The Official, Long Awaited, TV Shows Thread

[Picao84]

Spoiler

Well, all I'm saying is that all these 'reasons' could have been connected to the actual final act much, much better. Otherwise the act wouldn't have felt so completely out of character to many of us. As I said, it would have taken a very short scene to connect all the dots to the point she finally snapped. Cause girl, she SNAPPED!

Spoiler: Honestly

All those dots were there in the last four episodes and last season:

- Brutally killed the leader of Sam's house and his son without blinking an eye
- Obsessed with the Throne, no matter how much she loves Jon Snow
- Asks for Jon Snow to hide the truth of his birth just to get the Throne
- Leaves the post-Winterfell Battle feast bothered that everyone likes Jon Snow and totally ignored her and her dragons

I mean, what more did you want the show to do to ease you into what was effectively a person who was feeling more and more alone and ignored by the day, with the goal of sitting on the Iron Throne slipping away?

To make it clear, if you didn't understand it this way, when she was ravaging the city, she didn't care about Cersie anymore. It was a desperate tour de force from someone who was feeling completely powerless and whose only weapon was now fear. She knew that if it ended there with the bells, she would never ever be Queen. Now matter how outrageous her deed was, that was the only card she had left to play. Inspire allegiance and loyalty with fear.

 

[London Geezer]

Spoiler: Honestly

All those dots were there in the last four episodes and last season:

- Brutally killed the leader of Sam's house and his son without blinking an eye
- Obsessed with the Throne, no matter how much she loves Jon Snow
- Asks for Jon Snow to hide the truth of his birth just to get the Throne
- Leaves the post-Winterfell Battle feast bothered that everyone likes Jon Snow and totally ignored her and her dragons

I mean, what more did you want the show to do to ease you into what was effectively a person who was feeling more and more alone and ignored by the day, with the goal of sitting on the Iron Throne slipping away?

To make it clear, if you didn't understand it this way, when she was ravaging the city, she didn't care about Cersie anymore. It was a desperate tour de force from someone who was feeling completely powerless and whose only weapon was now fear. She knew that if it ended there with the bells, she would never ever be Queen. Now matter how outrageous her deed was, that was the only card she had left to play. Inspire allegiance and loyalty with fear.

Spoiler

All we’re saying is that going from those acts you mentioned to the killing of hundreds of thousands of civilians, women, children, burning the city over and over, is a very, very long stretch that should have been developed a little bit more.

 

[Picao84]

Spoiler

All we’re saying is that going from those acts you mentioned to the killing of hundreds of thousands of civilians, women, children, burning the city over and over, is a very, very long stretch that should have been developed a little bit more.

Ok, humour me and tell me how? What would you have done differently to cover that gap?

 

[London Geezer]

I'm really not going to argue with anyone about bloody GoT!

Spoiler

The reality is that a lot of people felt that what happened was out of character, and you can choose to just disagree or you can choose to try to understand why a lot of us feel that way.

We feel that way because of an obvious narrative gap between the 'hints' that we got here and there, and what happened. Everything worked just right up until she sat there, all scorpions destroyed (even though that was also a bit of a stretch, I'll allow it). But then everything she did after that felt completely out of character, and it's undeniable. The only way to fix that would have been to develop that very, very big jump in characterisation a little bit more.

That's all!

Spoiler

And that's before we get into the other arcs that were rushed to the point of losing all dramatic effect, such as Varys dying (meh), Tyrion going from the cleverest guy in the realm to being pretty stupid, Cersei just standing there the whole season then dying like that, let's not even get into the pointlessness of Jamie's arc...

 

[Picao84]

I'm really not going to argue with anyone about bloody GoT!

Spoiler

The reality is that a lot of people felt that what happened was out of character, and you can choose to just disagree or you can choose to try to understand why a lot of us feel that way.

We feel that way because of an obvious narrative gap between the 'hints' that we got here and there, and what happened. Everything worked just right up until she sat there, all scorpions destroyed (even though that was also a bit of a stretch, I'll allow it). But then everything she did after that felt completely out of character, and it's undeniable. The only way to fix that would have been to develop that very, very big jump in characterisation a little bit more.

That's all!

Spoiler: It is denieable

I'm sorry but I have just showed you how it was not out of character with examples of actions she made that lead to that. If you really had paid attention to the show all these years and how she actually is, and not what Jorah made her look like, you and everyone who agrees with you, would have seen there is nothing surprising about this.

