crappy 3dmark score on NV31/34?

I wouldn't put much stock in the inquirer.. you should get an idea of the quality of their journalism by the quality of their writing.

just wait and see.
 
elchuppa said:
I wouldn't put much stock in the inquirer.. you should get an idea of the quality of their journalism by the quality of their writing.

just wait and see.

So you're saying that the real scores are likely to be even lower? ;)
 
the really low NV34 score seems to indicate that it's not running at least one of the game tests. I'm guessing the missing test is most likely Mother Nature. Could the NV34 be lacking PS 2.0, therefore DX9, support?
 
I think someone said that it is missing vertex shader units, so this would have to be done by the CPU
 
Well I think it's pretty well assumed NV34 doesn't do vertex shaders in hardware. Just for kicks, does anyone have 3DMark03 scores for a 9500 NP with software vertex shading forced? That might at least give us an overall ballpark where actual NV34 figures would play.

Then of course we adjust for 275/275 -> 250/200 (the latter being the reported clocking for the "Chaintech FX40" product). Plus the possibility that NV34 is missing more functionality (compared to NV30) than just vertex shaders (of course 9500 NP is missing HierZ too, isn't it?). Plus perhaps a fudge factor for unspecified inefficiencies of the NV3x architecture vs. R300 (to the degree an NV30 @ 275/275 would score worse on 3DMark03 than 9500 Pro, which isn't a sure thing but is probably likely). And, finally, for beta drivers.

Bottom line: I wouldn't dismiss these scores out of hand. When the Inquirer gets something right, it's often stuff like this (i.e. where there is little room for misinterpretation on the part of the reporter). It's likely that, by this point, many people at Nvidia's board-level partners and at PC OEMs already have access to this information, and the Inq certainly has sources among that group of people.
 
I don't get the problems that so many people have with TheInquirer. They are not a news site nor a hardware review site, they are a rumor site. So what they post is of course rumors, and rumors are by definition unconfirmed and a lot of times false. As they also just publish second or third hand rumors they can also have wrong information that anyone with some knowledge in the topic would dismiss at first sight (like the things Fuad uses to say), because they are just posting rumors, not 'researching' information, nor they have that knowledge.

May be TheInquirer has or is stating that they are 'journalist' or something like that, and may be that is the reason so many people seems to dismiss them. But I think it is pretty clear what they really are and I don't think they are that bad with that. They even are funny (with their errors too), so who cares. None should expect 'news' in TheInquirer.
 
RoOoBo-

The only problem I have with The Inquirer is that it's so tempting to think how much more useful they would be if their staff had a clue and could actually make some sense out of the often-accurate tips and leaks sent their way.
 
Dave H said:
RoOoBo-

The only problem I have with The Inquirer is that it's so tempting to think how much more useful they would be if their staff had a clue and could actually make some sense out of the often-accurate tips and leaks sent their way.

But then they wouldn't have enough articles to bring in the ad money. Hey, at least they're better than the U.S. tabloids and their "Horse born with human head". That still cracks me up, although it scares me that some people might actually believe it. :oops:
 
I get 872 3DMarks with an "old" GF3 Ti 200 clocked at 230/460 with forced CPU Vertex Shaders on a XP2400+.

I don't trust the NV marketing nomenclature (GF4MX -> GF4Ti), but there chip codenames have thus far left no doubt about the respective chip generation (GF4MX -> NV17), so if NV 34 turns out to be DX8 I would be surprised (and disappointed :? ).
 
mr said:
I get 872 3DMarks with an "old" GF3 Ti 200 clocked at 230/460 with forced CPU Vertex Shaders on a XP2400+.

I don't trust the NV marketing nomenclature (GF4MX -> GF4Ti), but there chip codenames have thus far left no doubt about the respective chip generation (GF4MX -> NV17), so if NV 34 turns out to be DX8 I would be surprised (and disappointed :? ).

Umm, something I just thought: NV34 = 2*NV17. I hope it doesn't mean there is an 'astrologic' relation between NV17 and NV34 :).
 
Perhaps the NV31 doesn't support PS 1.4, even though it should if it is fully DX9 compliant?

This would certainly make a difference in the scores.
 
I can't beleive this needs to be said again... you CAN'T be fully DX9 compliant without supporting Pixel Shader 1.4. PS2.0 implies PS1.4 can be used. If the cards don't support PS1.4 and then logically not supporting PS2.0 either, then yes, that might be why that aren't scoring very good.

That said, I would think the best comparision for the NV34 would be the R9000.
 
First of all, I can't believe we are discussing 3DMark03 scores, given that they are so inherently, well, EVIL. :D

Colourless said:
That said, I would think the best comparision for the NV34 would be the R9000.

Agreed. (Edit: based on expected selling prices: $100 and less I believe?)

Looks like NV34 will go more or less directly against the RV280 / Radeon 9200. (Which is apparently the 9000 with AGP 8x).

That NV34 score does seem VERY low if it's actually completing all game tests. The NV31 score seems reasonable, though not particularly impressive. It's right about the 9500 non-pro scores, which, according to rumored specs, isn't surprsing.

Though of course, the NV31 will really be competing with the 9600/9600 Pro.

In any case, with the "new DX9" cards appearing in the coming month or so, it should be a pretty good "test" to see how 3DMark03 scores them. (Do they more or less fall in line with where we would expect them to?)
 
Colourless said:
I can't beleive this needs to be said again... you CAN'T be fully DX9 compliant without supporting Pixel Shader 1.4. PS2.0 implies PS1.4 can be used. If the cards don't support PS1.4 and then logically not supporting PS2.0 either, then yes, that might be why that aren't scoring very good.

But....

It's possible that NV31 might support PS 2.0 instruction set, but doesn't support 32 bit floats (only 16). In which case, based on what's been discussed on DX9 specs, that would qualify it as a part that's not DX9 compliant, but would be able to run PS 1.4.

In any case, PS1.4 is not required to run ANY of the tests. Game test 2 and 3 will run fine with PS 1.1.
 
Colourless said:
That said, I would think the best comparision for the NV34 would be the R9000.
Wouldn't that be a bit late for a Radeon 9000 (pro) competitor? Though it would probably fit with the rumoured 45 million transistors of that chip (the RV250 is said to have 36, but at least the NV34 would likely have better/faster AF/AA). But really, I can't see much of "CineFX" in such a chip (whatever this actually is).
OTOH, even ATI will bring out a "new" chip of that class (RV-280) so sounds possible. I'd even expect the NV34 to be slightly faster in that case, except in things like 3dmark03 which use PS 1.4...


mczak
 
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