Starfield [XBSX|S, PC, XGP]

[Deleted member 11852]

I was disappointed by what was shown of Starfield. I like the mechanics of resource gathering and creating your own ships and bases, but the gameplay shown looked utterly generic. That said, a lot of what appeals to me about Bethesda RPGs is is the sense of exploration and discovery and that's a difficult to capture and present - particularly when Elder Scrolls and Fallout have carefully designed and highly curated landscapes, not just endless space.

I'll reserve judgement until I've seen more. For the best part of two decades, Todd Howard and his team have yet to design a game that I didn't like..

 

[mr magoo]

I remember when they showed fallout 3 I laughed hard when they showed new Vegas I said I never touch it becouse it looks horrible. Yet millions of gamers love it. Despite bad visuals horrible performance and notorious crashes those games are great for many reasons. That’s why I will wait and try it for myself. Elden ring don’t have best visuals but crashed competition presentation is not everything. Bethesda games are like drugs ugly but highly addictive

 

[Dictator]

but with more impressive outdoor visuals at the same time. Even seems like Starfield is using some sort of advanced geometry technology(mesh shaders?), cuz it's definitely beyond what we'd typically expect outside something like UE5-based Nanite.

Hmm I really cannot see what you are seeing exactly. It seems like mesh groups on the ground that rather typically load in and pop as the camera gets near. They also are not particularly detailed in texture or sillhouette if you watch the 4K footage

 

[Deleted member 11852]

I remember when they showed fallout 3 I laughed hard when they showed new Vegas I said I never touch it becouse it looks horrible. Yet millions of gamers love it. Despite bad visuals horrible performance and notorious crashes those games are great for many reasons. That’s why I will wait and try it for myself. Elden ring don’t have best visuals but crashed competition presentation is not everything. Bethesda games are like drugs ugly but highly addictive

I don't imagine many people play Bethesda games for the graphics, but what is there is often understated but they really nail the consistent art and atmosphere is really out there. I seemingly never tire of wandering around in Skyrim or Fallout 4 and just having unsolicited fun. The core gameplay loop of gathering things, crafting, selling, advancing, levelling up, progressing the story or side quests, really scratch that itch that most highly polished AAA games do not. Bethesda give you that freedom to screw-up, and to learn from that or become insanely bolder.

Few games do that for me and Bethesda have bottled that formula. The engine can occasionally be janky and the physics bonkers, but none of it interferes with the fun of playing. What's around the corner that you just cleared out?, it should be clear but because things can roam almost anywhere, because there are so many opposing factions that wandering and fight, no two play throughs feel the same.

It's a shame Bethesda didn't have more time to show off Starfield, to do that 30 min in-depth reveal they did for Fallout 4.

 

[Dampf]

Basically another cross gen game masked as next gen.

I do wonder when we will finally get a game that is truly next gen using the modern featureset with Raytracing, Mesh Shading and Sampler Feedback. I'm also wondering if older PC GPUs from the RDNA1, Pascal and GCN generation are holding these games back right now, IMO they should add another branding for the PC "DX12U compatible PCs" and release it only on those.

 

[Malo]

Basically another cross gen game masked as next gen.

It's Bethesda next gen, which means they've finally caught up to last gen.

 

[cheapchips]

It's Bethesda next gen, which means they've finally caught up to last gen.

Joking aside, I always feel it's a little unfair when they're ragged on for visuals. If you compare them to some highly crafted liner environment then they lose out. Against other contemporary open world games and RPGs they fair pretty well.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Joking aside, I always feel it's a little unfair when they're ragged on for visuals. If you compare them to some highly crafted liner environment then they lose out. Against other contemporary open world games and RPGs they fair pretty well.

I feel like I do this type of post every year, but Bethesda prioritise very different technical goals with their engine. There are few - if any - other open world games like Fallout or Elder Scrolls where NPCs can literally go anywhere, and where you can even follow them on their journey and see them get into their own adventures. There is no smoke and mirrors with characters walking around a corner and de-spawning; couriers and guards will wander massive areas or walk from city to city.

Then there is all the environmental detail. Many games have detailed environments and most are a fixed mesh with all of the objects being immutable, whereas in Bethesda games, there are literally millions and millions of individual objects they can be moved anywhere around the world.

I understand if people don't care about those things, but Bethesda clearly do and that must be considered when comparing Elder Scrolls, Fallout and probably Starfield, against other games and engines that aren't doing this. Hello, BioWare!

 

[orangpelupa]

There is no smoke and mirrors with characters walking around a corner and de-spawning;

Its the charm and annoyance. Like when the NPC got attacked by random bugs (literal bugs and software bugs) and basically stuck and yiu wasted time looking for the NPC on its supposed location.

