Next Generation Hardware Speculation with a Technical Spin [2018]

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Shifty Geezer said:
No. You think people will refuse to buy a next-gen console because a number on the side of the box is less than the number on the side of the box of the console they bought 5+ years earlier? ;)
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What @VitaminB6 suggested is it poses a marketing problem, and it does.

Mainstream-ish and gaming press will definitely demand explanations to console makers as to why there are less cores than the previous generation. And then the same press will have a hard time understanding concepts like IPC.
 
ToTTenTranz said:
What @VitaminB6 suggested is it poses a marketing problem, and it does.

Mainstream-ish and gaming press will definitely demand explanations to console makers as to why there are less cores than the previous generation. And then the same press will have a hard time understanding concepts like IPC.
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I doubt the average consumer even knows they have 8 core CPUs to begin with.

If they’re that worried about it, just use the number of virtual cores with SMT and then only the internet going techies will be up in arms while the average consumer doesn’t care.

That being said, I don’t see a reason to have anything less than 8 cores. A lot of games benefit from more than 4 now, and that will only be more true 5-7 years from now. It’s worth the extra 10-15W. Beyond that, I imagine BC becomes harder if they have to map physical cores to virtual cores.
 
Shifty Geezer said:
No. You think people will refuse to buy a next-gen console because a number on the side of the box is less than the number on the side of the box of the console they bought 5+ years earlier? ;)
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I do think it has some bearing yes. For example if Microsoft were to go with a 8 core Zen light and Sony with a 4 core Zen this could be used in marketing. Will it be a reason for people to refuse to buy a console no.
 
Bethesda’s Pete Hines Knows Something About New Consoles, But Is Not Sure On “How Big A Shift We Can Expect”
September 17, 2018
Speaking with The Telegraph (via Yahoo), Pete Hines revealed that he’s privy to some stuff about new consoles which he cannot talk about, but there’s a lot he’s not sure about, especially on how big the shift will be from the current console generation.
...
He further elaborated, saying that graphics are what made the shift from PS2 and Xbox to PS3 and Xbox 360 feel big, and the same didn’t happen with the shift to PS4 and Xbox One for the average consumer.

I feel like there was a shift from Xbox and PS2 to Xbox 360 and PS3 that was pretty demonstrable. Because we went from the old way to HD and the HD thing was so dramatic. It was night and day. Then you went to Xbox One and PS4 and it wasn’t like ‘woah’. The graphics folks that are super into it can certainly tell, but to the average consumer they were like ok it still looks good. How much of that will change, I don’t know. The rest of it doesn’t matter to me because I’m not drawing art or coding or designing. What really matters is what the developers think. What do they need and what are the kind of power and features they are looking for.
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https://wccftech.com/bethesdas-pete-hines-new-consoles/
 
They can easily market a 4c/8t processor as superior to the current generation. Just slap on "server grade cores", "simultaneous multi threading" and "3.xghz" along with "fastest Eva!!!!" and Joe Public will be sold.

Still betting on a 2 tier launch for at least one of the 2 main players (hope its Sony )
 
Magnum_Force said:
Still betting on a 2 tier launch for at least one of the 2 main players (hope its Sony )
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Same. They've both tested the market with their mid-gen refreshes, and the market is not confused.

-- $350 --
- APU
- 8 core Zen 2 at ~3Ghz
- Navi GPU at ~8TF
- 24GB GDDR6

-- $550 --
- Separate dies
- 8 core Zen 2 at 4.2Ghz
- Navi GPU of double the CU's and a higher clockspeed, for >16TF
- 32GB GDDR6
 
VitaminB6 said:
I agree to some extent but I do see a marketing issue with the next gen console having less cores than the their previous versions. The average consumer is not very tech savvy but they do notice things like "8 core CPU". Personally I think it will be another eight core, but I was just wondering if anyone else thought it would be remotely possible for more CPU cores than last gen.

My line of thinking is that in previous consoles there was more powerful AMD CPU tech available at that time but both Sony and Microsoft went for cheaper lower powered Jaguar's. I think the same trend will continue going forward.
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There wasnt any AMD CPU more powerful manufacturable at TSMC... Big difference.
 
