DS or PSP
- Thread starter pc999
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Fox5:
It was another of Warp's games, Real Sound, which didn't require any graphics. Enemy Zero used them, yet it too is one of the rare breed of games where sound is actually utilized for play mechanics. Warp's head, Kenji Eno, and friend Tetsuya Mizuguchi really liked exploring audio as an integral part of gameplay.
Ty
No it doesn't, I think you must have mis-understood what I meant when I said that.
If a dev works on a dual screen machine then it becomes neccesary for them to make use of both screens. Of course not all will make good use of them. But having all those devs trying to make dual screen games will see innovative dual screen games made. My point when I said "neccesity is the mother of invention" was to say that it doesn't matter if a single screen handheld can do dual screen games. Because with a single screen handheld there is no neccesity to produce dual screen games. And no DS doesn't literally force devs to do anything useful with dual screens. Just like PSP's powerful graphics capabilities don't literally force devs to make use of them either. But devs will still try there best to make use of PSP's powerful graphics capabilities, becauses its expected. The same is true with dual screens on DS.
Ok, your taking me to literally with the word forced. Of course no dev, other then a Nintendo dev, is truly forced to even use the system. What I mean is developers who produce games for DS will know that they are expected to make good use of the dual screens (by the people who own the system). The majority of developers will be trying to think up the most creative clever ideas for the use of dual screens. So I just meant it in a similar sort of way that developers are 'forced' to try to produce nice full 3D worlds in current gen console games. Because people out there expect it from the games on thier nice powerful console.
No it doesn't, I think you must have mis-understood what I meant when I said that.
If a dev works on a dual screen machine then it becomes neccesary for them to make use of both screens. Of course not all will make good use of them. But having all those devs trying to make dual screen games will see innovative dual screen games made. My point when I said "neccesity is the mother of invention" was to say that it doesn't matter if a single screen handheld can do dual screen games. Because with a single screen handheld there is no neccesity to produce dual screen games. And no DS doesn't literally force devs to do anything useful with dual screens. Just like PSP's powerful graphics capabilities don't literally force devs to make use of them either. But devs will still try there best to make use of PSP's powerful graphics capabilities, becauses its expected. The same is true with dual screens on DS.
Ok, your taking me to literally with the word forced. Of course no dev, other then a Nintendo dev, is truly forced to even use the system. What I mean is developers who produce games for DS will know that they are expected to make good use of the dual screens (by the people who own the system). The majority of developers will be trying to think up the most creative clever ideas for the use of dual screens. So I just meant it in a similar sort of way that developers are 'forced' to try to produce nice full 3D worlds in current gen console games. Because people out there expect it from the games on thier nice powerful console.
Well i finally voted and I went with ds .
For a few reasons .
1 is cost . If it is 150$ then i can buy one for myself and one for my little cousin for the same price as a psp.
2 is durability . My little cousin is 9 and drops his game boy advance all the time and it gets banged up. The psp has no screen protection and doesn't look to be that durable. Esp that pop up stick. That concerns me .
3 is age group. The ds is target at a younger market than the psp. I like to play games with my little cousin that is basicly why i still buy consoles . So for me its better to play with him. I really don't want him playing games like gta 3 and stuff like that .
Perhaps i will buy a second or third gen psp when sony fixes the bugs in the first one .
For a few reasons .
1 is cost . If it is 150$ then i can buy one for myself and one for my little cousin for the same price as a psp.
2 is durability . My little cousin is 9 and drops his game boy advance all the time and it gets banged up. The psp has no screen protection and doesn't look to be that durable. Esp that pop up stick. That concerns me .
3 is age group. The ds is target at a younger market than the psp. I like to play games with my little cousin that is basicly why i still buy consoles . So for me its better to play with him. I really don't want him playing games like gta 3 and stuff like that .
Perhaps i will buy a second or third gen psp when sony fixes the bugs in the first one .
Well i tend to drive every where . So thats a big deal to me. I don't really play games much anymore except on my pc.Teasy said:Oh yeah your a big car gamer aren't you, forgot about that
Personally I want my handheld to be portable in many different situations, not just car travel.
I think there's a laughable difference between the term "graphics whore" and people concerned in the difference between N64 graphics and PS2 graphics. It's two different generations, dammit!
The PS2 may be the least powerful system this gen, but it's not a huge gap, as can be seen when looking at any decent multi-platform game this gen (SC, PoP:SoT, etc etc)
I can tell the difference between any decent PS2 game and any N64 game. This is the difference between the PSP and the DS.
Compare:
to
or
That's not nit-picking, that's shockingly different. That's Half Life/Counterstrike to Far Cry.
The PS2 may be the least powerful system this gen, but it's not a huge gap, as can be seen when looking at any decent multi-platform game this gen (SC, PoP:SoT, etc etc)
I can tell the difference between any decent PS2 game and any N64 game. This is the difference between the PSP and the DS.
Compare:
to
or
That's not nit-picking, that's shockingly different. That's Half Life/Counterstrike to Far Cry.
