ATI GPU image quality just looks better! But why?

Discussion in '3D Hardware, Software & Output Devices' started by gongo, Apr 5, 2009.

  1. Silent_Buddha

    Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Messages:
    16,051
    Likes Received:
    5,002
    Which is interesting since when compared side by side here (4890 vs 1800 HQ) they look pretty much exactly the same in all games I've tried so far.

    Regards,
    SB
     
  2. Novum

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2006
    Messages:
    335
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Germany
    A.I. enabled or disabled? The differences are small, especially with enabled A.I. But disabled A.I. quality is certainly better than on RV790.
     
  3. gongo

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Messages:
    582
    Likes Received:
    12
    I am now thinking of buying an O/C GTX 260/216, from what i already know, this card runs cooler and quieter while having a slight performance edge over HD 4870 1G in many games! Reading that NV GTX cards also have better filtering is an added bonus!

    Then i stop to think, how much of it is a hassle removing ATI Catalyst without facing conflicts? Has anyone with a GTX 260 tried using VGA out to their monitor and noticing poorer VGA image such as faint double image on text?
     
  4. Davros

    Legend

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2004
    Messages:
    14,849
    Likes Received:
    2,268
    I have a question about colour temperature, apparently im supposed to use 6500k, but 9300k looks better to me allways has, if 6500k is right and 9300k is wrong why is it there ?
     
  5. Kaotik

    Kaotik Drunk Member
    Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2003
    Messages:
    8,166
    Likes Received:
    1,836
    Location:
    Finland
    6500k is daylight's color temperature according to wikipedia at least
     
  6. Davros

    Legend

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2004
    Messages:
    14,849
    Likes Received:
    2,268
    So whats 9300k
     
  7. Neb

    Neb Iron "BEAST" Man
    Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2007
    Messages:
    8,391
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    NGC2264
    90's first color monitors.
     
  8. neliz

    neliz GIGABYTE Man
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2005
    Messages:
    4,904
    Likes Received:
    23
    Location:
    In the know
    where do you get that a gtx260/216 is faster than a 48701G?

    on the other hand, just run the normal uninstaller and you're good to go, if you already find that an obstacle, I wonder how you manage to replace the card yourself.
     
  9. Blazkowicz

    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2004
    Messages:
    5,607
    Likes Received:
    256
    I currently run a 7600GT, before that a 6800GT which was practically the same regarding performance and features.

    I don't know about the RV770 but hell, the gf6/7's output is noisy. In most modern games (the likes of far cry, left4dead etc.) it's not a huge problem thanks to big texture res but in the classics.. ugh!

    you make me doubt you've ever seen it!

    Old-style counterstrike is my favorite benchmark on filtering (and a game where I value IQ much). With big plain areas and low res textures, bad filtering (or the default bilinear) looks like garbage on it, good filtering looks good.

    16x HQ sucks! there's much aliasing to be seen. You can use 16xS AA on that game, at the cost of blurring fonts, it's much less noisy but still not perfect (and I can get some drops to 50 fps :razz: )
    Angle dependance is entirely non important by the way (game mostly consisting of vertical and horizontal walls)

    before that I had a ti4200 (great texture filtering ever but only 2x AA, 4x is useless on geforce 3/4/FX), before that a voodoo5 : crappy bilinear and (ultra) negative LOD bias resulting in ├╝ber great quality because of RGSS.
    1024x768 w/ 4x AA looked unreal on it but only ran at 40fps. It made me longing for a voodoo5 6000.
     
    #89 Blazkowicz, Apr 20, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 20, 2009
  10. Novum

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2006
    Messages:
    335
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Germany
  11. neliz

    neliz GIGABYTE Man
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2005
    Messages:
    4,904
    Likes Received:
    23
    Location:
    In the know
    I've stared hours at those images and besides other effects affecting the image in the a.i. on (smoke?) it still does better than than the correct "a.i. off" image.

    Quality on Gf7 was a drag, try it with battlefield 2, having things like the rolling desert, that was horrendous.
    Also, a quality comparison on the last remnant's desert scene should be interesting, there's a LOT of filtering going on there (UE3.)
     
  12. Novum

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2006
    Messages:
    335
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Germany
    These are animated GIFs. If you don't see a motion then your browser is not displaying it right.

    No A.I. is NOT better. It's undersampling and therefore you see a "sharper" image.
     
  13. Neb

    Neb Iron "BEAST" Man
    Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2007
    Messages:
    8,391
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    NGC2264
    It looks better though... mostly. So less work but better IQ. Fair deal IMO.
     
  14. Thowllly

    Regular

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2002
    Messages:
    551
    Likes Received:
    4
    Location:
    Norway
    IMO both are bad, but the AI on shot is far worse, I can't really see how adding more shimmering improves IQ. I would be grateful if some1 could tell me how to turn off the undersampling on my 4850 completely.
     
  15. gongo

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Messages:
    582
    Likes Received:
    12
    I am sure it does especially with the higher overclock headroom. Anyway i will wait some more since AMD DX11 gpus are coming out in 3 months time. Either the DX10.1 gpus will slash their prices or i could get the newer midrange DX11 parts that should run cooler and perform similar to the HD4870/GTX260 with DX11 futureproofing.

    All in all, just in time for SC3 and DA.
     
  16. no-X

    Veteran

    Joined:
    May 28, 2005
    Messages:
    2,297
    Likes Received:
    247
    Is it 8bit (256-colors) GIF?
     
  17. neliz

    neliz GIGABYTE Man
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2005
    Messages:
    4,904
    Likes Received:
    23
    Location:
    In the know
    yes...
     
  18. Novum

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2006
    Messages:
    335
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Germany
    You can't.
     
  19. ChrisRay

    ChrisRay <span style="color: rgb(124, 197, 0)">R.I.P. 1983-
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2002
    Messages:
    2,234
    Likes Received:
    26
    You can manipulate global negative LoD for Nvidia's filtering within its drivers. Which lets you achieve a sharper image. If you go too far though even the best trilinear/AF filtering isn't enough to stop shimmering and clear mip map line undersampling. None of this will work if you "Clamp" the LoD in the control panel though as the LoD will not go past 0 negatively but can and still will go positive if asked too. So thats a setting that must be payed attention too when you compare filtering. Some apps use a -LoD as part of their coding.

    The Geforce 6/7 use more aggressive trilinear and texture stage filtering opts ((Not including the angle dependency)) than a Geforce 8 and above do. On geforce 8 and above both the texture stage opts are extremely subtle ((when on 7/6 series you would see pure bilinear filtering)). While on the geforce 8 and above the texture stage opts use the more basic Quasi trilinear/bilinear filtering. Since the G80 + hardware has so much extra texture power compared to the Geforce 6/7. The performance opts dont gain them much and they are alot less aggressive than the Geforce 6/7.
     
  20. Novum

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2006
    Messages:
    335
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Germany
    It's not just because GeForce 8 and later have much more texturing power, it's also their pipeline structure with TMUs working independent of the ALUs which helps hiding TMU latency behind computations (ATI also does this since R300). GeForce 6/7 had to stall their ALUs if they were filtering for longer than a clock.
     
Loading...

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Beyond3D has been around for over a decade and prides itself on being the best place on the web for in-depth, technically-driven discussion and analysis of 3D graphics hardware. If you love pixels and transistors, you've come to the right place!

    Beyond3D is proudly published by GPU Tools Ltd.
Loading...