Coronavirus Pandemic (COVID-19) (SARS-CoV-2) [2020]

Someone make sense of these numbers, please!

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UK's serious/critical case count is stupidly low. Netherlands case mortality rate is approaching 100% (I can see why Arwin is more concerned about Covid19 than others). I can only assume some countries are classing serious/critical far sooner than UK. Maybe the Brits are expected to just get better without making a hoo-ha about it?
 
@Shifty Geezer click on Yesterday's number from that link. The [NOW] tab is a bit wonky because of timezones, like the US hasn't reported any full image numbers today, that's why they're at only +5 deaths for today. Yesterday was +525. And why the UK is at no change for today?
 
Shifty the netherlands total cases 10,866 - total deaths 771 how is that approaching 100% ? (typo 10% ?)

on a lighter note (or maybe not)
The stupidity of people on youtube never ceases to amaze enjoy these words of wisdom :

"you cant catch virus's"
"on the back of the lysol bottle it says lysol kills coronavirus and n1h1 hepatitis A and a slew of other different virus's so if you see someone with corona you should spray it on them and it should kill the virus"
"the coronavirus has a cure, since when does a coronavirus that has been patented not have a cure everything that has been patented aids cancer everything has a cure"
"black people cant get coronavirus"
"no such thing as a coronavirus you cannot catch a virus it's all been made up"
"doctors are hoarding the antidote and are only giving it to friends and family and people who pay top dollar did you know that we cant get it. I dont know if this is a six protons, six neutrons, six electrons thats 666"
"do not get tested for coronavirus because you are willingly giving them permission to tell you anything that they want to tell you yeah"
 
Someone make sense of these numbers, please!

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UK's serious/critical case count is stupidly low. Netherlands case mortality rate is approaching 100% (I can see why Arwin is more concerned about Covid19 than others). I can only assume some countries are classing serious/critical far sooner than UK. Maybe the Brits are expected to just get better without making a hoo-ha about it?

I find it best to look at the trend on new daily cases. That tells if situation is going to get better/worse. Then look at daily deaths and know that it usually takes 19days from symptoms to die(for those unlucky that die). Daily deaths curve will follow daily new cases curve but delayed with 2-3 weeks.

This can easily be seen in data from germany. They find cases very early. Now the deaths are going up and they will very likely follow same curve as new cases but delayed with 2-3weeks. When you look at new daily cases you can literally see into the future.
 
Edit: His response is they've increased testing. This whole variable testing thing just makes data a mess.
typical.

I have a cousin that is just like this. Always has all the answers (none of them based on statistics etc).
Most of it complete conjecture, full denial of real world facts and full buy into conspiracy stuff.
 
@Shifty Geezer click on Yesterday's number from that link. The [NOW] tab is a bit wonky because of timezones, like the US hasn't reported any full image numbers today, that's why they're at only +5 deaths for today. Yesterday was +525. And why the UK is at no change for today?
Not looking at the daily changes. I'm looking at the reported state of the cases and their resolution. Why are so few UK cases in hospital? It's lower than S. Korea.

Shifty the netherlands total cases 10,866 - total deaths 771 how is that approaching 100% ? (typo 10% ?)
Case fatality. 10,000 of those cases are still ongoing and we don't know how they'll end up. Of the cases that have run thorugh to completion, almost all of them result in death. If that holds, almost all the existing 10,000 cases will result in death.
The stupidity of people on youtube never ceases to amaze enjoy these words of wisdom :
You never know how much of that is trolling though. I think an awful lot it.
I find it best to look at the trend on new daily cases.
Again, I'm not looking at the daily records. That's getting skewed higher and higher with countries performing more and more tests. A country that increases it's testing 5x over a period of a week should see an increase in Covid19 positives 5x over that week. Actual spread of the disease is hard to determine. I reckon you need positive tests per thousand tests; that'll increase as the virus spreads. But then you have other stats on the severity of the reactions. Some countries report far lower severity. Part of that will be regional difference on what they count as 'severe'. Part that will be goodness knows what.
 
https://www.nbcnews.com/business/bu...acerbated-shortage-medical-equipment-n1170466

Trump's trade war exacerbated shortage of medical equipment
Filing for a tariff exemption with the trade office "is not well suited to meet the urgency of medical supply shortages,” said one expert.

Hospital workers on the front lines of the fight against coronavirus are reporting dangerous shortages of supplies such as masks and gloves. Trade experts accuse President Donald Trump of politicizing the pandemic and risking the lives of first responders by continuing to wage his trade war against China.

White House trade adviser Peter Navarro is spearheading plans for an executive order to have federal agencies such as the Departments of Health and Human Services, and Defense obtain medical equipment and supplies from American manufacturers.

“We need to have them buy that from American producers on American soil,” he told CNBC.

Trade experts say the timing couldn’t be worse. “There's absolutely no reason at all to do that now,” said Michael O. Moore, a professor of economics and international affairs at George Washington University. “There's no long-term economic benefit to not allowing medical supplies to come in while we’re in the middle of a health crisis.”

