Next Generation Hardware Speculation with a Technical Spin [post E3 2019, pre GDC 2020] [XBSX, PS5]

[iroboto]

I don’t want to get into saying MS is all about 4D chess now. But they should be more aware of how quickly their hardware was sorted after their Scorpio teaser. So whether they want to or not want to is entirely up to them.

Even with both companies keeping their cards close to chest they both ended up with SSD and ray tracing as their next go to thing. Almost positive they will have the same/similar RAM layout lol.

 

[fehu]

Even with both companies keeping their cards close to chest they both ended up with SSD and ray tracing as their next go to thing. Almost positive they will have the same/similar RAM layout lol.

As a kid, I watched an anime called Fushigi no umi no Nadia. Two characters were both in some way inventors/scientists, and at some point they were challenged to make the fastest running device, and having about the same knowledge, the same skills and the same gears available, they ended up independently with two very similar designs. They both had the same bug: they were running on a small island, but they didn't implement any turning settings.

It was funny, and I smile a little see this happening all the time in any tech sector.

 

[Karmaprof]

This might be the SuborZ follow-up with double the specs + HDD.

I still believe Gonzalo = PS5.

Gonzalo and Flute wont support Raytracing in Hardware so its unlikely you see these Chips in Nextgen Consoles.

 

[AbsoluteBeginner]

Gonzalo and Flute wont support Raytracing in Hardware so its unlikely you see these Chips in Nextgen Consoles.

We dont have single idea what Gonzalo will feature. We only know its Navi based custom chip designated for gaming console. Everything points at Sony, but who knows until we get confirmation.

 

[Globalisateur]

Lite in Navi Lite means integrated GPU (iGPU) according to Komachi

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1153873013776908288

 

[Proelite]

Gonzalo and Flute wont support Raytracing in Hardware so its unlikely you see these Chips in Nextgen Consoles.

There is no way we can know this right now. We don't even know conclusively if it's Navi 10 derivative. Only evidence for Gonzalo specs wise is 8 core Zen 2 at 3.2 GHz and Navi GPU at 1.8GHZ.

With Flute we found out that it has a 256 bit bus, 16GB 18gbps GDDR6 and. 8MB of L3 cache.

There is no evidence for lack of RT hardware.

 

[Prophecy2k]

There is no way we can know this right now. We don't even know conclusively if it's Navi 10 derivative. Only evidence for Gonzalo specs wise is 8 core Zen 2 at 3.2 GHz and Navi GPU at 1.8GHZ.

With Flute we found out that it has a 256 bit bus, 16GB GDDR6 and. 8MB of L3 cache.

There is no evidence for lack of RT hardware.

Where did the bus size and RAM type for Flute come from?

 

[Globalisateur]

Where did the bus size and RAM type for Flute come from?

I think @chris1515 has a screenshot of the now deleted Flute benchmark. You can make your own specs from that.

Found it:

 

[BRiT]

One could also make their own benchmark results too.

 

[Shortbread]

Slightly off-topic, but since we're discussing APUs....

Can someone figure out the rest of the Xbox One X APU render information from the original Scorpio reveal? The identification number is 2G400076G8464 (see pic). The chart used for spec'ing out some of the information is below as well.

Sad those base-clock (4GHz) didn't materialize, that would have been an amazing upgrade in speed. I wonder if MS had another CPU planned other than Jaguar for the Scorpio APU? Then again, all of it could have been gibberish of something that never existed in silicon form.

Xbox One X APU (reveal render)
Sample (2): ES1
Platform (G): Game
Frequency/Revision (4000): 4GHz
TDP/VRM (76): ?
Physical Package (G): ?
Number of Physical Cores (8): 8c
Cache Configuration (4): Possibly 8MB L3
Core Stepping (64): ?

 

[AbsoluteBeginner]

I don't think 4000 means base clock in G codes. 1607 was probably just coincidence in Gonzalo with assumed 1.6GHZ base, I think its code for something completely different.

 

[Shortbread]

I don't think 4000 means base clock in G codes.

Well, it's the same code configuration (see below) that APISAK/Kamachi (damn near all of ResetEra) have been using to hang their hats on for Gonzalo base-clocks. There can't be two different standards when comparing one to another. So, either that Xbox One X APU reveal render ID was complete random gibberish (fake number), or that APU exsisted in some type of silicon form having a different CPU other than Jaguar.

 

[mrcorbo]

Well, it's the same code configuration (see below) that APISAK/Kamachi (damn near all of ResetEra) have been using to hang their hats on for Gonzalo base-clocks. There can't be two different standards when comparing one to another. So, either that Xbox One X APU reveal render ID was complete random gibberish (fake number), or that APU exsisted in some type of silicon form having a different CPU other than Jaguar.