I also asked you for alternatives, because if you are criticizing something you better have an idea of how you would have done it different, otherwise what's the point???

You didn't like it and that's fine. What you can't do is ignore and or dismiss all the signs that lead to this event. Otherwise you are just having a case of cognitive bias.

Spoiler: I'll give you one

Varys dead was rushed I agree, it was the only thing I didn't like in the episode.

Regarding Tyrion, common, it's yet another case of rose tinted glasses. He is smart, but problem solving smart. He was never particularly socially smart. Have you forgotten about Shae? He was nearly killed because he trusted a hooker! In the world of GoT? That was incredibly naive and dumb and he almost died for it if not for his brother saving him! Just like Jon Snow he has too much a good heart and believes people. He believed Shae like he always believed in his sister to not be as evil. This was not out of character, he was ALWAYS like this.

 

[Bludd]

I'm really not going to argue with anyone about bloody GoT!

Spoiler

The reality is that a lot of people felt that what happened was out of character, and you can choose to just disagree or you can choose to try to understand why a lot of us feel that way.

We feel that way because of an obvious narrative gap between the 'hints' that we got here and there, and what happened. Everything worked just right up until she sat there, all scorpions destroyed (even though that was also a bit of a stretch, I'll allow it). But then everything she did after that felt completely out of character, and it's undeniable. The only way to fix that would have been to develop that very, very big jump in characterisation a little bit more.

That's all!

Spoiler

And that's before we get into the other arcs that were rushed to the point of losing all dramatic effect, such as Varys dying (meh), Tyrion going from the cleverest guy in the realm to being pretty stupid, Cersei just standing there the whole season then dying like that, let's not even get into the pointlessness of Jamie's arc...

Hopefully the books (oh GRRM I beseech thee) will flesh this out more and Better (TM).

Still. This is the best fantasy tv show ever made, even though it has gone down in quality. It's the best because all the other ones have been shit.

 

[London Geezer]

Spoiler: It is denieable

I'm sorry but I have just showed you how it was not out of character with examples of actions she made that lead to that. If you really had paid attention to the show all these years and how she actually is, and not what Jorah made her look like, you and everyone who agrees with you, would have seen there is nothing surprising about this.

I also asked you for alternatives, because if you are criticizing something you better have an idea of how you would have done it different, otherwise what's the point???

You didn't like it and that's fine. What you can't do is ignore and or dismiss all the signs that lead to this event. Otherwise you are just having a case of cognitive bias.

Spoiler: I'll give you one

Varys dead was rushed I agree, it was the only thing I didn't like in the episode.

Regarding Tyrion, common, or it's yet another case of rose tinted glasses. He is smart, but problem solving smart. He was never particularly socially smart. Have you forgotten about Shae? He was nearly killed because he trusted a hooker! In the world of GoT? That was incredibly naive and dumb and he almost died for it if not for his brother saving him! Just like Jon Snow he has too much a good heart and believes people. He believed Shae like he always believed in his sister to not be as evil. This was not out of character, he was ALWAYS like this.

So everyone saying the exact same thing just 'didn't pay enough attention' all these years? OK!

 

[Picao84]

I'm really not going to argue with anyone about bloody GoT!

Spoiler

The reality is that a lot of people felt that what happened was out of character, and you can choose to just disagree or you can choose to try to understand why a lot of us feel that way.

We feel that way because of an obvious narrative gap between the 'hints' that we got here and there, and what happened. Everything worked just right up until she sat there, all scorpions destroyed (even though that was also a bit of a stretch, I'll allow it). But then everything she did after that felt completely out of character, and it's undeniable. The only way to fix that would have been to develop that very, very big jump in characterisation a little bit more.

That's all!

Spoiler

And that's before we get into the other arcs that were rushed to the point of losing all dramatic effect, such as Varys dying (meh), Tyrion going from the cleverest guy in the realm to being pretty stupid, Cersei just standing there the whole season then dying like that, let's not even get into the pointlessness of Jamie's arc...

So everyone saying the exact same thing just 'didn't pay enough attention' all these years? OK!

It's not everyone. Here at my job for example, among 10 people commenting, only two didn't like it. I see plenty of comments on Facebook of people who loved it.

How about your address the actual points I've made instead of going "everyone bla bla bla"?