---

My relative who runs a factory in China told me China's factories are overflowing with masks & protective gear they can't ship to the US bc US trade war tariffs ban medical supply imports from China. Meanwhile, a NYC nurse at a hospital with no masks or gear just died of COVID19.​

 
typical.

I have a cousin that is just like this. Always has all the answers (none of them based on statistics etc).
Most of it complete conjecture, full denial of real world facts and full buy into conspiracy stuff.
It's a valid argument though. If Czechia has increased testing 2x, then positive case counts should increase 2x.

This whole international number comparison is actually bollocks. It's starting to annoy me. The WHO needs to step in and standardise the data. We need test counts, positives per 1000 tests, and qualifying the bands for the different symptoms. We need standards on what data is counted as a death and when. This needs be in place for every future epidemic. Regional data obfuscates what's actually happening.
 
Eventually we can test for antibodies. Hopefully one or more countries uses antibody test to retroactively figure out how many people really did get sick and also ask from people that did get sick how much symptoms they felt. That would give us understanding on how easily this virus spread, how many people had very mild/no symptoms etc.

At the moment the data is so bad that I don't see usefulness outside trends. And there of course are things like amount of testing/who is being tested etc. that affects trends.

Some people might have already been sick for week and be completely fine. Then in day 10 they end up requiring hospital care(or not). It's very difficult to use those numbers for detail analysis as we don't know the amount of people that have been sick for 1 day, 10days, 19days,... If I remember right it's around day10 after symptoms appeared or even later when unlucky people will require hospital care.
 
It's a valid argument though. If Czechia has increased testing 2x, then positive case counts should increase 2x.

This whole international number comparison is actually bollocks. It's starting to annoy me. The WHO needs to step in and standardise the data. We need test counts, positives per 1000 tests, and qualifying the bands for the different symptoms. We need standards on what data is counted as a death and when. This needs be in place for every future epidemic. Regional data obfuscates what's actually happening.
"If you torture data long enough, it will confess"
- Ronald Coase

2x sampling doesn't necessarily mean positive case counts should increase 2x at all. And this is a mistake that many people will make in assumptions (myself included).
For starters, doing a quick visual check, the graph isn't linear ;)

It is much easier in this case, to go with a delayed reading of death rate and multiply it through by deaths and figure out an approximation of infected cases. So 100 deaths = 10,000 cases. There are things that can influence your death rate of course, and for that reason we have box and whisker plots, regressions with tolerances and variance. We have all these extra statistical measures for exactly this purpose.

My job is data science and we see mistakes happen all the time at all levels of experience. Hell I make mistakes all the time too. It's easy to make a claim, ti's actually really hard in reality to pinpoint the exact data to make the claim. This is a key challenge to understand and interpret data that is released out there; some people have agendas, others don't know what they are doing fully, and some are too excited by their findings to properly check if it's correct. This is why AI and ML is such an amazing field. Because you likely found all the main critical factors to result in a working AI or your AI wouldn't work outside of your own training cases.

So typically in programming we do:
Rules + Inputs = Outputs
So we take data and apply some functions and we get results.

In Machine Learning
We take
Outputs + Inputs = Rules
We have the inputs (features), we have the results, and machine learning is supposed to return to us the set of rules to get us those answers.

So in this case there are several factors that I would consider key in proving his claim.
Which country
Do they wear Masks
Do they do social distancing
Climate
Health Care
Education
Government type

etc
These are the types of inputs I would put into a ML algorithm and I would then toss in the resulting data for the case increases per day. and See the ML algorithm build some sort of regression.
If I were to take a list of variables and tossed it into a ML algorithms and asked it to predict the number of cases or some regression, would masks be the feature to have 100% weighting over the result of case increase?

That doesn't make any sense. There is 0% chance wearing a mask for 100% of the population will stop the increase in cases.
China and Asia wear masks everywhere and daily. They manufacture over 90% of the worlds masks and are the greatest user of them.
And yea Wuhan blew up and other countries in Asia continue to grow in cases.
So it's clear there are other factors.
No ML algorithm would put 100% weighting behind anything, unless the input was the result.
And if someone was bored enough to create the training set we could toss this into a decision tree or any other basic ML model and prove his claim to be false.
 
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Case fatality. 10,000 of those cases are still ongoing and we don't know how they'll end up. Of the cases that have run thorugh to completion, almost all of them result in death. If that holds, almost all the existing 10,000 cases will result in death.

Is this a correct way of looking at it? My understanding is that there are no official numbers for recoveries as there is no requirement to report them. So wouldn't that skew the numbers?

I would also like to see breakdowns by age groups etc. I think that would be very interesting also with regards to who are most at risk and what sensible precautions could be taken based on that in the long run.

Numbers are also increasing in Japan, surprisingly quite a bit after it was announced the Olympics would be postponed...

