Xbox Series S [XBSS] [Release November 10 2020]

[Deleted member 11852]

well there are different ways to view that. Select can be used to describe most suitable or carefully chosen. Hand picked etc.

Hand picked is chosen. Whether verb or adjective, selection is the consequence of intended choice. Don't make me break out the OED here! I'll do it. I have one right here!

If Microsoft and Sony replace select with "some suitable" the problem goes away.

 

[Lalaland]

I've always read "select" as "limited" in marketing speak, a way of masking a low number by implying that there was some sort of curation happening. I suspect at some point we'll get a global or per title switch to force speed boosts on a system level with a warning same way we did on Pro.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

I've always read "select" as "limited" in marketing speak, a way of masking a low number by implying that there was some sort of curation happening. I suspect at some point we'll get a global or per title switch to force speed boosts on a system level with a warning same way we did on Pro.

Indeed, and curation is the act of of selection. This is selected, this is not. What is lacking in the use of select by both Microsoft and Sony is any indication of the criteria for selection. As BRiT said, part of it is technical so why not use wording that explains it's not an arbitrary choice? Likewise, will all games technically capable of being enhanced run better, or is that an arbitrary choice, perhaps by sales at the time, or prospective revenue for the new enhanced version? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Most gamers will be completely uninformed on this. Managing expectations is important and the wording used will likely lead to disappointment as people who may expect a tittle to be selected, even if technically unsuitable, will harbour that hope.

 

[Jay]

Mainly technical reasons which they did highlight, so they have given you the criteria.
They specifically said why it can't be done on some games.

The only thing that they haven't done is given numbers or a list of titles.
Which for people thirsty for any kind of news is irritating.

Instead we get things like Yakuza and dirt which are both decent marketing gets, but didn't exactly show the best, not what they should be putting in front of people.

Both look like they are just frame doubling current gen not particularly impressive looking ones at that. (not saying bad or even bad looking games)

 

[iroboto]

hmm.. seems as predicted on this forum:

He’s also the first person I’ve spoken to who has both units, so I asked him to compare them, acknowledging that he’s hugely biased about this stuff. “Being honest, the Series S has surprised me in terms of how it performs,” he said, raving about its framerates and loading times. While Spencer didn’t share stats, one helpful reference point is Xbox Series S/X launch game The Falconeer. That game’s indie developer says it will run at 60fps in 1800p (not a typo) resolution on the Series S and at 60fps in 4K on the Series X.

And here’s a surprise: Spencer says some games load faster on his S than his X because they’re loading lower-res graphics.

Full Interview on Kotaku:
https://kotaku.com/xbox-boss-phil-s...init-1845392984/amp?__twitter_impression=true

He acknowledged the additional labor that is being put on developers to design for the S and X specs. “But absolutely, it is work. There’s no doubt about that. The fact that you have two performance specs now, I’m not going to stand here or try to PR somebody and say two different specs is the same as having one spec. It’s not. We’re doing this because we want to expand the market.”

 

[Deleted member 13524]

That game’s indie developer says it will run at 60fps in 1800p (not a typo) resolution on the Series S and at 60fps in 4K on the Series X.

Why wouldn't it? It looks like a cell shaded game with minimal geometry. Reminds me of Zelda Wind Waker.

What this should be is a good showcase for 4K120 on the SeriesX, IMO.

 

[AzBat]

Go read some of the developer stuff in the game thread. There's a lot more to it than you think.

Tommy McClain

 

[goonergaz]

I wonder when we are going to get some decent info on the XSS and how it compares to XSX...I wish I'd pre-ordered the XSX

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Go read some of the developer stuff in the game thread. There's a lot more to it than you think.

Tommy McClain

I did, per your suggestion. There really isn't more than I think...
From the interview you posted:

In The Falconeer I don’t use any textures because it makes the art very clean. There’s no grittiness or artifacts or blood-spatter on the screen. You can see the edges of the geometry and it has a very abstract look. I do it not because it’s simple but because it’s very clean and readable, and you can see how things are hand-crafted.

But that means there’s a lot of sharp lines and gradients, and that means there’s a lot of edges! The reason we try to avoid sharp edges in art design for games is because we used to play at 640p or 320p and hard edges would look jaggy and ugly, but now we’re up to 4K and beyond the edges become beautiful again! Artists and sculptors and painters have known for centuries that edges are beautiful things but as game developers we’ve been hating on them! But now the higher your resolution, the prettier the edges become, and the whole game looks like an illustration.

No textures, low-poly geometry. From the trailers I don't see that many particle effects either, nor shadows being cast. I do see what appears to be volumetric fog and smoke effects. What the devs claim for this game is high resolution + high frame-rate, which is made possible from the fact that there's really nothing much going on.

The game's Steam page is claiming 2GB RAM (system RAM, not VRAM), a dual-core (any i3) and a Radeon HD6770 for minimum requirements.. which is a graphics card based on the >11 year-old Juniper chip.






