains an individual and why is entirely up to them. But there are FAR too many of us out there with our own tastes to limit anything.

 

[notAFanB]

If PS3-GCN2-XBOX2 can do in realtime what was CGI on PSX, then i wouldnt mind getting rid of CGI rendered cutscenes. If games can look as good as FF8 CGI, then I'd be willing to give up even better looking CGI, to keep the consistancy up. I really dislike going from realtime story telling, to CGI scenes. it breaks the consistancy.


If PS3 can do Tekken 4 CGI and FFX CGI in realtime cinema, and perhaps even gameplay scenes (maybe not in gp til 3rd/4th gen software)
then there is little point in wasting resources on CGI cutscenes. better to put it into making your games look and play as good as they can, and be fun.

See i don't care about graphics. I care about game play . In game cut scenes using fmv has just been a way to advertise better graphics than what they are delivering . I wish they never had fmv in games to begin with .

what about Zelda:OOT short brief cutscenes which force a sense of wonder as you played.

 

[Paul]

FMV has become less-common this gen, such a trend will become even more obvious next gen, when in-game visuals match that of CG.(Atleast FFX quality CG)