Measures are still mostly weak though. People are asked not to go out on weekends, but there is nothing done to make sure people don't cram together on trains and at work. Though it appears that legally the government can't do much and can't force lockdowns such as in Europe.

That said, rumor has it Abe's wife thought it was a good idea to go watch the cherry blossoms despite the government telling the people to please don't.
 
I had bunch of corona like symptoms for 2 weeks. Don't know if I was just stressed/imagined/placebo. But it was very unusual for me as I'm usually very healthy and in good shape, no extra fat.

Started with insane tiredness, couple of days joint pain(like I have had when in high fever), then my body temp rose 0.4C above my normal, resting heart rate and average heart rate when sleeping rose 7 beats per minute above normal and HRV went way down. Only exercise I was able to do was walking(california is locked down) and when walking I felt like something is pressing heavily my chest and had trouble breathing. Usually when I don't exercise my heartrate goes down and hrv goes up but this time I got less recovered when resting.

All of this super unusual. I never get tired when walking/have trouble breathing. I have my heartrate, core temp etc. data from long time as I use oura ring to track my sleep/recovery. I wish there was antibody test to figure out if I had mild version or corona, something else or if I just imagined myself sick.
 
Numbers are also increasing in Japan, surprisingly quite a bit after it was announced the Olympics would be postponed...
Yea, I didn't want to say anything because my cousin lives in Japan and he was adamant the disease was false because no one was getting sick in Japan. I didn't want to point out the obvious that Japan would face a lot of external pressure to cancel the olympics if COVID was not under control there.
 
I had bunch of corona like symptoms for 2 weeks. Don't know if I was just stressed/imagined/placebo. But it was very unusual for me as I'm usually very healthy and in good shape, no extra fat.

Started with insane tiredness, couple of days joint pain(like I have had when in high fever), then my body temp rose 0.4C above my normal, resting heart rate and average heart rate when sleeping rose 7 beats per minute above normal and HRV went way down. Only exercise I was able to do was walking(california is locked down) and when walking I felt like something is pressing heavily my chest and had trouble breathing. Usually when I don't exercise my heartrate goes down and hrv goes up but this time I got less recovered when resting.

All of this super unusual. I never get tired when walking/have trouble breathing. I have my heartrate, core temp etc. data from long time as I use oura ring to track my sleep/recovery. I wish there was antibody test to figure out if I had mild version or corona, something else or if I just imagined myself sick.
Yea be careful there. If you have respiratory issues and they progressing worse please check into a hospital before its too late.
 
Eventually we can test for antibodies. Hopefully one or more countries uses antibody test to retroactively figure out how many people really did get sick and also ask from people that did get sick how much symptoms they felt. That would give us understanding on how easily this virus spread, how many people had very mild/no symptoms etc.
The UK has 3.5 million antibody tests being validated.

2x sampling doesn't necessarily mean positive case counts should increase 2x at all.
Well yeah, not a direct 1:1 correlation. However, if the limit to finding new cases is testing rate, than upping the testing rate will increase the number of positives. the take home is we can't compare day to day growth rates if the test rates are also growing. The only comparable case rate growths will be those with identical testing - came number of the same population samples will show growth within those samples. The moment we have things like prioritising tests on medical staff, we'll shift what the data is reporting, but chuck it all into the same naive spreadsheets and then draw up dumb global rankings of unrelated data-points.

Covid19 should be a university test-case for years to come, showing students how not to do it and why.
 
Well yeah, not a direct 1:1 correlation. However, if the limit to finding new cases is testing rate, than upping the testing rate will increase the number of positives. the take home is we can't compare day to day growth rates if the test rates are also growing. The only comparable case rate growths will be those with identical testing - came number of the same population samples will show growth within those samples. The moment we have things like prioritising tests on medical staff, we'll shift what the data is reporting, but chuck it all into the same naive spreadsheets and then draw up dumb global rankings of unrelated data-points.

Covid19 should be a university test-case for years to come, showing students how not to do it and why.
Hmm indeed. It's not that data isn't useless or ranking etc. Just some of the conclusions drawn from the data aren't as conclusive as they make them to be.

That's why the Princess Cruise Ship was such a random pivotal piece of information that was a cruel test of quarantine ending up helping us to understand the effect on an entire 'sub population'.
Where we managed to do 100% testing on all passengers and we saw a death rate of 1%.

It may not be reflective of the world but it's damn useful to apply to around.
 
Where we managed to do 100% testing on all passengers and we saw a death rate of 1%.

It may not be reflective of the world but it's damn useful to apply to around.
Its not 100% finished from wiki these are the numbers

712 Confirmed cases
587 recovered
11 Deaths

so I guess 114 unresolved, which means

1.83% death rate ( of finished cases )
though final figure will be between 1.54% -> 17.5%
 
I meant that the deaths are very low in comparison with what's happening in other countries.

The mortality rate is 1%, which is what is reported in other countries as well where hospital ICU resources aren't exhausted and where testing is done on a random selection of people, rather than just testing people feeling (very) sick.

Cheers
 
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