I just saw a Gamespot stream showing like 10 different games directly from the DS booth and i think it will do great. Interestingly i found MP to be one of the least exciting ones despite the best graphics. SM64x4 is like the N64 one, just with possible co-op it seems. Co-op sounds good 
I thought the game where you had to draw pacman (and that same drawn pacman then began eating ghosts) and direct him via the stylus was kinda neat, as was the one where some baby mario was falling down from the sky and you could draw lines (which were clouds i think) with the stylus to kinda guide him and make him avoid monsters. So far it all seems very basic, but i think it has great potential. The developers just need to make sth. out it and i think they will.
The guy also mentioned that picto chat was quite popular and people were mostly playing hangman and tic tac toe through it. Doesn't get more simple than that, but i can see it will be very popular in school.
The demos were also nice, like the carving demo where you could carve sth. out of a rotating thing (melons, metal, ...) with the stylus and then look at it from all sides.
The sonic demo reminded me of Summer Games on the C64. The faster you moved the stylus across the screen from left to right the faster sonic ran! Kinda stupid :?
I thought the game where you had to draw pacman (and that same drawn pacman then began eating ghosts) and direct him via the stylus was kinda neat, as was the one where some baby mario was falling down from the sky and you could draw lines (which were clouds i think) with the stylus to kinda guide him and make him avoid monsters. So far it all seems very basic, but i think it has great potential. The developers just need to make sth. out it and i think they will.The guy also mentioned that picto chat was quite popular and people were mostly playing hangman and tic tac toe through it. Doesn't get more simple than that, but i can see it will be very popular in school.
The demos were also nice, like the carving demo where you could carve sth. out of a rotating thing (melons, metal, ...) with the stylus and then look at it from all sides.
The sonic demo reminded me of Summer Games on the C64. The faster you moved the stylus across the screen from left to right the faster sonic ran! Kinda stupid :?
Well the superior graphics comes at a price (battery life, $, ...), that price will be the thing that might make or break the PSP. I mean if it were all about the graphics i could make a portable XBOX as well. Just put a XBOX in a bag pack, carry a 15" TFT with you and a small generator to power the whole thing. Voila i have a machine that'll crush the PSP
Anyway i think the DS and the PSP will co-exist, just in a different market.
Anyway i think the DS and the PSP will co-exist, just in a different market.
until 1993 sega dominated in the US, Europe, Australia, and Brazil. pretty much the only large market nintendo had was Japan (where the megadrive was failing badly). in 1994-1995 the snes started cleaning house, sales of the genesis/megadrive dropped off harshly and the snes sold like hotcakes. sega's marketshare dropped from about 65% in 1993 to about 35% in 1994. those are huge numbers, and it was all durring the last few years of the 16bit generation.
as for DS vs PSP...
i'm totaly excited about the potential of PSP. not excited about the price or any of the games i saw (although twisted metal got me almost excited), and pretty upset by the design. if that huge screen is as good as it looks (and it looks very nice), i'm gonna need some protection. it looks pretty, but how pretty will it look once the screen picks up some scuffs.
the DS is disapointing to say the least. i was actualy looking forward to n64 blur-o-vision on a handheld, and it's the one thing that's really missing. everything i've seen so far on it looks to be about saturn or... <gasp> n-gage quality (ok, better than n-gage, but the lack of filtering is really disapointing). i'm pretty excited about warioware, though. the machine seams perfect for somthing that strange. i love the clamshell design, and for some reason it reminds me of my old nintendo game and watch. ahh... cement factory.... anyway, i hope sega signs on to do some saturn->DS ports. and good stuff, too, like panzer dragoon, shining force III, and vf.
c:
Just felt like posting some pics. Is that last one cel shading?
DS isn't some bad, the pictures could almost be mistaken for poor quality badly compressed screenshots of current games....on a small screen they may be almost identicle.
BTW, I think ds is quite a bit better looking than ngage...ngage doesn't have filtering either, but at least ds is higher res and can do a heck of a lot more polygons.(how? ds must have a graphics processor of some sort or dual cpus, no way they're achieveing those graphics on an arm9 alone, which both the tapwave and ngage have) Boy, I guess the ngage is truly dead now, can't compete with nintendo on price or technology now.
Zodiac fares a bit better, but I still don't think it compares. If it weren't for the psp(and the ique partly, and dreams of an mbx or gamecube powered portable....) then we'd probably be praising the ds for its graphics. It's always been possible for handhelds to have better graphics than they've had, but that comes at a cost, and is it really worth it on such a small screen where the differences can't be noticed as well? I know if I had a choice between a console and a handheld, even if all the tech specs are equal, I'd take the console just for the bigger screen.
BTW, the games actually running on psp are noticably below ps2 quality, look at that snake model in the picture above, a "what if mgs2 was running on dreamcast?" scenario? At least the polygon models in the partly 2d mario64x4(and the sidescroller) look about on par with the gamecube models in mario party 4(which has high quality models, and 2d backgrounds), though in a fully 3d game like mario kart it is certainly lacking...I don't see why they didn't use 2d characters in that like in mario kart 64, looks more like a saturn game in that picture. Maybe mario kart is still in the really early stages and was intended for something weaker than the ds we're seeing now...
