So the GDC PS3 dev kits have GF7900's, but will have a GF7600 in the final PS3???

[!eVo!-X Ant UK]

So couldn't it be that Cell handles the Audio but then sends it to RSX so that it can output it through HDMI?

Could be, in fact id say thats the way it works IMO. It would a be watse if RSX did the audio.

 

[j^aws]

Could be, in fact id say thats the way it works IMO. It would a be watse if RSX did the audio.

IIRC, every object can have it's own sound channel (from the E3 presentation)... all these channels could be handled by SPUs, then sent to RSX where a hardware mixer/ special FX unit could process them before chucking out an 8 channel output via HDMI...

 

[!eVo!-X Ant UK]

IIRC, every object can have it's own sound channel (from the E3 presentation)... all these channels could be handled by SPUs, then sent to RSX where a hardware mixer/ special FX unit could process them before chucking out an 8 channel output via HDMI...

Again, WHY???? thats just such a watse for RSX.

 

[j^aws]

Again, WHY???? thats just such a watse for RSX.

If the costs are negligible in transistors, it's no big deal when it frees SPUs...

 

[!eVo!-X Ant UK]

If the costs are negligible in transistors, it's no big deal when it frees SPUs...

You do have a point, but i should think that 5.1 would take up less than a quater of an SPE's performance. After all PS2's EE can manage DTS 4.1 while running a game as demanding as GTA. So i should imagine it wont cost much in terms of SPE performance for the whole 5.1 or ( i hope's ) 6.1

 

[j^aws]

You do have a point, but i should think that 5.1 would take up less than a quater of an SPE's performance. After all PS2's EE can manage DTS 4.1 while running a game as demanding as GTA. So i should imagine it wont cost much in terms of SPE performance for the whole 5.1 or ( i hope's ) 6.1

The performance cruncher I was referring to would be mixing 1000s of channels with environmental audio/special effects etc... See the E3 leaves demo...

 

[SugarCoat]

why you said the flops number is half of geforce 7800 ?

on geforce 7800, the pixel shader flops per cycle number(FP32) is :

24*2FMADD=24*2*8flop=384flops/cycle.

the RSX pixel shader flops number per cycle is same to the geforce 7800, and if you considering the RSX has higher clock compare with the geforce 7800 256MB (430mz for pixel shader on gf7800 256mb), the RSX the pixel shading power has 27.9% advantage.

Small note; stock 7800GTXs pixel clock is actually 470MHz for all 3D apps. You forgot to add in the dynamic clocking of 40MHz.

Maybe, just maybe it has a 7900 because RSX has those 7900 improvments that nvidia did to the shader pipe line.???


Just a thought

G71 had its pipeline reduced as a perk of the process, there werent any real advancments on an architectural level.

 

[!eVo!-X Ant UK]

.G71 had its pipeline reduced as a perk of the process, there werent any real advancments on an architectural level.

And that gave a performance boost

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Again, WHY???? thats just such a watse for RSX.

Not if it includes efficient dedicated audio hardware. We dont know to what degree RSX is involved with audio, only that it probably is.

 

[Shinjisan]

Not sure why this is done, but going by these charts, the flop performance of the RSX is at 384 FLOPS per clock.

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/game/docs/20060329/3dps309.jpg

RSX does 368 FLOPS/clock, or half the numbers of GF7800GTX.

The question I have is, why are PS3 dev kits running on a GF7900? By all accounts the RSX is ready, why arent they used in the current dev kits? COuld this perhaps have something to do with the fact that the dev kits didn't have HDMI output?

1)Current dev kits have an underclocked RSX,not a GF7900,who told you that bs?
2)In that slide only pixel shaders are considered,the total flops/cylcle is the same of G70.

Anyway developers should receive the new kit with final Cell and full speed RSX during the next days according to what Kutaragi said during the Japanese conference.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

According to the slides, final Cell and RSX are out there. The final kits improve over the current kits with final BRD drives and controllers.

 

[Shinjisan]

According to the slides, final Cell and RSX are out there. The final kits improve over the current kits with final BRD drives and controllers.

Yes they said end of March,early April for final Cell and RSX.

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/av/docs/20060315/sce1_12.jpg

 

[_phil_]

1)Current dev kits have an underclocked RSX,not a GF7900,

This is the sole truth we need to CLOSE that stoopid thread.can't we just do that ?

 

[!eVo!-X Ant UK]

Not if it includes efficient dedicated audio hardware. We dont know to what degree RSX is involved with audio, only that it probably is.

I honestly dont beleive thst Sony and Nvidia would waste trannys on giving RSX audio support when Cell could do it.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Yes they said end of March,early April for final Cell and RSX.

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/av/docs/20060315/sce1_12.jpg

Is there any confirmation that final Cell and RSX weren't available in December, and the April kits are just adding prototype controller and BRD?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I honestly dont beleive thst Sony and Nvidia would waste trannys on giving RSX audio support when Cell could do it.

Whether you believe it or not, the DevStation talk was about audio on the RSX. Some transistors are in use somewhere, unless the audio functions being talked about were all being done with pixel shaders (??)

 

[!eVo!-X Ant UK]

Whether you believe it or not, the DevStation talk was about audio on the RSX. Some transistors are in use somewhere, unless the audio functions being talked about were all being done with pixel shaders (??)

Please no i hope not, what a waste if it is. But they could of add'd hardware support in RSX but i dout it BUT Id happily be corrected

 

[Shinjisan]

Is there any confirmation that final Cell and RSX weren't available in December, and the April kits are just adding prototype controller and BRD?

Of course you won't find any official confirmation on this but it's pretty well known that in December developers got a kit with the 3.2GHZ Cell and GF7800GTX (430MHZ) on the PCI Express bus,RSX and FlexIO arrived for the first time in the January kits but it was clocked at around the same frequency of the 7800GTX.
That's the same reference kit used at GDC.
Now developers are getting the new devkit with the final CPU and full speed RSX,which as far as graphics are concerned can be considered final hardware,so that developers have a month to tweak their playable demos on that hardware for E3 (not that it's a difficult task,it's just the same thing,simply faster).

 

[rounin]

I don't usually get dragging into these silly arguments, and I mostly don't like commenting on devkits and stuff anyway because, you know, NDAs and stuff... however the stupidity here is making my head hurt and I'm sure Sony have already mentioned most of this stuff somewhere.

Here goes:

All the "rack-mount" sized devkits have RSX chips in them, and all of these devkits have audio.

There, I've said it. (if no-one hears from me again, can someone pop over and try to find where Sony hid the body?)

Just because someone chose to use a different cable to hook up the TV does not imply some massive conspiracy is going on.

It seems that some of the older kits were used for some GDC demonstrations - perhaps the authors simply didn't have time to update them for the new hardware, or possibly for the audio they didn't have an HDMI setup to use and had to use the old PC sound-card solution with discrete analog outputs... I don't know why Sony set things up like that, but there are many valid reasons they might have chosen those configurations which don't involve the current hardware being in any way imaginary.

Either way, this whole argument seems to be based on equating two sets of marketing presentations, for two different pieces of hardware, containing contrived performance numbers for each without a precise breakdown of how they were worked out... if there is a discrepency, I don't think you have to look too far to see where it may have come from.

I take it the rack mount kits are out then...

 

[j^aws]

...There, I've said it. (if no-one hears from me again, can someone pop over and try to find where Sony hid the body?)...

Don't worry, I'll slow the Ninjas down with a conveniently placed banana skin. But before they getcha... please could you confirm the number of VS units in RSX? I'll make sure you get a noteworthy headstone... Ta!