Well, Ubisoft would have to upgrade snowdropSadly ubi titles are now AMD sponsored
not UE. But yea. I think we could see this from Ubisoft soon. Although to see it in 2019, will be unlikely.
Next gen lighting technologies - voxelised, traced, and everything else *spawn*
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not UE. But yea. I think we could see this from Ubisoft soon. Although to see it in 2019, will be unlikely.Like everyone comments on youtube, 'remaster older games like HL2 with RTX'. Just as exciting as new games with RTX. I want Doom 3 with RT, seems a very good fit, the use of the flashlight and many shadows seem intresting with RT. Perhaps the first max payne, half life or even Portal.
DavidGraham
Veteran
Open standards usually mean just console settings that lack any additional visual flair. Or worse, the inclusion of performance slashing DX12 path without any benefit to IQ. Many people like having an option or two that adds additional layer of visual realism on their PC game, even it these options are taxing.
Huh?!? The move from OpenGL / OpenCL to Vulkan gave me a speedup of two! (on both NV and AMD)
If you do it right, it IS faster. Why do you think DXR is exclusive to DX12 / VK?
Criticize the devs if you want, but not the introduction of low level APIs - it was necessary finally.
Further, i don't see how a lack of PC extras (except twice pixels and framerate) is related to 'missing GameWorks' effects, if that's what you intend to say.
DavidGraham
Veteran
I am not criticizing that, Of course it was necessary, but the fact that developers still do them with minimum efforts and end up hurting performance on both NVIDIA and AMD hardware is frustrating. You still have DX12 slashing 20% of Battlefield's performance for nothing. The recent Resident Evil 2 is another example. It seems almost nobody is able to utilize DX12 to improve performance or even image quality. And if not for DXR, DX12 would be a complete and total bust 5 years after it's introduction.
Ha ok Personally i have no idea why it still happens DX12 often ends up slower than 11. Missing experience or compromises to support multiple APIs can longer be an excuse IMO.
An interesting case is the new Hitman game: They dropped DX12 although it was faster for the previous game (on older GPUs it was twice as fast!). Likely cost to maintain both was too high to be worth it for them.
Really frustrating, yes.
Personally i have no idea why it still happens DX12 often ends up slower than 11. Missing experience or compromises to support multiple APIs can longer be an excuse IMO. An interesting case is the new Hitman game: They dropped DX12 although it was faster for the previous game (on older GPUs it was twice as fast!). Likely cost to maintain both was too high to be worth it for them.
Really frustrating, yes.
I wouldn't say dx12 is a complete waste. World of warcraft added a dx12 renderer in its new expansion and in a patch after launch it improved performance even further. The initial implementation was slower on Nvidia hardware for whatever reason so they defaulted to the old dx11 renderer, but amd and Intel defaulted to dx12. With the newest version all default to dx12.
https://www.wowhead.com/news=287727...ations-coming-in-patch-8-1-tides-of-vengeance
https://www.wowhead.com/news=287727...ations-coming-in-patch-8-1-tides-of-vengeance
DX12 continues to have trouble in utilization because DX11 is still largely a big part of the population. Had MS allowed DX12 to be on windows 7, we'd see the gains we're looking for. That being said, on this topic, them locking DXR to DX12 will likely be their last push to get everyone off 7, and to back that up, they would need Xbox 2 to have Ray Tracing as well. If that doesn't move people off windows 7, I'm not sure what will.
More often then not pc versions offer higher settings in almost all areas, aside from higher resolutions (native) and fps improvements. Not talking RT.
About every game DF analysis shows this and the differences can be quite huge, thats versus One X.
Yeah, but i'm one of those who can't spot a difference, other than the fan becoming loud. Five SSAO modes? All of them look like crap, haha. Ultra or medium - game still looks the same to me.
But what would be a 'huge difference' for you? (I'm probably too ignorant myself but i'm interested in perception of others...)
But what would be a 'huge difference' for you? (I'm probably too ignorant myself but i'm interested in perception of others...)
DX12 almost always ends up slower when something is GPU-limited. Obviously, driver writers know how to use barriers much better and there might be a broad range of optimizations applicable to different games (if these are integrated in driver), with DX12, every developer should do these by themselves.
Besides, driver writers simply know new GPUs much better and care about performance on these new GPUs.
For exempel DF's comparison BFV One x vs pc, no RT enabled offcourse.
Quite obvious differences imo, offcourse personal and one might not find this important at all in 64 multiplayer matches but were comparing to the One X here, the most powerfull of the mid-gen upgrades.
