Digital Foundry Article Technical Discussion [2020]

[Lalaland]

"Good enough for Hollywood releases" is a lower bar than you can possibly imagine given that this is the industry that gave us literal DVD upscales for some early BD releases
I say a pleasing result cannot be achieved by any metric other than personal taste and by that metric subtracting all colour information to revert b&w is just as impressive.
It's like the various awful colour modes tvs offer and their rubbish motion smoothing gubbins, it's gotten so bad with this guff the studios have actually leaned on the HDMI standards group to add in automatic Turn That Shit Off mode
Like if you have a HDR TV right now I can guarentee you have a terrible colour mode for non-HDR sources that alleges it too can "upscale" to HDR and it also looks awful

 

[Jay]

I see Auto-HDR is the trash fire I was expecting, tone-mapping is garbage AI enhanced or no, leave the damn image alone! This is like that relative who insists on using "Vivid" mode on their TV

Could you link to the examples you've seen, or even someone's opionion as I've not seen any.

 

[Lalaland]

it can be disabled for people that don't want it.

My bad it's from this passage in the DF XBSX BC article:

More specifically, it's using Auto HDR - an AI algorithm that maps existing SDR content into HDR space. It works on most non-HDR games and I'm intrigued to see how it plays out on more games. From what I could see, the desired effect was achieved on Grand Theft Auto 4, but there were some odd effects - a character in bright white jacket saw that blown out to ultra-white effect while the white road markings seemed to have a bit of an unnatural glow to them. Microsoft is actually disabling Auto HDR on titles where it feels the effect doesn't quite work, but I'm eager to test this on more content.

They are specifically calling out the algo not knowing what 255/255/255 pixels were light sources or high reflectivity objects versus which are not meant to be

 

[Cyan]

But can it run Crysis?

SCNR...

NR/DK

 

[Jay]

My bad it's from this passage in the DF XBSX BC article:

More specifically, it's using Auto HDR - an AI algorithm that maps existing SDR content into HDR space. It works on most non-HDR games and I'm intrigued to see how it plays out on more games. From what I could see, the desired effect was achieved on Grand Theft Auto 4, but there were some odd effects - a character in bright white jacket saw that blown out to ultra-white effect while the white road markings seemed to have a bit of an unnatural glow to them. Microsoft is actually disabling Auto HDR on titles where it feels the effect doesn't quite work, but I'm eager to test this on more content.

They are specifically calling out the algo not knowing what 255/255/255 pixels were light sources or high reflectivity objects versus which are not meant to be

Thanks only had time to watch the video.
But i do believe they've said it can be disabled. So if you don't like it you can disable it.
Especially when you can't guarantee that a person's tv may display hdr better than sdr.

 

[Lalaland]

Thanks only had time to watch the video.
But i do believe they've said it can be disabled. So if you don't like it you can disable it.
Especially when you can't guarantee that a person's tv may display hdr better than sdr.

It can, it's a global setting it's just bad. I am for the record an IQ fundamentalist I own a colorimeter for calibrating my TV in rec 701 (cheapish model) and will buy one for calibrating HDR when they cost less than a new 80" TV. For me there is accurate and inaccurate, Auto-HDR is inherently inaccurate there is no other way to describe it, it may occasionally alight on an inaccuracy that feels right to any one person in the room but it can never be accurate.

There is no known TV that displays HDR better than SDR if only because we got very good at creating ASICs for SDR for a long time, it's not like the old Composite vs HDMI issue where your older consoles look like garbage on your flat panel because of how they were connected.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

So I assume if he didn't test the VRR functionality then he probably didn't test it on a HDMI 2.1 TV, because VRR should be part of HDMI 2.1.
And if he didn't test the console on a HDMI 2.1 TV then there's no way he'd get over 60Hz at 4K resolution.

Doesn't Eurogamer/DigitalFoundry have a LG C9 or B9 TV in their offices?

