A silly question

[blakjedi]

A silly question about FPS'

Why don't FPS' give the option to be a third person shooter also? Driving games do this and some other games also. I can drive in first person but FPS make me sick. I would play them all if they included a third person view. Thus i played Gears and only dabbled in Halo

Is there any technical reason why this cant be done on the fly?

 

[Dave Baumann]

I think its a bit more common the other way around (i.e. there are some titles that are 'natrually' 3rd person, but they do have a first person option; iirc GRAW allows this).

 

[blakjedi]

I think its a bit more common the other way around (i.e. there are some titles that are 'natrually' 3rd person, but they do have a first person option; iirc GRAW allows this).

Very true which I dont mind at all. First person is usually situational... a rifle shot or looking around a location...etc..

Unfortunately traditional FPS give no such option so others can enjoy the story, the world or the game. in my mind i cant see why technically this is a choice that could not be offered in every FPS?

 

[zed]

the reason is in first person its a lot easier to do things, judge distance, position etc.
aiming the gun is prolly the biggest thing.
stand up + stick your arm out, now look along your arm aim at a point on the wall with your finger tip, easy.
now get your mate whos standing a couple of meters in front of you to do it, he'll be pointing at something else than u think s/he is.
there are a few methods to come to terms with this problem, but the end result is still inferior to a 1st person view
(the only method that works fine is firing from 1st person but viewing from 3rd person, which looks stupid, ie bullets/rockets etc come from the camera not from your players weapon)

 

[MJP]

I'm no developer, but I would think that the viewpoint changes a few significant things about the design of a game.

From a gameplay perspective, aiming is easier from a first-person view while in third-person its easier to view your surroundings. Those are two things that could easily affect the delicate balance of tense situations. You could also argue that a first-person viewpoint changes the level of immersion felt when playing a game.

 

[blakjedi]

the reason is in first person its a lot easier to do things, judge distance, position etc.
aiming the gun is prolly the biggest thing.
stand up + stick your arm out, now look along your arm aim at a point on the wall with your finger tip, easy.
now get your mate whos standing a couple of meters in front of you to do it, he'll be pointing at something else than u think s/he is.
there are a few methods to come to terms with this problem, but the end result is still inferior to a 1st person view
(the only method that works fine is firing from 1st person but viewing from 3rd person, which looks stupid, ie bullets/rockets etc come from the camera not from your players weapon)

Based on distance and speed I would say that driving a car would have the same and maybe more issues... and there are games where accuracy of fire is no issue... that are third person shooters... I don't find those mechanisims inferior at all. In fact, in most FPS' i think that the perspectives are visually incorrect. The environment appears almost fisheye and spins TOO smoothly... Third person tends to represent and NOT warp the environment like most first person shooters.

so there!

 

[infinity4]

Why don't FPS' give the option to be a third person shooter also? Driving games do this and some other games also. I can drive in first person but FPS make me sick. I would play them all if they included a third person view. Thus i played Gears and only dabbled in Halo

Is there any technical reason why this cant be done on the fly?

it isn't technical reason, the reason why fps is only fps is because its fps. R6:V has third person patch (on X360 at least), so i think you can play it as Gears of Vegas

 

[Skrying]

Based on distance and speed I would say that driving a car would have the same and maybe more issues... and there are games where accuracy of fire is no issue... that are third person shooters... I don't find those mechanisims inferior at all. In fact, in most FPS' i think that the perspectives are visually incorrect. The environment appears almost fisheye and spins TOO smoothly... Third person tends to represent and NOT warp the environment like most first person shooters.

so there!

I've never noticed this, there are cases where you brain will play tricks on you. The view just doesn't go with your mind so well I guess and causes your problems, etc. Personally I dislike third person views in shooting games. For one the aiming is usually a be dumbed down (not always mind you), two controlling the camera is a pain that I don't want to mess with, and three seeing my character takes me right out of the game personally if its suppose to be a realistic depiction.

Also I imagine being first or third person might effect somewhat in ways you optimize a level. In a third person people are more likely to be able to exploit camera angles and see voids or such that they're not. Also gameplay balance I imagine would be drastically changed. Also working out creating a good camera would add to development time/cost.

 

[dobwal]

I think all FPSes and 3P shooters should be hybrids of each other with the ability to switch between the two views on command. Shooting is best accomplished in first person view. But first person view is very limiting in comparsion to third person view in a number of other things.

Hand to hand combat is relatively useless in first person view. Take a game like oblivion where you can sword fight in both views. The fighting mechanism is limited by the first person view with straight forward hacking and slashing with no twisting or turning. Imagine doing a back flip in the middle of a fight in first person view. Its easier in 3rd person to create dramatic flare when it comes to hand to hand combat mechanics.

Platform jumping is also something that is very laborious in comparsion when done in 3rd person.

A hybrid FPS/3rd person view would provide the best of both worlds.

 

[Sonic]

This is a good question. I'm in agreement with others that for shooting and aiming, provided there is no auto aim function, that the first person view would be better.

I've tried playing World of Warcraft in first person view and it was absolutely horrid. Some games just lend better to a specific perspective than others. Close combat like WoW will definitely play better in my book from a third person view because I can see my character's movements fully and well, it's really just pressing buttons and waiting for the cooldowns and what not.

In a racing game I switch up every now and then. When playing any of the PGR games it has to be in third person because it just feels right. In Daytona or Sega Rally I end up using first person view for some reason..or more like the in dash view. Really weird.

I'd say the faster the character or object moves the better it would be for a 3rd person perspective simply because one would be better able to judge due to movements and what not. I'm thinking of Sonic here, and also racing games.

 

[zed]

trust me, aiming in 3d is a lot harder (you cant compare driving with FPS's)
heres a link to my game from a couple of years ago
http://www.zedzeek.com/vids/testE.avi
now its 3rd person viewpoint
i wrestled with the aiming issue for ages ( i can list the different methods i've used if u wish )
in this video the computer does a quasi autoaim + tracking (ie dumbed down gameplay)

btw i believe gears of war uses a first person viewpoint for aiming + shooting

 

[Color me Dan]

I know in Hitman 1 and 2 (haven't played the others) you could shift between first and third, i just remember it feeling very slapped on and icky. I thought Thief 3 did a good job blending, i was constantly shifting in and out between views. Those are the games i come to think of anyway. A good third person game you should try is Mafia, awesome game. It has one of the greatest mob stories in a game ever, rivaling movies. Not like the piss poor Godfather game.... Well, i recommend it anyways.

A little OT but, anyone here played Trespasser from 1998? FPS adventure game sort of thing set on the Lost World island after the movie. Minnie Driver did the voice for the main character and also Sir. Richard Attenburough. The interface was a health meter on your breast in the form of a tatoo and the main character saying how manny bullets there was in each gun. The best thing about that game, and paradoxically, one of its biggest drawbacks was how you interacted with the world. You had an arm you controled the joints in with your mouse. holding a keycard or something and you could twist and turn it in your hand. I love that game... truly love it. Sorry for ranting, just came to me, i had to tell someone