But I'd say all the ds is really lacking is bilinear filtering, which may not be needed on a 3" screen, but could that be added in somehow before the ds is released?(how hard would it be to create a chip that just filters the graphics the cpu does, or to implement a filtering function onto the cpu?)
There, much better metroid pic now.
And I take that back about the ds having gamecube models, it's harder to tell, but the bowser in the ds picture definetely isn't rounded all around like the other one. But that's nintendo's advantage of having simpler looking characters, people don't notice the graphical differences as much unless they move away from the normal look of the character.(ssbm's blue jeans mario)
Not quite the picture I was looking for, but this shows what some filtering could do for the ds's graphics. I think for a better example, start up halflife in software rendering at low res, then compare that to with 3d acceleration at the same res.
An example of what it would be like if they threw in a 3d chip, start up ut2004, run it in software mode, then run it in direct3d mode.
Lol, I tried to find a picture of the gamecube metroid to compare to the ds metroid, but I'm sorry, even the crappiest picture puts that one to shame. But it's not hard to find one(of mgs2 or twin snakes) to put mgs acid to shame either, just it doesn't look quite as shameful when compared.
Fox5
Here I've uploaded a smaller (to scale) version of that Metroid: Hunter picture you posted on my site:
http://www.powervr.org.uk/nintendods/dsmetroid4.jpg
So you can replace the big one with that small one in your previous post. That one you posted is pretty massive (over 1MB).
Here I've uploaded a smaller (to scale) version of that Metroid: Hunter picture you posted on my site:
http://www.powervr.org.uk/nintendods/dsmetroid4.jpg
So you can replace the big one with that small one in your previous post. That one you posted is pretty massive (over 1MB).
A vote for the DS
5 reasons for the DS:
(1) I love the idea of a screen this is used for maps. They could just rename it the Map Screen. So does everyone I know that plays GBA SP.
Toggling between map view and game view in games like Metroid and CastleVania really takes away from gaming experience. The same goes for RPGs and the stats view screens. I see it as the number one game experience issue with my use of the GBA.
So some devs will come up with creative uses for the 2nd screen. I don't care. Give me a map screen.
(2) Games devs can now add all sorts of dynamic UI to the touch screen so that I can do things like quickly toggle between weapons. Granted I will be using my thumb for this, but it still (A) adds to game enjoyment (no more convoluted menus on subscreens) and (B) provides for more complex gameplay.
(3) I can now play new versions of Metroid, CastleVania and AdvanceWars that have much more powerful AI and look better.
(4) I can play all of my old GBA games.
(5) I can play multiplayer Metroid DS, AdvanceWars DS, etc without fuxing with cables.
These five reasons alone are enough to sell me on the DS.
Also, who wants to take the 300 gamble on PSP? You can so yes now after the euphoria of E3, but that will burn off.
There is not a sizeable market for a 300 portable gaming system. Only 30% of the current portable gamers are between 18 and 34. How many of those have 300 bucks to spend on a portable? How many of those will be getting the DS instead. The numbers just stack up way way way too much against the PSP.
5 reasons for the DS:
(1) I love the idea of a screen this is used for maps. They could just rename it the Map Screen. So does everyone I know that plays GBA SP.
Toggling between map view and game view in games like Metroid and CastleVania really takes away from gaming experience. The same goes for RPGs and the stats view screens. I see it as the number one game experience issue with my use of the GBA.
So some devs will come up with creative uses for the 2nd screen. I don't care. Give me a map screen.
(2) Games devs can now add all sorts of dynamic UI to the touch screen so that I can do things like quickly toggle between weapons. Granted I will be using my thumb for this, but it still (A) adds to game enjoyment (no more convoluted menus on subscreens) and (B) provides for more complex gameplay.
(3) I can now play new versions of Metroid, CastleVania and AdvanceWars that have much more powerful AI and look better.
(4) I can play all of my old GBA games.
(5) I can play multiplayer Metroid DS, AdvanceWars DS, etc without fuxing with cables.
These five reasons alone are enough to sell me on the DS.
Also, who wants to take the 300 gamble on PSP? You can so yes now after the euphoria of E3, but that will burn off.
There is not a sizeable market for a 300 portable gaming system. Only 30% of the current portable gamers are between 18 and 34. How many of those have 300 bucks to spend on a portable? How many of those will be getting the DS instead. The numbers just stack up way way way too much against the PSP.
a couple of things to note...
nintendo has, since the n64, had a very competative price for it's hardware (by this i mean usualy less, or being first to drop the price). yet, both n64 and NGC have been trounced in hardware sales by sony. don't underestimate sony's marketing power. people tend to FIND the money for a sony console, and pick up the nintendo console when they HAVE the money for it.
wich brings me to point 2. i'm pretty confident that this will be a 2 horse race, and i forsee people picking up both systems eventualy, if each hardware actualy gets some exciting software.
also, PSP should have a lower per game price than DS (or gba, from what i've heard). that's an important marketing point and i don't see sony missing the chance to trumpet that when the time comes.
the only question i have about the PSP is, how long until the drive brakes and i have to play the thing upside down?
c:
ps- anyone know if the GBA wireless adapter will be compatable with the built in DS one?