I don't mean to crap on the game, as it seems really fun to play. It's just that the 1800p60 on the SeriesS in this game doesn't mean much to me. I've seen the PS4 Pro do 1800p60 on games significantly more complex and with much higher IQ, such as The Last of Us Remastered.

 

[Jay]

I wonder when we are going to get some decent info on the XSS and how it compares to XSX...I wish I'd pre-ordered the XSX

The amount of information is something both Sony and MS have been very stingy with.

In respect to XSS the problems that XSX has in terms of impressive looking titles will be just as bad, if not look worse on the XSS in the short term.

OG Xbox and X360 should look decent, unpatched XO not so much.

But i wouldn't consider them being quiet about XSS to be of any concern at all.

Anyway we know little things like load times are either equal or faster on the XSS, just be nice if they got them out for preview now to maintain momentum as lacking games to show it seems.

 

[Johnny Awesome]

The XSS isn't really being promoted right now until after launch. It's the Black Friday console, more than the launch day console that XSX is.

 

[dobwal]

Hand picked is chosen. Whether verb or adjective, selection is the consequence of intended choice. Don't make me break out the OED here! I'll do it. I have one right here!

If Microsoft and Sony replace select with "some suitable" the problem goes away.

But that falls under the Google’s Oxford language definition of select. Basically the first thing returned by a Google search when searching for a definition of a term.

“carefully choose as being the best or most suitable.”

I get what u are saying though the term “select” has a loaded past.

 

[Jay]

Given DMC 5 Special Edition
On PS5 & XSX

• 4K/30fps with Ray Tracing ON
• 1080p/60fps with Ray Tracing ON
• 4K/60fps with Ray Tracing OFF
• Up to 120fps with Ray Tracing OFF

Via WccTech source resetera https://www.resetera.com/threads/dm...-to-last-gen-versions-pc.287831/post-49053994

I reckon
XSS

• 1080p30 RT ON
• 1080p60 RT OFF
• 900p60 RT ON

Or do you think that they forgo 900p60? I personally don't mind it, but it seems to be more of a negative to include the option due to optics for some.
Possible could be 1440p with PS5 settings, if PS5 has different settings even.

 

[Pete]

4TF isn’t hitting 900p60 if it takes 12TF to hit 1080p60, although I’ll grant you that the upper bounds on these undoubtedly dynamic resolutions are also for optics (aka console politics). 1080p60 is super naively half of 4k30, while 900p60 is 3/4 of 1080p30. Nothing wrong with offering the option of ~720p60. It’s the 60 that’s important.

 

[fehu]

Sooooo... we need a not yet released 12TF machine to run a not nextgen game at 1080 with eye candy.
Then what? We wait another generation to hit 4k/60/RT ?
Something is going in the direction of incredibly fast diminishing returns.

 

[BRiT]

Sooooo... we need a not yet released 12TF machine to run a not nextgen game at 1080 with eye candy.
Then what? We wait another generation to hit 4k/60/RT ?
Something is going in the direction of incredibly fast diminishing returns.

No. You need a new game engine.

 

[Jay]

4TF isn’t hitting 900p60 if it takes 12TF to hit 1080p60, although I’ll grant you that the upper bounds on these undoubtedly dynamic resolutions are also for optics (aka console politics). 1080p60 is super naively half of 4k30, while 900p60 is 3/4 of 1080p30. Nothing wrong with offering the option of ~720p60. It’s the 60 that’s important.

It takes approx 10TF to do 1080p60 RT.
Hence why I also mention possibily at PS5 settings (if different).
I think 900p60 RT with possibly couple reduced settings could be nicer than dropping to 720p.

You'd be surprised how many people see sub 1080p, even as an option as really bad.
Personally I don't.

 

[iroboto]

Sooooo... we need a not yet released 12TF machine to run a not nextgen game at 1080 with eye candy.
Then what? We wait another generation to hit 4k/60/RT ?
Something is going in the direction of incredibly fast diminishing returns.

While I do agree the XSS is anemic in the GPU front. We won’t get a better idea of how anemic until developers utilize all the new features on these GPUs which should allow them to save a significant amount of bandwidth and compute per frame.

 

[turkey]

It takes approx 10TF to do 1080p60 RT.
Hence why I also mention possibily at PS5 settings (if different).
I think 900p60 RT with possibly couple reduced settings could be nicer than dropping to 720p.

You'd be surprised how many people see sub 1080p, even as an option as really bad.
Personally I don't.

It won't be a 900p option tho, the menu will say something like 60fps with RT at a lower resolution. Sounds pretty enticing to me

And to be clear on a £250 machine that's amazing

 

[Jay]

It won't be a 900p option tho, the menu will say something like 60fps with RT at a lower resolution. Sounds pretty enticing to me

And to be clear on a £250 machine that's amazing

Just to be clear, I'm all for the options and think they are actually good.
Especially when you take into account the other options.