Heartbeat Sensor on Dualshock 5

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You mean as you got older you got less versatile and willing to try new things, like every single human who ages?
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My interests have just shifted to different things. Every dollar I spend on gadgets is a dollar I can't spend on something that's more meaningful or rewarding to me now. In terms of tech, I'll let other people be the beta testers, and I'll reap the benefits later if it turns out.
 
I can't tell any difference between those pictures and the DS4. Everything looks the same to me. I'm positively sure the touchpad is exactly the same size after measuring and comparing both relatively to the controller size. Not saying that's not the DS5, but he should show us the back to confirm there is no lightbar at least.

The pictures seem fake and the guy (who was never vetted by the mods) has apparently been discredited.
To be honest, his performance numbers were quite far from the vetted ones (13TF vs 11-12TF)
 
Btw currently, on PS4, even the gyro was left unused although it would be awesome to use with shooters.

Nintendo showed that really well. Or if you use pc, try using it to play shooters on pc. Ds4 Gyro works well.
Its implementation in Gran Turismo Sport is honestly quite amazing.
 

This is not a hypothesis. This is an actual prototype that a dev had sunk time and money into, and did so long enough to get to something that they felt was worth demoing at e3, and even then, nothing came out of it.
Call me conservative, but I feel like this concrete historical evidence lends some justification for my skepticism.
 
You mean as you got older you got less versatile and willing to try new things, like every single human who ages?
That's insulting. Firstly, not every single human likes new things less and less. Secondly, learning to be able to predict what you do and don't like is just experience. Kids often are desperate to have something, only to find it's rubbish when they get it. That goes for adults too, who can buy products on promise only to be disappointed, but at least the adult's buying decision ahead of acquisition tends to be more grounded.

Those are implementations that people think are rubbish?.
- The DS4's light-bar enabled the PS4's standard controller to be used as a VR controller, which in turn enabled Sony to have the most successful VR platform in the world. It's something the XBone could never achieve once they got rid of mandatory Kinect.
The gyroscope+accelerometer is also extensively used in PSVR.
So it's only useful for PSVR. That's about 6% of the PS4 population. And before PSVR was released, it had effectively no use. So when people were complaining they didn't want a light bar because it was a poor feedback system placed in the wrong place, glares off the TV, and drains the battery, what they should have been doing was imagining a future VR product it'd be perfect for which they wouldn't want?

No, the criticisms against DS4 features were completely justified as 20/20 hindsight shows us. Sony's plans for them didn't amount to anything (they were overly optimistic of their value) and in the end, they only managed to find justification in a small niche.

I certainly don't remember anyone saying ew I can keep playing my games when I go to bed or the toilet? I can have a second screen with HUD elements so it doesn't have to appear in the TV making it more immersive? This is rubbish!
Unless you're talking about console BoM economics which is very obviously out of the scope of 99.99% of console gamers, therefore irrelevant.
Okay, look at your justifications and you'll see it's all about the mundane and not the next-gen promise that you're expecting from biosensors. The screen was touch sensitive, so could have bene used for input, and the screen offered a secondary view possibility. What was it actually used for? Continuing your game when the TV was in use and showing a UI that could as readily be put on the screen and not need you to take your eyes away from it. Whether you value those things or not, the next-gen features hoped for never happened. Exactly the same as the next-gen features of DS4.

Once you get a base (resting) level for your heartrate, increases in its pace will reveal:
- Stress levels on difficult situations with lots of movement (e.g. battling incoming hordes of enemies)
- Frustration on difficult situations without movement (e.g. trying to break puzzles)
- Fear levels on suspense situation like horror games.
This is the only part of the discussion you should have engaged with rather than slagging off the board repeatedly. And these are the sorts of lists we've always created for new tech like Sixaxis motion controls and Wii U secondary screens, only to see reality far more prosaic and nothing become of them.

As for your list, I'd say a primary concern is the accuracy. People's heartrates could be up for reasons outside the game experience, changing gameplay when it isn't appropriate. And then, most importantly for the primary concern of this thread, which devs would go to the effort of implementing those features? Unless you're making a PS exclusive, it's added effort to support the feature that most players won't be able to use. It'll be far more complex to balance adaptive play of this sort due to the test data, and for adaptive games, in game metrics will work for all platforms so you'd be better off doing that then tracking heart-rate on one platform and metrics on 3 or 4 others.
 