 

[Picao84]

Spoiler: This, so much this!

https://www.salon.com/2019/05/13/ga...-her-kings-landing-turn-was-very-much-earned/

This is the woman who thrilled to hear Drogo announce he would "take my Khalasar west to where the world ends" to "rape their women, take their children as slaves and bring their broken gods back to Vaes Dothrak."

This is the same woman who swore to the leaders of Qarth that, "when my dragons are grown, we will take back what was stolen from me and destroy those who have wronged me! We will lay waste to armies and burn cities to the ground! "

Daenerys being motivated by a violent desire for vengeance for perceived wrongs against her and a sense of entitlement to the throne is nothing new. Audiences underestimated her cruelty because she's a pretty young woman who has some genuinely decent impulses at times. Instead of lashing out in a Daenerys-like rage, perhaps it's time to ask why it was so easy to ignore all the signs that pointed to this ending.

And hence my friends, this is a perfect allegory of how man like Trump or Bolsonaro can be elected by the masses.

 

[London Geezer]

It's not everyone. Here at my job for example, among 10 people commenting, only two didn't like it. I see plenty of comments on Facebook of people who loved it.

How about your address the actual points I've made instead of going "everyone bla bla bla"?

Actually. I didn't write 'everyone didn't like it'.

I wrote "So everyone saying the exact same thing just 'didn't pay enough attention' all these years?". Meaning that out of all the people that didn't like it, we all just didn't pay enough attention?

I've explained my points several times. You disagree. The end.

 

[Picao84]

Actually. I didn't write 'everyone didn't like it'.

I wrote "So everyone saying the exact same thing just 'didn't pay enough attention' all these years?". Meaning that out of all the people that didn't like it, we all just didn't pay enough attention?

I've explained my points several times. You disagree. The end.

Yes that's exactly what that is and the article above illustrates it perfectly.

I mean, I've honestly expected this from the very beginning. Am I a genius lol? No, I just paid attention. Unlike Jon Snow or Tyrion, I have very good character judgement skills. Probably because I spent my childhood with a crazy insane mother lol.

 

[BRiT]

They should have shown more of those earlier scenes during the "Previously On" segment so people wouldn't have felt it was out of character, even if that would have been too much foreshadowing.

 

[Malo]

It's like people have never watched the rest of GoT. I'm not sure what they expected to happen, a default Hollywood ending?

 

[Bludd]

It's like people have never watched the rest of GoT. I'm not sure what they expected to happen, a default Hollywood ending?

It's just too staccato and too fast at the end here. It's a downhill wrap party at 180 km/h.

Spoiler

the Mad Queen with an atomic bomb and King's Landing/Hiroshima/Nagasaki is powerful, but the show's pacing isn't good.

 

[nutball]

This was always going to happen though, after season six when it was announced that there were only... what fifteen episodes to wrap up everything? At that point it was inevitable that there would be a step-change in the pacing.

 

[eloic]

IMO, Daenerys deeds were in character and it hasn't been a rushed, sudden, unexpected change. That's, I think, the only thing I can concede. But then we have this:

Spoiler

And that's before we get into the other arcs that were rushed to the point of losing all dramatic effect, such as Varys dying (meh), Tyrion going from the cleverest guy in the realm to being pretty stupid, Cersei just standing there the whole season then dying like that, let's not even get into the pointlessness of Jamie's arc...

as well as the other things others and I have mentioned in the last posts.

Too many mistakes in the development of the story. We were used to high quality, so all the gaps and flaws are expected to be received with harsh criticism.

 

[Malo]

It's just too staccato and too fast at the end here. It's a downhill wrap party at 180 km/h.

Agreed, especially this last season. It needed to be finished though. I couldn't begin to imagine how much this show costs to make, especially this final season.

 

[London Geezer]

Yes that's exactly what that is and the article above illustrates it perfectly.

I mean, I've honestly expected this from the very beginning. Am I a genius lol? No, I just paid attention. Unlike Jon Snow or Tyrion, I have very good character judgement skills. Probably because I spent my childhood with a crazy insane mother lol.

It. Was. Rushed.



IN MY HUMBLEST OPINION

 

[BRiT]

It's only feels rushed because you don't have GRRM going on for 6 episodes to advance A Single Day in the kingdom.

 

[London Geezer]

https://media1.tenor.com/images/9c8434854f80ee6335227b180739bd4a/tenor.gif?itemid=11056802