AMD set the standard. It can be whatever they want and, while I don't have a link handy and don't have time to look for it ATM, I'm pretty sure we figured out that the format for the semi-custom parts was different months ago.

 

[AbsoluteBeginner]

Well, it's the same code configuration (see below) that APISAK/Kamachi (damn near all of ResetEra) have been using to hang their hats on for Gonzalo base-clocks. There can't be two different standards when comparing one to another. So, either that Xbox One X APU reveal render ID was complete random gibberish (fake number), or that APU exsisted in some type of silicon form having a different CPU other than Jaguar.

I think it was Komachi that said (back in January) that it could be base clocks, but he wasn't sure, APISAK hasn't mentioned base clocks.

These where Playstation codes for PS4 and Pro, so I doubt 4 numbers in G products have anything to do with base clocks.

DG1000FGF84HT - PS4
DG1101SKF84HV - PS4
DG1201SLF87HW - PS4 Pro
DG1301SML87HY - PS4 Pro

Where we got 1.6GHZ from is Flute benchmark. Different GPU revision 13F9 (13F8 for January Gonzalo, 13E9 for April one)

 

[Shortbread]

AMD set the standard. It can be whatever they want and, while I don't have a link handy and don't have time to look for it ATM, I'm pretty sure we figured out that the format for the semi-custom parts was different months ago.

That's fine. I'm not debating AMDs identification methods, I'm debating how it was being applied by APISAK/Komachi against Gonzalo. If there is another way of ID-ing bespoke game APUs, then their methods as of now by their provided charts for Gonzalo are incorrect or at least dealing with what they deem to be the base clocks.

 

[mrcorbo]

That's fine. I'm not debating AMDs identification methods, I'm debating how it was being applied by APISAK/Komachi against Gonzalo. If there is another way of ID-ing bespoke game APUs, then their methods as of now by their provided charts for Gonzalo are incorrect or at least dealing with what they deem to be the base clocks.

Found it.

It's not definitive, but it gives you something to think about.

 

[AbsoluteBeginner]

That's fine. I'm not debating AMDs identification methods, I'm debating how it was being applied by APISAK/Komachi against Gonzalo. If there is another way of ID-ing bespoke game APUs, then their methods as of now by their provided charts for Gonzalo are incorrect or at least dealing with what they deem to be the base clocks.

APISAK hasn't said anything about base clock. Komachi did say it could be base clock, but that boost is 3.2GHZ. Its just that news outlets took it as fact and ran with it (same with Flute being Scarlett because Gonzalo is PS5, which makes 0 sense as Scarlett does not have 256bit bus)

 

[Shortbread]

I think it was Komachi that said (back in January) that it could be base clocks, but he wasn't sure, APISAK hasn't mentioned base clocks.

These where Playstation codes for PS4 and Pro, so I doubt 4 numbers in G products have anything to do with base clocks.

DG1000FGF84HT - PS4
DG1101SKF84HV - PS4
DG1201SLF87HW - PS4 Pro
DG1301SML87HY - PS4 Pro

Where we got 1.6GHZ from is Flute benchmark. Different GPU revision 13F9 (13F8 for January Gonzalo, 13E9 for April one)

This is somewhat of my point. The way they APISAK/Komachi have originally parsed information or made certain assumptions based on incomplete information (ID-ing) about random undisclosed hardware and benchmarks, it is why I don't particularly believe anything surrounding Gonzalo being nothing more than unannounced AMD product unrelated to Sony/MS designs.

 

[AbsoluteBeginner]

This is somewhat of my point. The way they APISAK/Komachi have originally parsed information or made certain assumptions based on incomplete information (ID-ing) about random undisclosed hardware and benchmarks, it is why I don't particularly believe anything surrounding Gonzalo being nothing more than unannounced AMD product unrelated to Sony/MS designs.

But they didnt. APISAK found code and posted it. Komachi decoded it and for 1600 said it might be 1.6GHZ because he doesnt know what it could be, as its not the same for G products as is for others.

I think he thought its PS5 for several reasons. PCI ID matches Ariel, which was rumored to be PS5 codename. After that, we found out it is gaming APU with Navi GPU Zen2 CPU and 16GB of GDDR6 on 256bit bus. It cannot be Scarlett duo to bus, but could be PS5, because if we are honest its hard to see it being anything else.

Especially since codename matches Sony products in quite a few ways.

 

[Shortbread]

APISAK hasn't said anything about base clock. Komachi did say it could be base clock, but that boost is 3.2GHZ. Its just that news outlets took it as fact and ran with it (same with Flute being Scarlett because Gonzalo is PS5, which makes 0 sense as Scarlett does not have 256bit bus)

What makes you sure that Scarlett doesn't have a 256-bit bus? Because of the Scarlett reveal render or because the XB1-X has 384-bit bus?