 

[eastmen]

Basically another cross gen game masked as next gen.

I do wonder when we will finally get a game that is truly next gen using the modern featureset with Raytracing, Mesh Shading and Sampler Feedback. I'm also wondering if older PC GPUs from the RDNA1, Pascal and GCN generation are holding these games back right now, IMO they should add another branding for the PC "DX12U compatible PCs" and release it only on those.

It was going to be cross gen until Bethesda was purchased. So xbox one original as a base. So originally it would support PC , Xbox one , Xbox one s , Xbox one x , ps4 , ps4 pro and then xbox series s , xbox series x and ps5. Now its just xbox series s/x and PC. I am hoping that the extra time is to add in support for some new RDNA 2 features and get the game running well on the current gen systems

It's Bethesda next gen, which means they've finally caught up to last gen.

To be fair there are really no other games out there as large or complex as bethesda games. The closest would be CD Project red and look at how messed up cyberpunk was at release.

I was actually pretty surprised at how well this game looks. I thought we'd get a mild improvement over fallout 4 but this looks much better when you watch the 4k video of it.

Joking aside, I always feel it's a little unfair when they're ragged on for visuals. If you compare them to some highly crafted liner environment then they lose out. Against other contemporary open world games and RPGs they fair pretty well.

Yes its like MMOs they are always behind visually but the worlds are gigantic.

The extended show is starting now so hopefully we see some more of all the games. Not sure how long it is

 

[Malo]

To be fair there are really no other games out there as large or complex as bethesda games. The closest would be CD Project red and look at how messed up cyberpunk was at release.

Yeah I'm mostly joking, I've always been a fan of most of their games, they're fairly unique in their scope and capabilities.

I was actually pretty surprised at how well this game looks. I thought we'd get a mild improvement over fallout 4 but this looks much better when you watch the 4k video of it.

Agreed, looking forward to it more now.

 

[snc]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1536369312650653697

It makes sense or they would have to record a lot of audio to make it inclusive

imo doesnt make sense at all, is bethesda still in 1998 ? its breaking imersion, cyberpunk had many faults but at least cdprojekt understand importance of narration

 

[Globalisateur]

Nice looking game. Reminded me of No man's sky.

It was going to be cross gen until Bethesda was purchased. So xbox one original as a base. So originally it would support PC , Xbox one , Xbox one s , Xbox one x , ps4 , ps4 pro and then xbox series s , xbox series x and ps5. Now its just xbox series s/x and PC. I am hoping that the extra time is to add in support for some new RDNA 2 features and get the game running well on the current gen systems

To be fair there are really no other games out there as large or complex as bethesda games. The closest would be CD Project red and look at how messed up cyberpunk was at release.

I was actually pretty surprised at how well this game looks. I thought we'd get a mild improvement over fallout 4 but this looks much better when you watch the 4k video of it.

Yes its like MMOs they are always behind visually but the worlds are gigantic.

The extended show is starting now so hopefully we see some more of all the games. Not sure how long it is

Sure but that was very probably a high end PC that was running at 30fps with drops. Not sure how it's going to look or run on consoles.

 

[cheapchips]

imo doesnt make sense at all, is bethesda still in 1998 ? its breaking imersion, cyberpunk had many faults but at least cdprojekt understand importance of narration

I'm fairly agnostic the immurshions of either approach, but do find there's a bit of friction to voiced player characters. I just had to read the text option. I don't need it read out again!

On the flip side, the way it works in Mass Effect is fun. I still tend to read and skip the voiced reply though.

 

[eastmen]

Nice looking game. Reminded me of No man's sky.

Sure but that was very probably a high end PC that was running at 30fps with drops. Not sure how it's going to look or run on consoles.

Guess we will see more later this year and then know for sure in the spring.

 

[Rangers]

Nice gif that makes the game look cool

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1536787004012343300

I already have a feeling this will hit my I buy it but never play it pile like Cyberpunk and GTA V. But oh wait, it's free on gamepass so that cant happen lol.

 

[Rangers]

Nice looking game. Reminded me of No man's sky.

Sure but that was very probably a high end PC that was running at 30fps with drops. Not sure how it's going to look or run on consoles.

Should be a solid version on Series X anyway. Well I guess this is Bethesda. A 25-30 FPS framerate never bothers me.

So this is S, X+PC only game right? That's what a quick google tells me. That should hopefully help, at that point you just gotta cope with the S and not also the One X and One S laggards too, which should drastically simplify things.