 

[Lalaland]

So I assume if he didn't test the VRR functionality then he probably didn't test it on a HDMI 2.1 TV, because VRR should be part of HDMI 2.1.
And if he didn't test the console on a HDMI 2.1 TV then there's no way he'd get over 60Hz at 4K resolution.

Doesn't Eurogamer/DigitalFoundry have a LG C9 or B9 TV in their offices?

Just to be extra pedantic HDMI 2.1 is necessary for VRR but not sufficient
A TV can be HDMI 2.1 and NOT have VRR
VRR is an extension of the HDMI 2.1 standard and not a core feature

If I had to guess their actual display chain is a nightmare of splitters, encoders, capture devices etc all of which will need to support VRR before they can cap VRR

 

[Jay]

So I assume if he didn't test the VRR functionality then he probably didn't test it on a HDMI 2.1 TV, because VRR should be part of HDMI 2.1.
And if he didn't test the console on a HDMI 2.1 TV then there's no way he'd get over 60Hz at 4K resolution.

Doesn't Eurogamer/DigitalFoundry have a LG C9 or B9 TV in their offices?

You don't need hdmi 2. 1 to do 4k60.
Even if it was 2.1 doesn't mean it had VRR.

They don't all have LG oleds.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Just to be extra pedantic HDMI 2.1 is necessary for VRR but not sufficient
A TV can be HDMI 2.1 and NOT have VRR
VRR is an extension of the HDMI 2.1 standard and not a core feature

You don't need hdmi 2. 1 to do 4k60.
Even if it was 2.1 doesn't mean it had VRR.

I know, but I also don't know of any HDMI 2.1 TV that's coming without VRR and if there is, I doubt DigitalFoundry/Eurogamer would buy one of those for testing games.

My only point was they most probably made their SeriesX BC test video on a HDMI 2.0 TV, and that's why neither VRR or 120Hz were tested.

They don't all have LG oleds.

They should. If they lack the funding to do so, I'd suggest a gofundme or something similar for them to make their next-gen console and PC tests.

 

[Jay]

They should. If they lack the funding to do so, I'd suggest a gofundme or something similar for them to make their next-gen console and PC tests.

Well their starting to do sponsered videos which may help.

I'm sure they have relevant set up in the office, but not like everyone can take it home.
Even if have one at home that could be the main TV for household use.
May use a 4k monitor in room where he does work.

In the end, he said there would be follow ups to cover it, and even if he was using relevent display (which he wasn't) doesnt mean wouldn't seperate videos into relevant topic, getting each one out in a reasonable time frame.

I thought I was the most impatient here, but doesn't seem to be the case

 

[milk]

It probably says a lot more about how absolutely shite the current gen CPUs were.

To be fair, there are few excuses for a game at the complexity level of a fighting game to have these performance problems, even on jaguars. It says more about the dev than it does about last gen HW.

 

[PSman1700]

Thankyou DF Indeed the fastest and most advanced GPU line so far 30TF monster, now AMDs turn soon! Great job Alex love your content.

 

[PSman1700]

 

[BRiT]

DF Article @ https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2020-mafia-definitive-edition-tech-review

Mafia: Definitive Edition - impressive tech that sets the stage for next-gen
All consoles tested, plus a look at Hangar 13's cool ray tracing alternative.

With the arrival of Mafia Definitive Edition, the trilogy is finally complete. All three games are brought up-to-date to modern consoles but ironically, it's the first Mafia title that features the most advanced technology of all - including a fascinating software-based alternative to ray traced reflections.

It's a feature that's common to all console versions, where the technological differences are fairly minimal - and almost par for the course. Curiously, both PS4 Pro and Xbox One X operate at a native 1440p resolution, though the Microsoft platform enjoys improved shadow quality, ambient occlusion and a better lock on the target 30 frames per second. It's business as usual on PS4 and Xbox One with a 1080p/900p divide, and all versions use temporal anti-aliasing - which does present some banding issues. As is often the case, there's the sense that the vanilla Xbox One has the most visual compromises: I immediately noticed some issues with dithering on hair and other fine detailing. Traffic draw in the big city is impressively close all round.