You dont only get framerates and resolution upgrades, also higher settings in about all areas. Theres many comparisons on youtube for different titles.
So you say the DX11 advantage often comes from HW vendors work on optimizing unique AAA games? (probably individually for each)
Very interesting - i have not thought this is no longer easy with low level APIs.
Personally i have only low level experience with compute, which is pretty easy in comparison to the complex graphics pipeline.
I have to start work on renderer soon and i am a bit frightened about graphics. I have to admit i would prefer a higher level easy mode here myself.
I'm pretty sure my win from using VK comes from pre-recording command list with indirect dispatches. With older APIs the CPU<->GPU communication was a real performance killer for me it seems.
OpenGL already has indirect dispatch but it is still necessary to do all of them per frame from CPU.
OpenCL1 has no indirect at all so it is necessary to download small data from GPU between dispatches. Terrible, but for unknown reason this was still 2 times faster than GL on NV. (noticed this on GTX4xx - 6xx - so some time ago)
... so i would agree with an easier compromise between low / high level eventually. But i would request the option to write command lists on GPU directly (like NV VK extension, which can't do barriers so i can't use it yet)
Maybe this could bring the best of both: Dev can use device side work generation when tasks are too small and fine grained, vendor can optimize execution of larger big tasks.
Thanks, watched it and... it's the 'minor' stuff i have expected. I really want proper GI and nothing else, so i never care. The only game since years that impressed me at all is that path traced Quake 2. I'm a loud critic about RT HW, but i have to admit... finally real progress after so many years of 'nothing really happens'
Currently however, the only reason i prefer PC for gaming is mouse look. I'm envious about PS4 exclusives - but i could never play a game with a gamepad.
It's interesting however there is so much interest in gaming tech. I wonder how much % of gamers pay attention to this. Probably more than i think.
Thanks, watched it and... it's the 'minor' stuff i have expected. I really want proper GI and nothing else, so i never care. The only game since years that impressed me at all is that path traced Quake 2. I'm a loud critic about RT HW, but i have to admit... finally real progress after so many years of 'nothing really happens'
Without RT, BFV pc on max looks superior to the One X version. You have to have in mind the One X offers the best console experience though. Those differences arent game changing perhaps but they are certainly there for the ones who care
What i wanted to say is there isnt just frame-rate and resolution upgrades to pc versions, often one can have all settings higher. Adding RT the differences are quite game-changing though. Atomic Heart and Metro will soon show some more RT work.Yeah, the only reason for a PS4 for me atleast are its exclusives, which i play once, maybe twice and thats it. Not all exclusives are my taste either, i like HZD but absolutely dont like Spiderman games, so the PS4 isnt used all that much aside from about 10 exclusives in total for its entire lifetime for me, including death stranding and ghost of tsuhima, if they turn out to be something. Remasters in general arent worth it, il have my PS2 or PCSX2 for that, bought those games 15 years ago, i refuse to pay again for the exact same thing
Not necessarily. Only if it's well funded. It costs a lot of money to have your driver teams constantly looking at the next game release and optimizing drivers for what they put in their code.
without getting too off-topic, imo (not meaning to piss off anyone with this commentary) it's one reason why I suspect AMD was a heavy pusher for Vulkan/DX12. They could not keep up against Nvidia's investment in this space, and on the console side developers are already doing it, so I suspect they sought a way to move PC to this space as well and relieve themselves of the burden.
not to mention that of course a lot of code shipped broken and 12/Vulkan was a way to break free from the past.
https://wccftech.com/exnvidia-driver-developer-game-ships-broken/
How can you fix a game by doing more low level work? This dev said the game code had been broken even with high level API, with DX12 / Vulkan, there are 10x more chances to shoot yourself in the foot and this is exactly why DX12 is in a bad state in many games.
That's a good strategy to reverse the situation, now Nvidia struggles with all these low level GCN opts in DX12 (which can decrease performance on nvidia GPUs), neither can it fix these with drivers because API is too low level. No money waste, console devs pay, brilliant!
The devs should know exactly what they need and have the ability to control the cards better. This is theoretically the best situation. All others are suboptimal.
However, they likely don't get the chance because of other reasons. That is where the fault lies.
However, they likely don't get the chance because of other reasons. That is where the fault lies.
I think the idea is that 12/Vulkan was a break away from DX9-11 and whatever legacy items were in there; from that perspective there is benefit. A single API whose behaviours should be properly defined and supported, no weird hacks to get an intended result.
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