BTW, we all know this game isn't coming out in 2023, right? This is video games.

 

[eastmen]

Should be a solid version on Series X anyway. Well I guess this is Bethesda. A 25-30 FPS framerate never bothers me.

So this is S, X+PC only game right? That's what a quick google tells me. That should hopefully help, at that point you just gotta cope with the S and not also the One X and One S laggards too, which should drastically simplify things.

BTW, we all know this game isn't coming out in 2023, right? This is video games.

I believe its Xbox Series and PC. But that change may have come too late in development to do too much. I think before the purchase it was for last gen also. But who really knows.

 

[eastmen]

Interview with todd howard , someone on reddit was nice enough to transcribe

"Todd general"

Happy that "nothing leaked". Happy with fan reaction to response.

"how much is procedurally generated"

Understand questions will be asked. Will probably do a deep dive later on. Trying to say "yes" as much as possible. Being able to explore places.

A lot of procedural generation, but always been a part of games, landscapes etc. in older games like Skyrim. Not that big of a leap to build 1000 planets as long as the systems are in place.

Over 200,000 lines of dialogue. Lots of handcrafted content still. Wondering around the planet will provide some gameplay and content, a bit like daggerfall. Lots of iceballs, but thats ok, just places to wonder and look at.

"how deep is the space combat"

Started space combat fairly early. Want it to feel unique. Various power systems e.g. FTL game. Other systems like grav drive for jumping. Dogfighting intented to be slower, similar to mechwarrior.

Can dock with other ships, steal them, board them. Smuggling, piracy etc. will be shown later. "A good chunk of gameplay"

"Character creation"

Background is a class system, some diaglogue and class options.

Systems such as leadership, manipulating people etc.

"Does starfield have a "step out" moment"

Yes, game starts pretty much the same for everyone. Various other step out moments such as stepping out of ship, getting into space.

"What can you see and do in new atlantis"

4 Main cities in the game. New atlantis is the biggest they've ever built. Factions there, place to work on your ship.

Constellation are a mix of explorers, league of extradoinary gentleman etc.

"Main Story"

About constellation, still exploring, look for earth artifacts, looking at new mysteries. Main quests is new artifacts they don't know the origin of.

Aim for a similar length in most games, but Starfield ending up longer, maybe 20%. Milage may vary. e.g. 25 hours in another game, might be 30's or early 40's in Starfield.

Think modding will be a dream with extra content in Starfield.

"Did you take a different approach knowing a sequal could be a long time away"

We do what we want to do, and make it the best it can be. Don't do everything.

You CANNOT fly straight down to planet, a particular design decision to make it feel better in each area so they can focus the resources where they think it counts.

Elder Scrolls 6 after Starfield, Fallout 5 after that.

I wouldn't be surprised if Fallout 5 is already in some form of production. I'm guessing Elder Scrolls is sometime in 2024/25 and Fallout would be in 2026/27 in time for the 30th anniversary.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

imo doesnt make sense at all, is bethesda still in 1998 ? its breaking imersion, cyberpunk had many faults but at least cdprojekt understand importance of narration

A voiced protagonist isn't always a good thing. I'd say that in the games I've played maybe 1 in 20 voiced protagonists actually have decent voice acting that I won't immediately skip. Even worse is when the writing for the protagonist's lines is completely at odds with how I'm playing the protagonist.

This is especially true in a game where the player creates a character. In this situation the voices that the developer provides (if there's more than 1!!!) don't match the character that I've created in any way, shape or form. And OMG that is so annoying whenever the protagonist then opens their mouth to say something in game. And since voice talent can be expensive, there's usually only 1 voice provided per sex! So there's absolutely Zero chance that the voice will match the character that I've created.

BTW - this is just offering a different perspective. I completely understand why some people might like voice acting for the protagonist.

I'm fairly agnostic the immurshions of either approach, but do find there's a bit of friction to voiced player characters. I just had to read the text option. I don't need it read out again!

On the flip side, the way it works in Mass Effect is fun. I still tend to read and skip the voiced reply though.

Yup, that's where I'm at as well. Silent protagonist >>>> voiced protagonist.

If the game allows for subtitles and the ability to skip the protagonists voiced lines then it can be tolerable. Even better if I can completely skip the lines written for the protagonist in most games.

In most cases, protagonist narration is just completely immersion breaking, IMO.

Maybe the best of both worlds would be if the developer provided an option to silence the protagonist so the pllayer can choose to have the protagonist never ever say anything in the game. That way people that want it voiced can have it and people that don't want it won't have to be constantly annoyed by it.

Regards,
SB