ToTTenTranz said:
What @VitaminB6 suggested is it poses a marketing problem, and it does.
Mainstream-ish and gaming press will definitely demand explanations to console makers as to why there are less cores than the previous generation. And then the same press will have a hard time understanding concepts like IPC.
Click to expand...
VitaminB6 said:
I do think it has some bearing yes. For example if Microsoft were to go with a 8 core Zen light and Sony with a 4 core Zen this could be used in marketing. Will it be a reason for people to refuse to buy a console no.
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If it doesn't affect sales, what's the problem? If console A has more cores but console B has equal or better looking games, no-one's going to look at the numbers. The worst that'll happen is dumb comparison sites with check-list AB comparisons will say, "CPU - console A has twice as many cores as console B", but it'd be nonsense for engineers to design a machine based on scoring highest in a bunch of daft AB tests. They're not aiming to make this... ;)

latest
 
About the Power of the ps5!
Compare gtx 580 to ps4 3 years ,
Then 1080ti to ps5 (2017 -2019)
You get 13tflop. Minimum.
1080ti Will Be weak old carbage compare to ps5! 2080ti can hold crosgen titles.
NEXT gen console have to have 4k and generational graphics leap.
Anthem Will Be native 4k 60fps very high settings (locked 60fps ) half gas!
Crosgen gen - easy to run
Anthem pc demo running dual 1080ti!
 
It will have 8 cores I think, for the sake of marketing and backwards compatibility.
Not actually sure it makes backwards compatible easier but I think I read here somewhere that it does?
 
ToTTenTranz said:
What @VitaminB6 suggested is it poses a marketing problem, and it does.

Mainstream-ish and gaming press will definitely demand explanations to console makers as to why there are less cores than the previous generation. And then the same press will have a hard time understanding concepts like IPC.
Click to expand...
E
msia2k75 said:
There wasnt any AMD CPU more powerful manufacturable at TSMC... Big difference.
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Unless I'm mistaken Steamroller should've been available and manufactured at TSMC.
https://www.extremetech.com/computi...m-kabini-temash-chips-are-being-built-at-tsmc
 
fehu said:
What? A patent for underclocking? :neutral:
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More of a hardware architecture that can operate as a normal device, and then has a mode that can overclock or underclock, change the clock speeds differently between different chip regions, change cache sizes and properties, preempt or invalidate processes on demand, and run and OS capable of doing the same for a game's allocation and active threads. It can make these changes dynamically and automatically, while monitoring for errors.
It's being broad in saying what might be doable, but it's more involved and faster than manually tweaking clock speed. Some elements it can change may not be possible to alter normally, if it involves ratios that are considered fixed in one architecture or the other, or include hardware elements no user is allowed to modify, like the store queue depth of a processor core.

VitaminB6 said:
E

Unless I'm mistaken Steamroller should've been available and manufactured at TSMC.
https://www.extremetech.com/computi...m-kabini-temash-chips-are-being-built-at-tsmc
Click to expand...
I see a diagram saying Kaveri was 28nm, which is the GF node it was manufactured on.
There were GF APU products Wichita and Krishna, but those were detailed as being cat cores.

While not impossible, the number of custom macros for Steamroller was an order of magnitude higher than Jaguar, which would have increased the engineering needed to port the design to TSMC.
There were leaks of an earlier version of the PS4 that used Steamroller, but that isn't what came to pass and rumors were that Sony changed course because the CPU would have used GF's manufacturing process.
 
Number of cores talk feels like the bit wars. Ironically Jaguar is involved in both.

Apple and Intel use fewer bigger cores and beat their competition.
 
In terms of marketing the only people who would even take notice of how many cores a console has, are the ones that would understand that it's not just the amount that matters.

in the early years of the bit wars it may have mattered, not so much now. Consoles doesn't have it on the front of the box.

how many console owners know/care how many cores it has?

the only time it will matter is in the initial reveal, and at that point they just have to say why the choice is good, e.g. So customised that there's nothing like it....! i.e. Added bit more cache.
 
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