PS3 xdr chip

F

fxtech

Newcomer
mmm 512mbit on next five month 12.8 Gbytes/sec x chip

educated guess 512mbit chip X 4 at 55gbyte sec then?



GIANT Korean conglomerate Samsung said it has started churning out 256 megabit XDR memory at its fabs.
Rambus designed XDR memory, and it will be used in conjunction with the Cell microprocessor in the Playstation III.

And elsewhere. Because Samsung said that it will also have applications for digital TVs, and for servers and workstations too.

The firm said that it will intro a 512Mbit XDR device within the next five months that will shuttle data at a staggeringly fast 12.8 gigabytes per second.
 
what would be the chance sony will put 8 of those chips inside the next box? 256mb seems a bit low
 
there were rumblings awhile ago that PS3 would end up with 128 MB of XDR with ~51 GB/sec bandwidth due to using 4x 256 megabit chips instead of 4x 512 megabit chips.

*128 MB would completely and totally suck

*256 MB would be just disappointing

*512 MB would be okay or decent (16x PS2's main memory) and thus on par with PS1 to PS2 main memory increase of 16x (2 MB to 32 MB)

*1 GB would be nice, above par.


I suppose developers could live with 512 MB.

Sony will, probably, at first try to pull a 128 MB or 256 MB memory skimping, as with PS1 originally having 1 MB main memory and PSP originally having 8 MB main memory. before PS1 came out Sony doubled its main memory from 1 MB to 2 MB probably in early to mid 1994. and quadrupled PSP's main memory from 8 MB to 32 MB, some 10 years later.

If developers bitch at Sony's initial PS3 memory configuration of 128-256 MB, hopefully Sony will then double or even quadruple it as with PS1 and PSP.
 
FWIW, though some of the members at this forum suggest that the deal with nVIDIA was finalized in Dec 2004, this 512Mbit -> 256Mbit change in the memory configuration that occured early 2004 or late 2003 suggests otherwise, if the nVIDIA GPU has its own external VRAM directly attached in addition to the eDRAM framebuffer.
 
This is big news in my opinion. XDR has a tough fight ahead, but having Samsung backing the standard is going to help. Support from Samsung has been talked about for quite some time, and now they're actually fabbing XDR in quantity is very positive.

Samsung and Sony seem to have had a good relationship lately. Samsung has some of the best (if not the best) fabs in the world for manufacturing DRAM, so they would make a good partner for the PS3.

Anyway I hope 512 Megabytes of RAM is standard on the next gen consoles. More than half a gig would be nice, but is probably a bit unrealistic to expect that for a $300 console.
 
Brimstone said:
This is big news in my opinion. XDR has a tough fight ahead, but having Samsung backing the standard is going to help. Support from Samsung has been talked about for quite some time, and now they're actually fabbing XDR in quantity is very positive.

Samsung and Sony seem to have had a good relationship lately. Samsung has some of the best (if not the best) fabs in the world for manufacturing DRAM, so they would make a good partner for the PS3.

Anyway I hope 512 Megabytes of RAM is standard on the next gen consoles. More than half a gig would be nice, but is probably a bit unrealistic to expect that for a $300 console.
Click to expand...

I believe Samsung has been manufacturing Sony's plasma or LCD TVs lately, or if not manufacturing, they are definately in a partnership outside the memory/processors business.
 
Megadrive1988 said:
If developers bitch at Sony's initial PS3 memory configuration of 128-256 MB, hopefully Sony will then double or even quadruple it as with PS1 and PSP.
Click to expand...
Actually, I think it's all up to MS to set the bar for the next gen, if they go with 256MB of main RAM (GDDR3?), then 256MB of XDR will be more than likely for the PS3, since it will be the minimum required for the Xenon ports.
 
Vysez said:
Megadrive1988 said:
If developers bitch at Sony's initial PS3 memory configuration of 128-256 MB, hopefully Sony will then double or even quadruple it as with PS1 and PSP.
Click to expand...
Actually, I think it's all up to MS to set the bar for the next gen, if they go with 256MB of main RAM (GDDR3?), then 256MB of XDR will be more than likely for the PS3, since it will be the minimum required for the Xenon ports.
Click to expand...

Interesting point. If the Xenon is going with GDDR3/GDDR4 I would assume initially it would be less expensive than XDR. If GDDR3/4 will be cheaper quicker MS could use more, knowing that the PS3 will have to use more expensive memory. or MS could cut corners knowing that the expense of XDR could make it hard for Sony to go ahead with 512MB. From the sounds of it XDR sounds like a monster when it comes to speed.

It will be interesting to see what happens. I am rooting for 512MB on all next gen consoles. While it may be expensive initially, but the first year or two are the slowest sales for new consoles. So it may be possible for Sony/MS/Nin to bite the bullet early knowing memory prices will drop significantly by the time the consoles are really flying off the shelves. And considering MS will be releasing a year early it needs to prepare for the launch of the PS3 in 2006. I honestly believe memory is going to be a big bottleneck next generation. Pushing polys and effects is not enough. You need a lot of memory for details worlds with a lot of variety.
 
Brimstone said:
This is big news in my opinion. XDR has a tough fight ahead, but having Samsung backing the standard is going to help. Support from Samsung has been talked about for quite some time, and now they're actually fabbing XDR in quantity is very positive.