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Oh I am totally willing to try new things, and I d love to see creative imp0lementations in games.
I was totally into the motion detection in DS3 and DS4. DS4's motion detection was amazing but barely exploited and few games used it properly like Tearaway.
I am disappointed though when the feature is there, is barely taken advantage of and I know that it ate up resources needlessly from areas that are guaranteed to improve the experience. Areas that the developers use and fit for every experience.
These special features are most likely unsuitable for 99% of the games that will be released. So its like it is not even there
 
No, the criticisms against DS4 features were completely justified as 20/20 hindsight shows us. Sony's plans for them didn't amount to anything (they were overly optimistic of their value) and in the end, they only managed to find justification in a small niche.

So never try anything new again ? PSVR might of sold even less if a person had to buy a new controller to use it. In fact Sony should just scrap VR no in fact everyone should just scrap it because the numbers are nowhere near mainstream?
 
So never try anything new again ? PSVR might of sold even less if a person had to buy a new controller to use it. In fact Sony should just scrap VR no in fact everyone should just scrap it because the numbers are nowhere near mainstream?
No, no and no. The developments of DS4 were presented as allowing a whole host of features that never happened. The same with my other examples and every list of "wouldn't it be awesome if this feature used this way?" ideas we've created over the past 15 years of discussing consoles with new innovations. That the features eventually found a use doesn't mean they were worth including as the standard controller.

And of course VR shouldn't be axed because it's not mainstream - was a daft argument. It doesn't have to be mainstream when it's opt in and people want it. It's the difference between bundling Kinect or PSVR with the console versus selling it separately to those who actually want it. If the DS4 controller is only of benefit to PSVR, it should be sold separately as VR enabled controller option, with a light-bar free, long life controller being the standard. Should Sony go ahead with PSVR 2? Definitely. Should they pack it in with every PS5 and drive the cost up to $800 for every PS fan? Definitely not.

Should Sony create a DS4 that negatively affects all users because it'll be of value to the one in twenty who'll one day buy VR? Clearly not, and Sony wouldn't have made that choice. Instead, Sony had visions of this light bar being used in all games to provide feedback like low ammo or cursed (which gamers correctly said was a bad idea that would never happen) and having superior motion tracking for all those motion enabled games that never got made. It wasn't about VR, and it wasn't an idea that gained traction because it couldn't really add to games in a meaningful way.

One could readily design a whole host of novel ideas into controllers and consoles, but that doesn't make it a good idea when those ideas have a cost to implement and may not see much use. Like using your console to manage the TV, or having a camera track users by default, or including a grill so it can cook food as well as play games, or including a battery charger bay, or having the SOC removable and placeable into a number of other devices like a robot or remote-controlled car, or including wheels in the controllers and a way to fasten them to shoes so they double as roller-skates, or including a full mobile SOC and touch-screen in every controller so you can carry it around in replacement of your mobile phone, or having strap-on lights for your elbows, hands, knees and feet for really accurate tracking as a requirement to use the console.

Every idea has to be sanely justifiable. Motion controls was a good idea, there were good arguments for its inclusion, Sony went ahead with the added cost, but it still didn't get anywhere sadly. Biosensors need to be justifiable. Go justify them with a real, sensible argument instead of "it's new and therefore innovate and must be worth doing."
 
So never try anything new again ? PSVR might of sold even less if a person had to buy a new controller to use it. In fact Sony should just scrap VR no in fact everyone should just scrap it because the numbers are nowhere near mainstream?

This is the internet in a post.

People express an opinion that is skeptical of something.

Immediate response on the internet is to take it to the absolutely extreme.

X person: Hmm, I'm skeptical of this new flavor of ice cream that is releasing soon.
Internet: So what? Never ever try any new flavors of ice cream ever again?
X person: Huh? What are you on?

:)

Basically all of that just to point out that absolutely nobody in this thread suggested anything like what you just posted.

Regards,
SB
 
This is the internet in a post.

People express an opinion that is skeptical of something.

Immediate response on the internet is to take it to the absolutely extreme.

