Some more shots on Silent Hill 3 (from a post in GameFAQs)

[marconelly!]

Sound was a strong point of SH2 and SH3 is a nice improvement. It's a pity the game has no support for DPL2.

Did you tried enabling DPL on your receiver? The game is supposed to have some kind of surround audio. SH2 on PS2 had simulated surround through stereo speakers, and at moments it sounded pretty cool. Sadly, they resorted to plain stereo in Xbox version instead of using 5.1.

I have to play SH2 again (it's been a year and time is running fast) but SH3 has nice self shadowing.

In SH2 it was limited only to some static objects, and in some cut scenes it was applied to movable objects. SH3 most certainly has it in the abundance. The scene where heather wakes up in the restaurant is just gorgeous because of coloured lighting and shadowing.

I played around for a few minutes with Noise effect Off and Display Mode sharp and it makes the games visual flaws stand out very clearly.

Obviously, enabling 'sharp' image option, actually disables image filter. That is supposed to bring up pixel aliasing, so in that regard it basically creates flaws and it's not making them stand out. Some people really prefer it that way (I actually do for some games, but I think SH3 looks much better on 'soft') Most Xbox and GC games basically have that 'soft' look enabled by default, from what I've seen.

 

[London Geezer]

the most interesting thing is that, as far as i'm aware, the games with the sharp-soft option supported in at least one of the versions (jap-us-eu) progressive scan. Tekken4 was one and it supported pro-scan in each version. Guilty Gear X2 had pro-scan in the US version but not in the EU version.... most importantly both games run flawlessly wiht the Blaze VGA Adaptor, whihc means that i'll probably be playing SH3 in hi-resolution on my LCD TV YAY!!!

 

[mr]

Did you tried enabling DPL on your receiver? The game is supposed to have some kind of surround audio.

I have to try that.

Obviously, enabling 'sharp' image option, actually disables image filter. That is supposed to bring up pixel aliasing, so in that regard it basically creates flaws and it's not making them stand out.

That's an interesting way to look at it. Don't get me wrong but as far as I understand the functionality of flicker filters they are optional and 'default' rendering without them results in aliasing. This sounds to me like you are saying if I turn off AA on my Radeon I would create aliasing, but the aliasing was there in the first place and AA was invented to eliminate it.
If I'm wrong feel free to correct me.

 

[overclocked]

How the f##k can they do her so real, i would say that it look´s much better then ´Nvidias Dawn demo.

 

[marconelly!]

sounds to me like you are saying if I turn off AA on my Radeon I would create aliasing, but the aliasing was there in the first place and AA was invented to eliminate it.

You know, that actually makes a lot of sense. I was kinda thinking in another direction: Considering that 90% games, especially on Xbox and GC have that filtering enabled, I kinda consider it standard look for interlaced TVs. Without that filtering, interlaced nature of TV scan is going to bring out pixel aliasing no matter what you do in the graphics resolution of 640x. Anyways, I guess it's a good thing they included the option. as I know there are people who don't prefer the softer, filtered look.

 

[Fafalada]

That's an interesting way to look at it. Don't get me wrong but as far as I understand the functionality of flicker filters they are optional and 'default' rendering without them results in aliasing. This sounds to me like you are saying if I turn off AA on my Radeon I would create aliasing, but the aliasing was there in the first place and AA was invented to eliminate it.

The analogy is there... but the major difference is that FF is intended to alleviate defficiencies of analog TV displays - not graphics itself.
Speaking of which - even running with something like 4xAA, CG image will still exhibit a fair amount of interlace flicker on TV if you don't flicker filter it as well.

 

[zurich]

That's an interesting way to look at it. Don't get me wrong but as far as I understand the functionality of flicker filters they are optional and 'default' rendering without them results in aliasing. This sounds to me like you are saying if I turn off AA on my Radeon I would create aliasing, but the aliasing was there in the first place and AA was invented to eliminate it.

The analogy is there... but the major difference is that FF is intended to alleviate defficiencies of analog TV displays - not graphics itself.
Speaking of which - even running with something like 4xAA, CG image will still exhibit a fair amount of interlace flicker on TV if you don't flicker filter it as well.

What happens to the flickerfilter when you run pro-scan then?

 

[Fafalada]

It gets disabled Not much use to blur the screen in PScan.

 

[mr]

The analogy is there... but the major difference is that FF is intended to alleviate defficiencies of analog TV displays - not graphics itself.
Speaking of which - even running with something like 4xAA, CG image will still exhibit a fair amount of interlace flicker on TV if you don't flicker filter it as well.