Samsung and Sony seem to have had a good relationship lately. Samsung has some of the best (if not the best) fabs in the world for manufacturing DRAM, so they would make a good partner for the PS3.

Anyway I hope 512 Megabytes of RAM is standard on the next gen consoles. More than half a gig would be nice, but is probably a bit unrealistic to expect that for a $300 console.
Click to expand...
http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=19128
 
Brimstone said:
This is big news in my opinion. XDR has a tough fight ahead, but having Samsung backing the standard is going to help. Support from Samsung has been talked about for quite some time, and now they're actually fabbing XDR in quantity is very positive.

Samsung and Sony seem to have had a good relationship lately. Samsung has some of the best (if not the best) fabs in the world for manufacturing DRAM, so they would make a good partner for the PS3.

Anyway I hope 512 Megabytes of RAM is standard on the next gen consoles. More than half a gig would be nice, but is probably a bit unrealistic to expect that for a $300 console.
Click to expand...

Although RAMBUS seems to have "failed" to become a standard or current supported PC memory since 1999 with the Intel VC820, OR840, I850, I850E and I860 if you look at PS2 with 80 million consoles shipped world wide since March 2000 and each having 32MB of PC800 RDRAM, then RAMBUS really has not had it as tough as some may think.

Now that RAMBUS is offering XDR-DRAM or RAMBUS-sequel and Sony has already commited to having it inside of PS3 any investor really has no worries investing in RAMBUS stock because it is most likely that the 80 million consoles world wide shipped will probably happen much sooner with such a bleeding edge console.

The only problem I have is that Sony better not go cheap and stick at least a minimum of 1024MB of XDR-DRAM in PS3, reguardless of price point because it will sell if the console is still going to have Square-Enix games on it.
 
Acert93 said:
If the Xenon is going with GDDR3/GDDR4 I would assume initially it would be less expensive than XDR. If GDDR3/4 will be cheaper quicker MS could use more, knowing that the PS3 will have to use more expensive memory. or MS could cut corners knowing that the expense of XDR could make it hard for Sony to go ahead with 512MB.
Click to expand...
To project XDR manufacturing costs, at this point in time, depends of a lot of factors actually. Technical and economical factors.
From a technical point of view, IIRC the technology overview, the XDR is not asking for any complex/unusual technology for its production, so I don't forsee problem from this side.

On the economical sides of the things, the fact that Toshiba, Sony and Samsung have all licencied the tech and therefore will be able to produce mass quantities of chips; the recent good relation betwen Sony and Samsung, all that play a favorable role when it comes to the actual production of the XDR chips for Sony.

In other words, I don't expect the XDR chips to be noticeably, if at all, more expansive for Sony than any GDDR3 chips.

Acert93 said:
I am rooting for 512MB on all next gen consoles.
Click to expand...
Welcome to the club! :D
Acert93 said:
I honestly believe memory is going to be a big bottleneck next generation. Pushing polys and effects is not enough.
Click to expand...
Even to store those polygons, memory could be a bottleneck... 512MB, is seriously a must have.

Bill Gates if you read this you know what you have to do now.
And no, I'm not talking about a 512MB Xenon, I'm talking about sending me 1 Billion $, dammit!
If there's no billion... Then... At least think about the 512MB!
 
Vysez said:
On the economical sides of the things, the fact that Toshiba, Sony and Samsung have all licencied the tech and therefore will be able to produce mass quantities of chips; the recent good relation betwen Sony and Samsung, all that play a favorable role when it comes to the actual production of the XDR chips for Sony.

In other words, I don't expect the XDR chips to be noticeably, if at all, more expansive for Sony than any GDDR3 chips.
Click to expand...

Hey Vysez :)

I think that after a year or two after the PS3 launch what you say will hold true. But initially it sounds like they are wanting an arm and a leg for this stuff:

This time, Rambus takes a step at a time to get it right and establish XDR as a possible high-end alternative to DDR-based memory. "We are carefully targeting applications that can use the bandwidth of XDR," said Michael Ching, product marketing manager at Rambus. Pricing of XDR modules has not been announced yet, but industry sources indicate that the additional performance of the technology will command a "visible" premium over current GDDR3 memory - just as RDRAM did over SDRAM.
Click to expand...

From: http://www.tomshardware.com/hardnews/20050125_170734.html

I honestly believe memory is going to be a big bottleneck next generation. Pushing polys and effects is not enough.
Click to expand...
Even to store those polygons, memory could be a bottleneck... 512MB, is seriously a must have.

Bill Gates if you read this you know what you have to do now.
And no, I'm not talking about a 512MB Xenon, I'm talking about sending me 1 Billion $, dammit!
If there's no billion... Then... At least think about the 512MB!
Click to expand...

:LOL: :LOL: :LOL:

If only Bill Gates read the forums!
 
Vysez said:
Bill Gates if you read this you know what you have to do now.
And no, I'm not talking about a 512MB Xenon, I'm talking about sending me 1 Billion $, dammit!
If there's no billion... Then... At least think about the 512MB!
Click to expand...

he already just gave Norway a billion big ones a couple days ago. give the guy a chance to recoup.
 
But if Samsung are manufacturing and selling XDR they will have to pay Rambus a licencse fee, where as selling to Sony, sony already have a deal with Rambus so won't it be cheeper? I have no idea how these things work btw ;P
 
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