X person: Hmm, I'm skeptical of this new flavor of ice cream that is releasing soon.
Internet: So what? Never ever try any new flavors of ice cream ever again?
X person: Huh? What are you on?

:)

Basically all of that just to point out that absolutely nobody in this thread suggested anything like what you just posted.

Regards,
SB

If people were just sceptical it wouldn't be a problem.
Shifty himself called the light rubbish but it was critical for me so I didn't have to buy another controller for my PSVR same with the motion sensing.

What did the led cost Sony? I would imagine very little. Yes it effected battery life and that was a problem did it stop people from buying a PS4 probably not.


I can quote a lot of posts from this thread with people calling everything a gimmick and a waste of time. My point was and still is that out of every new feature that's a success there will be more failed attempts.

I'm not saying biometric sensors is going to be anything special but just saying it's crap I don't want it will lead to little innovation.

And no your example about the ice cream is facetious what would be more accurate to this thread would be here's a new flavour of ice cream and people saying it's crap I don't want it, which might be the case I'm sure there's been a lot of flavours that have been failures but one or two probably have paid of.
 
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I am disappointed though when the feature is there, is barely taken advantage of and I know that it ate up resources needlessly from areas that are guaranteed to improve the experience

I'm also disappointed they weren't used more but did they really take resources away from other areas.

The Dualshock 4 is cheaper in my country than the Xbox controller and you get a rechargeable battery with it.
 
And no your example about the ice cream is facetious what would be more accurate to this thread would be here's a new flavour of ice cream and people saying it's crap I don't want it, which might be the case I'm sure there's been a lot of flavours that have been failures but one or two probably have paid of.
You left out, without having even tried it or injecting a personal preference as a fact.

I'm also disappointed they weren't used more but did they really take resources away from other areas.
And just to add, if the PS5 is underpowered (or even if its not for some) people will equivocate and say that they could've made a more powerful ps5 instead of adding this thing that no one wants.
 
And just to add, if the PS5 is underpowered (or even if its not for some) people will equivocate and say that they could've made a more powerful ps5 instead of adding this thing that no one wants.

Most probably but it doesn't make it true though.
 
If people were just sceptical it wouldn't be a problem.
Except that's what they were when TotTz complained about close-mindedness.

Shifty himself called the light rubbish
I didn't call it rubbish. I explained how it didn't work well by compromising the experience for everyone for the benefit of a relatively small few, and those shortcomings were vocalised when the controller was announced, and those criticisms were completely justified by those people who voiced them.

but it was critical for me so I didn't have to buy another controller for my PSVR same with the motion sensing.
So as long as a choice benefits you, you don't care how sensible it is or how it's inclusion affects everyone else? That's narrow-minded thinking. ;)

I'm not saying biometric sensors is going to be anything special but just saying it's crap I don't want it will lead to little innovation.
Why? Why do you think when a great idea comes out, people will say they don't want it and it's just a useless gimmick? Why do you associate responses to one idea being indicative of responses to all ideas?

And no your example about the ice cream is facetious what would be more accurate to this thread would be here's a new flavour of ice cream and people saying it's crap I don't want it, which might be the case I'm sure there's been a lot of flavours that have been failures but one or two probably have paid of.
No, it's more like a flavour that's described as Pickled Gherkin and Marmite, and people saying they don't like the sound of that and pointing out 95% of peculiar flavours end up disgusting. That doesn't mean Pickled Gherkin and Marmite ice-cream won't actually be scrummy when we get to try it, but it'll be down to the creators to convince us that our expectations, based on what we know about the flavours we like and our imagination of what they'll taste like together, are wrong and convince us to try it.

If all they do is moan that no-one will try their new ice-cream flavour, the collapse of their ice-cream business is on them.
 
Most probably but it doesn't make it true though.
The motion sensors? I expect that it should have cost a lot of money in the controller. Millions of units small per small cost in each should amount to millions that could have been spent elsewhere.
I am very thankful it existed though since it gave birth to some amazing titles that used it, but unfortunately they never got the use or acclaim they deserved.
The sensors for the DS5 might be a lot more expensive in terms of R&D and production which begs the question, if it had a significant effect resources put into the performance of the console for a feature that will barely get used.
 
Oh, a new thread I haven't read yet!

*click*

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