Yeah, I know. I didn't want to equate them. Maybe I should have worded my analogy clearer, but anyway thanks for the clarification.

Anyways, I guess it's a good thing they included the option. as I know there are people who don't prefer the softer, filtered look.

Options are always good. With numerous friends having a PS2 (everybody with a different TV set), I prefer the sharp output on smaller TV's or when people use the (crappy) composite connector that ships with the console.

This brings me to another point:
With the plethora of available connection/TV combinations, which one is used to calibrate the output of a game/console (AFAIK most games have no sharp/soft options)?

 

[Fafalada]

With the plethora of available connection/TV combinations, which one is used to calibrate the output of a game/console (AFAIK most games have no sharp/soft options)?

Afaik there isn't a set standard everyone follows - so it rather depends on developer.
We're using a variety of different TVs, as well as connections to test our stuff, with the baseline for current version recommended by the publisher.
That said, the game still looks by far the best on a Wega with S-Video, but yeah there's quite a difference how much impact filtering options make on different TVs. Some of the lowend ones with composite cables tend to add a ton of their own blur, sometimes even glow and ghost effects shock: - but the worst are usually the color tuning differencies - which can also vary a lot from one TV to another (even from same maker).

In the end there's only so much you can do on those lower end TVs though - but it's generally considered they are more common then other models so you'd at least try to make sure the colors aren't all out of whack (it's quite disturbing when some distinctly different shades on one look like the same color on another TV... )

 

[mr]

In the end there's only so much you can do on those lower end TVs though - but it's generally considered they are more common then other models so you'd at least try to make sure the colors aren't all out of whack (it's quite disturbing when some distinctly different shades on one look like the same color on another TV... )

This sounds quite frustrating. I guess a lot of time is spent by artists on tweaking subtle color variations in textures and shaders which are simply not visible on an average TV with the shipping cable (most people are not even aware of better cables). ICO, which is IMO a beautiful game with very refined artwork, looks like a white, washed-out mess on my friends TV with his 'prefered' display settings.

I'm aware there's a testscreen in some games to calibrate your TV, but this could be greatly improved IMO to get people to care about these things.
Like a little interactive portion of the game with proper instructions from the games main character to calibrate your TV and audio equipment. Or a little game like Pong, which is only playable with correct display settings (consists of very subtle shades).
I'm sure some people could come up with some fun games based on color/gamma trickery.

I would also like to mention that IMO differing TV's and connections play a big role in peoples different perceptions of 'good graphics' (besides taste of course), which in return can cause quite a fuss on forum's like these.

 

[Legion]

she looks like she is a crack addict.

her face screams sleep deprevation.

 

[marconelly!]

she looks like she is a crack addict.

her face screams sleep deprevation.

Considering it's a Silent Hill game, I wouldn't be at all surprised if she's she's on drugs or has some deep psychological problems.

 

[London Geezer]

she looks like she is a crack addict.

her face screams sleep deprevation.

Considering it's a Silent Hill game, I wouldn't be at all surprised if she's she's on drugs or has some deep psychological problems.

yeah she probably killed someone or she was abused as a child and now she doesnt remember... i'm making this up guys don't call me spoiler or anything... if the real story happens to be like that then it's not my fault... it's SH predictability
i'm so buying this game the day it comes out... which, by the way, is WAY BEFORE ALL OF U GUYS IN THE US OR JAPAN

 

[maskrider]

i'm so buying this game the day it comes out... which, by the way, is WAY BEFORE ALL OF U GUYS IN THE US OR JAPAN

I will probably receive it just 3 to 4 days after the launch date. My PAL PS2 and me are eagerly waiting for its arrival.

 

[marconelly!]

which, by the way, is WAY BEFORE ALL OF U GUYS IN THE US OR JAPAN

Yeah! But we got the D3MO before you did! How about that?!

 

[Tahir2]

You get almost everything before us so please allow us to gloat on this one.. thanks

 

[marconelly!]

Europe gets a lot more Konami love. You always get better versions of their every game. That's more than worth the wait, IMO.

 

[wazoo]

Europe gets a lot more Konami love. You always get better versions of their every game. That's more than worth the wait, IMO.

Sh3 is the first Konami game with a 60Hz option in PAL format. I do not consider 25fps PAL SH2 to be a godsend.

 

[London Geezer]

well to me the screenshots scream *the getaway* and *JAK2* from a mile away. not as in *mock ups with 64x AA* but as in *it will work in pro-scan with the Blaze VGA adapter*...
come on guys.... still hoping here...