Inq: Nvidia drops the NV40 and readies the NV45

hiostu

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Don't know if someone posted this in another thread. But it seems nvidia is a bit startled by the R420 and is going to move to the NV45 sooner than expected.

What actually happened is that Nvidia recently learned about R420 marchitecture and this entire 12x1 story and, that they will eventually end up in second place and decided to can NV40 project and to go immediately with NV45.

Source: Theinquirer

edit: it seems this has already been posted in the r420 thread.
 
991060 said:
Isn't NV45 just the PCI-E version NV40?

Yes, but accourding to the inquirer nvidia would be adding more pipelines to the NV45 design. But I don't know if it was already planned that way.
 
This rumour is bullshit from what I've heard (from a source a "little bit" more reliable than the INQ ;) )
 
If the Inq has not a new story about nv4x or r4xx every two days
they are dead.
Apparently that's the only thing that matters to them. Don't worry about the quality of info ;)
 
Well I dunno... there's certainly some good info there. You just need to sift through a lot of bad English and dodgy speculation to get to it.

They're almost spot-on about R420 and IIRC were the first to break the news that R300 had production qualified at 325MHz, for example.
 
i'm sorry I don't know what "spot on" means ? (english as a second or third language)

Are you saying that their hesitations and uturns about the rxxx architecture are what should be taken as a reliable info ?
 
They're saying it has 16 pipelines and will ship with 12 enabled, which is correct.
 
MuFu said:
They're saying it has 16 pipelines and will ship with 12 enabled, which is correct.

I think this came up in the other R420 speculation thread but would you hypothetically be able to enable the 4 possibly disfunctional pipes using a hardware/software/bios mod?
 
MuFu said:
They're saying it has 16 pipelines and will ship with 12 enabled, which is correct.

One would think this would give ATI some decent ability to stockpile "working" 16 pipeline chips for either a refresh part, or just to release a Radeon RE ("Reviewer Edition" ;) ) part to be an "nvidia spolier".

I'd be curious to know if they won't be shipping 16 pipeline versions (at least initially) due to very poor yields with 4 working quads "at speed", or power consumption starts to become a real headache.
 
MuFu said:
They're saying it has 16 pipelines and will ship with 12 enabled, which is correct.

seriously why? If it has 16pipelines why not use it.

me confused
 
dan2097 said:
MuFu said:
They're saying it has 16 pipelines and will ship with 12 enabled, which is correct.

I think this came up in the other R420 speculation thread but would you hypothetically be able to enable the 4 possibly disfunctional pipes using a hardware/software/bios mod?

if there's a 16 pipe part it might work

all existing mods are based on the fact that there's actually 8 pipe versions of the 4 functional pipe you're trying to "unlock"
 
MuFu said:
Well I dunno... there's certainly some good info there. You just need to sift through a lot of bad English and dodgy speculation to get to it.

They're almost spot-on about R420 and IIRC were the first to break the news that R300 had production qualified at 325MHz, for example.


They are more reliable than Mufu (the R420 has eight uber pipelines).
 
Ah, Dr. DeFurious guessed the secret plan! :devilish:

I don't know if it's the bleach fumes from cleaning my kitchen floor or a true vision-o-thangs-to-come, but I picture this new rumor and the 12 of 16 pipes as true and I see the R420 coming out a couple of months before the nV40 minimum and then when the 16x1 nV40 comes out ATi will put out all the stockpiled 16 pipe cards as a special edition/refresh-bump and it'll be a damned close contest 'tween those two. 8)
 
rwolf said:
MuFu said:
Well I dunno... there's certainly some good info there. You just need to sift through a lot of bad English and dodgy speculation to get to it.

They're almost spot-on about R420 and IIRC were the first to break the news that R300 had production qualified at 325MHz, for example.


They are more reliable than Mufu (the R420 has eight uber pipelines).

Yeah, definitely. But they should be, shouldn't they? I'm suprised that the 8 "EXTREME" pipelines misinformation never reached them.

Personally, I think they never intended it to work with 16 pipelines enabled - a 12-pipe architecture with redundant elements to account for the fact that it's a big-ass, mass-produced ASIC. "Design-for-failure", if you like; not exactly a new concept. I posted some speculation in the other thread:

MuFu said:
arrrse said:
If ATI expects a large % of their chips to have 1 quad not working, they can design a 4 quad chip, but expecting to get 3 quads working...

Or they could design a 3-quad chip with a "spare".

Edit - the 4th quad pipe needn't necessarily be totally fub'd. They might run test vectors to identify the "fastest" three and use them. Point is it sounds like a 3 quad architecture with redundancy, not a 4 quad one that still works when "broken".

Well, maybe all the quants work-ups predicted that the vast majority of dice would have 3/4 functional quad pipes. That and/or there would be a favourable statistical significance, given the expected yield, in the clockspeed advantage of a 3/4 design vs. a 4/4 one.

We don't have much of an idea as to how the pipeline breaks down into functional blocks. It could well be that the whole architecture is geared towards processing 3 quads with the exception of a certain block of functionality which is duplicated 16 times - not necessarily an entire stage, just something that represents a relatively large proportion of the die and is likely to suffer from manufacturing defects/clock limitation before everything else. They might be using clock gating to turn off the redundant functionality altogther, saving power. It just seems like a good way to get the most out of the yield of a large, high end ASIC.

It would, however, be awesome if you could enable the 4th quad pipe with a hack. :cool:
 
Personally, I think they never intended it to work with 16 pipelines enabled - a 12-pipe architecture with redundant elements to account for the fact that it's a big-ass, mass-produced ASIC. Design-for-failure, if you like; not exactly a new concept.

It certainly opens the doors to the possibility of a fall refresh part with 16 fully functional pipelines though, doesn't it?

And if ATI didn't think they'd yield enough at 16, what makes nVidia think they can yield a full 16 in production quantities, especially given all of their yield problems over the last year or so, without redundancy? Unless that explains the alleged 210 million logic transistors = redundancy.
 
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