In motion, checkerboard artefacts - or something that presents like that at least - are seen on all systems. Thankfully, they are difficult to catch. Beyond that, there's little to separate the systems - all operate with a 30fps cap, and all run with full v-sync, with the exception of the base PS4, which exhibits screen-tear when the game can't sustain its target performance. Expect to see Xbox One X at the top of the pile here, with a very consistent frame-rate with PS4 Pro following up next, though dips to the mid-20s can be observed. Looking to the base machines, the experience is clearly not as stable. Most of the experience unfolds at 30fps but inevitably these are more prone to drops and with noticeable stutter on camera cuts - something that flares up in the very first mission. Both of the vanilla consoles are in the same ballpark in this sense; the drops are just as extreme on both. The exception, of course, is base PS4 has screen tear that doesn't feature on any other platform.

...

 

[AzBat]

John looks at Crash 4 on all platforms...

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1312066264572063745

Crash Bandicoot 4 plays best on PS4 Pro and Xbox One X
Even the enhanced consoles target 1080p - and the standard machines suffer.

Activision impressed us with the brilliant Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 1+2 and with the new Crash Bandicoot 4 - It's About Time, it looks like a pattern is forming. The firm looks intent on mining its exhaustive IP, delivering remakes then moving onto brand new sequels. Based on the quality of this release, it's a strategy that may well play off - Crash Bandicoot 4 is a solid game and an authentic series entry, with numerous improvements and upgrades that pay off while respecting the original formula. The new release also makes use of Unreal Engine 4, offering numerous technical improvements over the recent remakes including a much higher frame-rate - at least if you're gaming on the right consoles.

Crash 4 perfectly captures the look and feel of an animated film - expressive character models stretch and squish in a cartoon style in both cinematics and gameplay, while gorgeous per-pixel motion blur accentuates every movement. The UE4 motion blur is one of my favorite things here - the shutter speed settings are just perfect. That said, you can disable this from the options menu if you're not so keen on the effect. The point is that the quality of the animation work is truly on point here, the visuals are first class and the overall package is excellent in presentational terms.

Background detail is ramped up across the board too with beautifully off-kilter models lending the game the exaggerated look you expect while still offering a lot of detail - and I mean a lot. It's still very much an on-rails experience, but that's perfectly fine and allows the developers to build some stunning looking worlds to explore. I especially appreciate the materials quality and lighting - it's a cartoon-like game for sure, but everything has that tangible feel you'd expect from a pre-rendered CGI film. To see it all play out in real-time in a fully interactive format is a real treat.

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2020-crash-bandicoot-4-console-tech-review

Tommy McClain

 

[iroboto]

John looks at Crash 4 on all platforms...

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1312066264572063745

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2020-crash-bandicoot-4-console-tech-review

Tommy McClain

He should have pulled a gutsy and added series x to the mix lol

 

[iroboto]

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2020-xbox-series-x-back-compat-is-transformative

@Dictator

we gotta learn about the install times If there was 1 mega pain point for all xbox owners, installing a new title took forever.

 

[BRiT]

@Dictator

we gotta learn about the install times If there was 1 mega pain point for all xbox owners, installing a new title took forever.

It only takes however long it takes to download. The past week I've been seeing 250 Mbps to 400 Mbps on OneX game updates even for large 20 gig patches.

Or do you mean for physical games? Well good news, you can now pre-install games on the Xbox Beta App on Android,, so they download with patches before you even get the physical media. After that point, the disc only acts as a license entitlement.

What likely caused installs to go slow in the past was the game was actually downloading patches at install time. One hack was mentioned to install physical games offline to improve that portion. Then when you go online the patches would be downloaded and installed.

 

[mpg1]

I wonder what the cap on download speeds is about? Server resources? Could they easily have it at 1Gbps?